2019 Japan Open: Thoughts and Highlights | Page 3 | Golden Skate

2019 Japan Open: Thoughts and Highlights

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
I think Bradie was quite different in her style at JO.
She's usually quite stiff in her arms and movements in general (I actually kinda liked that too hehe), but she had such flowy and beautiful arms at JO (IMO!), there was some fluidity in her movement that wasn't there before and I think whoever she worked with on her arms, that person did wonders!
Her PCS should improve this season, as her progress in the way she performs is just something one cannot ignore!
It was so unusual to see Bradie like this, and I greatly appreciate her determination as an athlete to work on herself. I don't think she was viewed as a performer before, that was kind of more about Mariah, but Bradie is really bringing it this season! And, her jumps were beautiful too.
 

Mishaminion

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 12, 2014
Much of that depends on how you define "boring." What may be exciting to you may be the death knell of my attention span.

True, we all have different preferences.
I've always tended to prefer the more athletic skaters to be fair, Midori Ito and Tonya Harding were my favourites as a child.
I think Satoko Miyahara is wonderfully artistic and agree with a lot of people who think she deserves higher PCS, but still find her somewhat boring to watch at times, because of her tiny and not very good jumps I guess.
 

cell

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 11, 2006
I think Bradie was quite different in her style at JO.
She's usually quite stiff in her arms and movements in general (I actually kinda liked that too hehe), but she had such flowy and beautiful arms at JO (IMO!), there was some fluidity in her movement that wasn't there before and I think whoever she worked with on her arms, that person did wonders!
Her PCS should improve this season, as her progress in the way she performs is just something one cannot ignore!
It was so unusual to see Bradie like this, and I greatly appreciate her determination as an athlete to work on herself. I don't think she was viewed as a performer before, that was kind of more about Mariah, but Bradie is really bringing it this season! And, her jumps were beautiful too.

I was shocked at how much improvement in her upper body there was.. there is no more stiffness and her movements are much softer now
 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Could you please write which men skaters do you mean? As I took last EC results and what I see: Samarin, Rizzo and Brezina got invitation to Shanghai (where Brezina scored lower than Javi and Deniss, by the way). Kolyada is ill (and got the invitation to Shanghai as well). Grassl is still in a junior circuit so no invitation for him. Bychenko, Samohin and Kvitelashvili got lower scores than Deniss this season. Aliev was weak last season and didn't show internationally so no invitation for him. The only men who could get the invitation and is really strong is Kevin Aymoz. But he peaked only last season so JO organizers must recognize him. Hope to see him as Team Europe next time.

I am not sure about health situation of men skaters as of today but anyone from the list would make more sense to me than Denis:

Rizzo, Grassl, Brezina, Aymoz, Samarin, Aliev, Kolyada, Moris, and even Lazukin.

I know that he has a lot of fans, but...
 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
That sounds reasonable to me. However, on the basis of this paradigm, any talk about the greatness of PSCs for any skater becomes meaningless, because the main argument in such conversations is that this is a "universal opinion" and "" many people think so "" devalues it .

There are new arguments like "tasteless" now.
 

1111bm

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 31, 2016
I don't understand the question. Shoma is from Japan. This was a Japanese event. The natural tendency would be for the judges to protect Shoma. What does the USA have to do with it?

That’s because this wasn’t an actual, sincere question, only a rhetorical one. ;) Anyways, I’m sorry if I mislead you.
(And I did already address the fact that Shoma is japanese and JO is a japanese event, and how that might play a role, in my post)


Speaking of Shoma, I was very underwhelmed by his FS. The skating and delivery of it was of the same high quality that we’re used to seeing from him and if I didn’t know his old material I’d be impressed with that, although I still might find the program too uneventful for my taste.

But since he declared that this season is devoted to changing things up, going out of his comfort zone and finding his own style, that is pretty disappointing. I expected to see him experiment a little with his programs.
These are basically the same old, recycled moves from past seasons, set to a modern pop song, giving off the false impression that we’re getting something new from him.
I don’t expect anything revolutionary from him, but I wish Wilson had given him a few new gestures at least or a few details that I would not expect.
At least his SP has a different vibe to it, so that is something to look forward to.
 

icetug

Medalist
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
I am not sure about health situation of men skaters as of today but anyone from the list would make more sense to me than Denis:

Rizzo, Grassl, Brezina, Aymoz, Samarin, Aliev, Kolyada, Moris, and even Lazukin.

I know that he has a lot of fans, but...

