Papadakis & Cizeron's Very Candid Interview re Olympics 2018 | Page 6 | Golden Skate

Papadakis & Cizeron's Very Candid Interview re Olympics 2018

TallyT

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Apr 23, 2018
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Australia
talking about the dress is unclassy as it takes away from the brilliant skating their competitors showed that day.

By the logic in this and the previous post, every skater who has boot problems and doesn't fix them immediately if not sooner (never mind if they can't) also shows no desire to win, and is as unclassy for so much as breathing a word of it as they hobble off the ice. Or for discussing an on-ice accident that happened in front of the TV cameras, never mind the blood trickling down their face.

I'm sorry for being snippy, but it isn't as if P/C were coming up with a flimsy (choice of word intended) excuse: they knew and WE knew the dress had malfunctioned, it happened in front of the entire skating world!!! Would you rather they said something like "oh nonono, she never even noticed the extra cold place, it didn't affect her mindset in the slightest being exposed, just a normal day at the office." And yes, it's more than likely they have been asked about it in Every. Single. Interview since (were I a journalist, I'd have to bite my tongue right through NOT to ask)

Pretty much every skater in existence has been asked about, and discussed, the factors that impacted on their less than perfect skates. Especially external factors that the entire audience saw doing it (injuries, ice condition). That's what is expected in interviews. So by your reasoning they are pretty much ALL unclassy, including some of your favourites and mine.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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1. In addressing their feelings about Tessa and Scott being in the rink, Gabriella and Guillaume carefully went back to the beginning of their decision to come to Montreal. If one can read the whole thing with a desire to follow their emotional journey, it all makes sense and is perfectly understandable, from a human point of view.

If one reads to parse every sentiment and sentence, take it out of context, pounce on one bit, and find something wrong, it's always possible to do so.

2. When a skater reveals their emotional journey, it's always a risk, because on the one hand fans want them to be real with their answers, and on the other hand they scream foul when they are. We all know the accusations: "Entitled!" and "Whiny!" and "Unclassy!"

Following is one sentence that has been misconstrued, in my opinion. To prevent its being misconstrued, in my opinion, is exactly why Guillaume clarified what Gaby meant:

[Gabriella: "And then Tessa and Scott came and everything changed."
....
[Guillaume]: "We didn't really know how to deal with this new dynamic. It's nobody's fault, not theirs, not ours. It was simply how it was.
From that moment on, we came here and we were in competition every day. It was a huge emotional burden."

The atmosphere changed for Gaby and Guillaume.

Gabriella then said:
We were used to trusting [our coaches], without thinking really. In the North American mentality, that's not how it works.

Here, Gaby clarified what she'd meant earlier. If we take these three quotes as the whole story, so to speak, it means something very different than if we take the first short sentence without the context.

Thank you very much, Gotlev, for providing this translation of this wonderful interview! I enjoyed it very much.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
How happy was Evgenia Medvedeva when she saw her silver medal scores after skating her best at the 2018 Olympics, with two flawless programs?

That's not the same thing, though. Skating your best and being beaten by someone with more technical firepower and thus coming second is much different than having an accident that ends up compromising your chance at gold. Same thing goes with Kwan in 1998 - she did everything she could to win gold, but Lipinski had the technical edge... so (hopefully!) she's come to terms with the fact that she still did pretty much her best, but somebody was better. Of course Medvedeva is understandably disappointed that she came in second, but the judges couldn't give it to her even if they wanted to given how Zagitova skated --- but worse would have been for Med's skate to come undone or something that normally doesn't happen, placing 2nd anyways because you're putatively fighting for gold and everyone else is trying for bronze, and then wondering what could have been. No athlete wants to win having underperformed but being better than others who also underperformed - they're okay with the win and the hardware, but at the end of the day, athletes perform at their absolute best and then the cards lie where they lie.

As far as P/C coming 2nd, it's not like V/M didn't have to skate lights out in order to get the gold (they needed a personal/season's best IIRC). They were massively ahead even with the SD error, and TBH it shouldn't have even been that close.

If V/M weren't competing and P/C won the gold, I still don't think P/C could say their Olympic experience wasn't traumatic to some extent. Of course, losing the gold makes a terrible instance that much more horrifying, but the bottom line is, P/C weren't at their best. Which had nothing to do with V/M or their coaches, and everything to do with a clasp and bad timing.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
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… If one reads to parse every sentiment and sentence, take it out of context, pounce on one bit, and find something wrong, it's always possible to do so. ...

Seems to me that you have omitted some context and have parsed and extrapolated when explaining your own opinion/interpretation in support of P/C.

As is true with many topics, reasonable people can have differing opinions. I think that is what is happening in this thread.
 