Have you read my post? It explains why none of your list could accept/get the invitation :rolleye:. To enlighten you: Shanghai Trophy took place in the exact dates as JO. And I quite understand why Samarin and Kolyada chose Shanghai (if they were invited to JO as well) ;)
And you don't need to be a fan to understand that nobody reasonable enough expects a lion to be a cheetah... :laugh:
 

Decoder

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 5, 2019
Have you read my post? It explains why none of your list could accept/get the invitation :rolleye:. To enlighten you: Shanghai Trophy took place in the exact dates as JO. And I quite understand why Samarin and Kolyada chose Shanghai (if they were invited to JO as well) ;)
And you don't need to be a fan to understand that nobody reasonable enough expects a lion to be a cheetah... :laugh:

To me, Javi and Denis were lucky to be in the same team with Alina and Sasha, and you are also right - every point counts. I thought samkrut's first post was just a light-hearted statement, and I guess he liked the whole team. I like Denis - he looked like the son of one of my friends.
BTW, I browsed some Chinese forums and most fans thought of JO as a more serious event - being invited to JO was considered a privilege. For the Shanghai event, per one forum, a lot of tickets were given out for free, which sounds strange.
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
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Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Country
United-States
The competition has the same value for the fan as it has always had, namely the chance to see new programs of some pretty good skaters.

The programs aren't refined, they're not really ready for prime time, but it's fun to get a sneak peek of the year ahead.

It also has the same value for skaters that it has always had. It is an opportunity to have some fun with friends in a "noncompetitive" environment, cash in on some easy money, and throw some love to loyal Japanese fans.

I like the first half of Nathan's program, and I do not like the second half. I appreciate that he's taking on new artistic challenges, but the hip hop is a miss for me. At least so far. We'll see how it develops.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Trusova's technical ability is simply astounding. Her programs don't really make me feel much from a performance/artistic standpoint, but honestly, I personally don't care when she can reel off that type of content, and she will mature artistically with time. Crazy to think she almost cleared 100 TES (which I imagine she will do at some point this season). And also crazy that other than Nathan's FS, she's had the highest TES of anyone this season (from here and Nepela where I think she was a bit higher). Zagitova was also very impressive so early in the season, but the program needs more expression and finesse in her movements, but what a start for her so far!

The first part of Nathan's free program is a bit muted for me, but it does build and I love personality and charisma in the second part. Great vehicle for him this season and already the quads are looking good (that second quad toe was practically clinical). Weird blips on the 4T+Eu+1F and waxel at the end though, but strong start nevertheless, and posting an ISU season's best FS so far! And he's putting more transitions in and out of his jumps (obviously some people will still say he has no transitions but whatevs).
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I think Bradie was quite different in her style at JO.

She's usually quite stiff in her arms and movements in general (I actually kinda liked that too hehe)...

Me, too! She had a no nonsense slam-bam-thank-you-ma'am vibe going for her.

Anyway, looking forward to this season's edition. :yes:
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
It also has the same value for skaters that it has always had. It is an opportunity to have some fun with friends in a "noncompetitive" environment, cash in on some easy money, and throw some love to loyal Japanese fans.

It also gave Alexandra Trusova the opportunity to say to the world of ladies figure skating, "I got four quads -- whatchu got?" " :laugh:

Like Alysa Liu at the Aurora show: "Wanna see a triple Axel? Wanna see another one? Wanna see a quad Lutz?"

And actually, the Japan Open is quite a respectable competiition and a prestigious invitation. :yes:
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
It also gave Alexandra Trusova the opportunity to say to the world of ladies figure skating, "I got four quads -- whatchu got?" " :laugh:

Like Alysa Liu at the Aurora show: "Wanna see a triple Axel? Wanna see another one? Wanna see a quad Lutz?"

And actually, the Japan Open is quite a respectable competiition and a prestigious invitation. :yes:

Packed house, so probably a great commercial success too. And no Russian TV station had any official broadcasting rights pre-booked. All relied on the same illegal re-streams all of us watched as well. Would still very much like to be to watch the whole event in unadulterated by streaming banners form in HD.
 
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Nathan...I think his components are actually close to about right, if Yuzuru gets 95 PCS, Nathan on 91 is fair. His choreo and step sequences actually aren't that bad; it's just his jump prep, which is getting faster btw. And his jump consistency; he's becoming a delight to watch.

Except Yuzuru is getting 89, so following your logic Nathan should be 85 :biggrin:

P.S. Not a serious post obviously, just joking :)
 

ssffww

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 30, 2015
If I ever popped into this forum and saw a post praising the judging, I might have a heart attack. It's the same whining every event. But, no one ever agrees on the focus of the whine.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
If I ever popped into this forum and saw a post praising the judging, I might have a heart attack. It's the same whining every event. But, no one ever agrees on the focus of the whine.

I've watched three JGPs this season, in whole or mostly part, and the judging has been pretty spot on so far. You might quibble about some of the points here and there on PCS/GOE but the placements have been pretty much spot on.

ssfww? ssffww? You ok? I think ssffww fainted!

;)
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
I don't see why Alina deserves 74 PCS. I really don't. More than 5 points better than either Rika or Satoko? And her GOEs are far too inflated compared to the rest of the field.

Nathan...I think his components are actually close to about right, if Yuzuru gets 95 PCS, Nathan on 91 is fair. His choreo and step sequences actually aren't that bad; it's just his jump prep, which is getting faster btw. And his jump consistency; he's becoming a delight to watch.

I agree with you about Zagitova being generously scored here. The program still needs work and 74 PCS is essentially saying there's not much you need to work on (especially when she gets 10's for choreography and interpretation for a new program).

Nathan getting 91.16 was fine for that program (maybe a tad high, but still 90)... there's still a lot of improvement that can happen on the front end of that program, but it's apparent that he's increased the difficulty of the transitional content, and this program has lots of potential. While typically, Hanyu gets/deserves higher PCS than Chen, if we're comparing initial performances to start the season I thought Chen's freeskate performance here was superior to Hanyu's at Autumn Classic (both in content, interpretation, and jump difficulty/execution). Although, really, I prefer Aymoz's program in terms of choreography, interpretation and performance to either of Chen or Hanyu, at this point, even if he doesn't have the same skating skills, speed or difficulty.

Regarding PCS, it isn't so cut and dry where it's like "If skater A gets X number of points, skater B should get (X + 5) or (X - 8) points"; it depends on the actual execution of the program, difficulty attempted, etc. In an ideal world, a judge shouldn't go into a competition with a pre-conceived notion as to how their score a skater and will assess each skater as an absolute. It's a bit silly to ascribe a PCS advantage or disadvantage based on a previous competition, when the programs change and the execution of it can vary from competition to competition.
 

Mishaminion

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 12, 2014
If I ever popped into this forum and saw a post praising the judging, I might have a heart attack. It's the same whining every event. But, no one ever agrees on the focus of the whine.


I'm not usually a complainer, for some reason I made an exception.
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
My highlight is the moment i realized that Shangai Trophy should become a CS and Japan Open stay a joke.
 

Clairecz

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
Country
Czech-Republic
With all the talk about who should be grateful to whom and who should have been invited instead I just want to point out a few facts.
As icetug has already stated for god's sake it's a TEAM event. The scores are combined. Sasha had the highest score from team Europe. And so what? In 2017 it was Javi who won the men's part and beat Nathan by almost 10 points so I guess we should have said that only thanks to Javi team Europe won?! I repeat it's a team event. Everyone does their part.

I also want to remind you that it's a PRO/am competition, (though Japan had all four currently competing skaters). Sometimes the retired skater scores their personal best (had it been an ISU sanctioned event) like Nobu, sometimes it's not their day, like Jeremy Abbott's in 2017. And it's understandable that the retired skaters' TES is lower, like Florent Amodio's in 2016 after his retirement. It's normal.
And you can't say that Javi didn't prepare. He trained for JO at TCC, had been training there for two weeks, he went for a quad but tripled it... And in the end he got only 4 points less than last year when he partly counted among active skaters, just saying ;)

I'd love to see Matteo there (especially with his big bro Javi) but Deniss is much more known in Japan, has done summer shows there, also logistically it's probably easier to invite Deniss, Koshiro plus Stéphane as a guest skater. And I hope that if Matteo remains consistens and will have good exhibition programs they'll notice him also in Japan.
Though US skaters are entirely capable of representing the whole North America :rolleye: (it's not their fault, it's the organizers strange choice), in the entire history of JO it has happened only once that more than two skaters from Russia were invited in the same year (2011) and since 2013 the tradition is two Russian ladies, Javi and a man from Europe :biggrin:
Plus without Misha K., Russian men (Lazukin, Samarin) are imo not that interesting for JO organizers.

I loved seeing Javi skating again. I took it very seriously, painted my nails in Spanish colours for good luck, woke up at 4 in the morning to search the entire Twitter for news... ;) (because how many similar possibilities I'll have, sigh)

I also liked Nathan's program. It's a breath of fresh air. It's fun, he's enjoying it, the audience is enjoying it.

Still don't understand Deniss' program very much but his spins! :luv17:
 
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