Tavi...

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Feb 10, 2014

Yeah, I disagree as to Evgenia. The “technical firepower” argument might make sense if we were talking a huge gap in base value (for example, Nathan versus Jason) but the technical gap between Evgenia and Alina was only a few points, and it wasn’t because Alina was doing triple axels or quad lutzes.

I also think you’re forgetting that in 2017-2018, Evgenia was the reigning World Champion, and until she was injured, she was pretty much expected to take gold at the Olympics - after all, she had won pretty much everything in sight in the prior two years. JMO, but I would imagine that her reaction had a lot to do with her injury and subsequent withdrawal from the GPF and Russian Nationals, which not only impacted her own training but opened the door for Alina, whose PCS and GOE suddenly skyrocketed.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Seems to me that you have omitted some context and have parsed and extrapolated when explaining your own opinion/interpretation in support of P/C.

As is true with many topics, reasonable people can have differing opinions. I think that is what is happening in this thread.

It seems to me that the six pages of this thread are full of opinions and omissions and extrapolations assuming the worst about what Papadakis and Cizeron said. I tried to assume the best motivation from them and offered an alternate interpretation of their words. Of course, as always, reasonable people have differing opinions.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
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It seems to me that the six pages of this thread are full of opinions and omissions and extrapolations assuming the worst about what Papadakis and Cizeron said. I tried to assume the best motivation from them and offered an alternate interpretation of their words. Of course, as always, reasonable people have differing opinions.

I have not gone back to re-read the entire thread, but my recollection is that if anything, the thread is "full" of opinions that are supportive of P/C's comments in the interview. By which I mean that supportive opinions easily have outnumbered opinions that are critical of P/C's comments in the interview. IIRC.
In other words, I believe that you are hardly alone (and hardly in the minority) in assuming the best motivation from P/C.

One thing that is clear to me from the thread is that different parts of the interview seem to speak more "loudly" to different people -- no matter whether their opinions are supportive of the interview or not.
For example: some people have focused on how athletes feel about a silver medal; other people have focused on the wardrobe malfunction; other people have focused on the coaches; etc.

Given the length of the interview, it seems only natural to me that people are selective as to which parts of the interview they are quoting/discussing/parsing/emphasizing -- no matter whether their opinions are supportive of the interview or not.
 

skateluvr

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Oct 23, 2011
This is truly sour grapes. But Tessa and Scott were totally pissed off at Zoueva when they got second. I’m glad they did because it was a thrill to see them come back and skate so well. I love both teams. If you want to see classy behavior check out how Orser dealth with two silvers losing to Scott Hamilton and Boitano. The Battle was great. I preferred Orser then but hey America was a bigger power then in FS. Brian took it very hard but no bitter interviews to the press. Also Roz Sumner losing to Witt made her really sad for a decade. Yet she and Witt became great friends. To say that they believed in a possible conspiracy theory (almost) and it’s nobodys and everyone’s fault! Wow. Double speak. I have never seen a more ungrateful Oly Podium winner than them. I love their skating but really wouldn’t want to hang out. As for the dress it didn’t matter because she skated great and I didn’t even notice any mistakes. She could have stopped. And maybe restarted. She chose not to. I think the winners had great programs and were seasoned Oly vets who had an edge going in. It is a sport. Since when is an Oly silver medal a tragedy? They are young and very insulated from real life. They live in a rink. Years from now they will say this loss spurred them on to another four years at least of great skating.

I don’t know how talented and MF and patch but they do great things with every team. The problem I see going forward for the French is they are not versatile. I think this is what other teams do better at. But for the style they skate in, they are untouchable. People will remember their LP in Korea a long time. And they will also remember Moulin Rouge. Fantastic rivalry for us fans. And that is sports.
 

TallyT

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Apr 23, 2018
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Australia
Apart from the obvious interpretation biases scattered through this thread (pretty much everyone is reading into the words what they want - or want to ascribe - me and all, even with no real leaning either way in the ice dance podium) what is fascinating is the cultural differences in how people actually read.

I repeat the words milky-white and silky-smooth. Honestly, if they had been Australians, they could well have been called wusses for not saying point-blank They Wuz Robbed....
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
That's not the same thing, though. Skating your best and being beaten by someone with more technical firepower and thus coming second is much different than having an accident that ends up compromising your chance at gold. Same thing goes with Kwan in 1998 - she did everything she could to win gold, but Lipinski had the technical edge... so (hopefully!) she's come to terms with the fact that she still did pretty much her best, but somebody was better. Of course Medvedeva is understandably disappointed that she came in second, but the judges couldn't give it to her even if they wanted to given how Zagitova skated --- but worse would have been for Med's skate to come undone or something that normally doesn't happen, placing 2nd anyways because you're putatively fighting for gold and everyone else is trying for bronze, and then wondering what could have been. No athlete wants to win having underperformed but being better than others who also underperformed - they're okay with the win and the hardware, but at the end of the day, athletes perform at their absolute best and then the cards lie where they lie.

As far as P/C coming 2nd, it's not like V/M didn't have to skate lights out in order to get the gold (they needed a personal/season's best IIRC). They were massively ahead even with the SD error, and TBH it shouldn't have even been that close.

If V/M weren't competing and P/C won the gold, I still don't think P/C could say their Olympic experience wasn't traumatic to some extent. Of course, losing the gold makes a terrible instance that much more horrifying, but the bottom line is, P/C weren't at their best. Which had nothing to do with V/M or their coaches, and everything to do with a clasp and bad timing.

Even without the dress incident Virtue and Moir should have been ahead by a lot - in other words they were marked too low in the SD or PC too high. compared to 2014 Davis and White should have had a smaller lead over V and M - I have no difficulty with V and M winning in 2018.
 

Skater Boy

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Feb 24, 2012
Umm, shall we not jinx them? My bedtime reading sometimes is the archives and the number of absolutely-can't-lose-that-gold predictions which appear to have caught the eye of Nemesis is both sad and funny...
The judges love PC for years unless they fall out of fashion they will win gold.
 

TallyT

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Apr 23, 2018
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Australia
The judges love PC for years unless they fall out of fashion they will win gold.

People said that about Patrick Chan (and I am not being snarky, even though I love Yuzu and am thrilled he won, Patrick's eyes in the flower ceremony at Sochi haunt me). It's still a loooong way to Beijing, I wince every time I see "so and so will win!!!"
 

believed

On the Ice
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Apr 20, 2018
People said that about Patrick Chan (and I am not being snarky, even though I love Yuzu and am thrilled he won, Patrick's eyes in the flower ceremony at Sochi haunt me). It's still a loooong way to Beijing, I wince every time I see "so and so will win!!!"

To be fair, there’s more unpredictability in singles.
 

Harriet

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Oct 23, 2017
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Australia
I repeat the words milky-white and silky-smooth. Honestly, if they had been Australians, they could well have been called wusses for not saying point-blank They Wuz Robbed....

I wish our (male) cricketers could manage this combination of honesty and dignity in interviews.
 

Noxchild

Medalist
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Feb 14, 2018
Country
Canada
Count me for one who thinks P/C come off very frank, honest, and gracious in this interview. IDK man maybe it's just the translation, but I'm not sure how one can dislike or resent them for being candid like this. And I prefer V/M's skating!
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
People said that about Patrick Chan (and I am not being snarky, even though I love Yuzu and am thrilled he won, Patrick's eyes in the flower ceremony at Sochi haunt me). It's still a loooong way to Beijing, I wince every time I see "so and so will win!!!"

Well Patrick I first of all don't think was loved as much as PC. PC are also in an event where reputation and a lot more room to boost your favorite. And Chan had a lot of competition unlike PC. I was happy or fine with Hanyu winning but I am not sure Hanyu "deserves" - a term that needs defining lol two oly gold. SO many good ones. Deserve means a lot of different things. Deserve as on the day of the event. Deserve as in a body of work. Deserve as a result of personal hardships, hardwork and struggles. Deserve asa point of view. PC in my opinion has gotten more than enough support. I realize many like them just like they like Davis and White but there is much to argue that they have been gifted much. My notion is hey they don't deserve a gold medal more than say Patrick Chan so I am fine if they don't get gold. I just think they seem destined to get gold desrved or not. Some may feel for example Virtue and Moir should have had gold in Sochi over D and W. Deserved is such a loaded word. But regardless with such devoted and vocal fans PC will always be remembered favorably gold silver or not.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
That's not the same thing, though. Skating your best and being beaten by someone with more technical firepower and thus coming second is much different than having an accident that ends up compromising your chance at gold.

Gosh, I don't know which is worse. If you are simply not as good as the other guys, how does that make you feel? (Especially when you believe that you are the best.)

At least when you lose by a fluke you can always blame the Fates or whomever. You can take consolation in "stuff happens" rather than, "Aagh! I'm not good enough."
 
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Joined
Jun 21, 2003
... would anyone say they didn't deserve the gold and actually decline it???)

There is a persistent figure skating legend -- probably apocryphal -- that Ulrich Salchow was so impressed with the performance of Madge Syers at the 1902 World Championships that he gallantly offered her his gold medal.
 
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