I have a feeling Stephane Lambiel could be the golden boy next year! | Page 4 | Golden Skate

I have a feeling Stephane Lambiel could be the golden boy next year!

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Buttle's problem is that his 3A is only 50% reliable. He rarely lands both a solo 3A and a 3A combination in his FS--he usually falls on one of them. Adding a 50% reliable quad reduces Jeff's chances of nailing a clean FS considerably.
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
chuckm said:
The problem Lambiel will have in skating a clean competition is that his money jumps other than the quad (lutz, 3A) are inconsistent. Weir is a very consistent jumper and he rarely misses a 3A or 3Z, so IMHO, he has just as much chance of landing a clean quad as Lambiel has of skating a clean FS.

I have seen Weir skate a clean FS (NHK), but I have never seen Lambiel do the same thing.

Weren't Lambiels long programs in the qualifying of Worlds(where the same skate that earned him a 153 in qualies likely would be more in the 160 range in the long), as well as the long of the 2004 Worlds clean?
 

BittyBug

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 22, 2004
Joesitz said:
How badly the knee is and if he intends to have surgery is still the most important question about his future. And still no one seems to know anything about this.
Last season there were some pictures on one of his web sites of Plushenko meeting with an orthopedic surgeon about his knee. I think at the time they were talking about some type of arthroscopic surgery, but I haven't heard anything further.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
BittyBug said:
Last season there were some pictures on one of his web sites of Plushenko meeting with an orthopedic surgeon about his knee. I think at the time they were talking about some type of arthroscopic surgery, but I haven't heard anything further.
BittyBug - Exactly. I think it is too late for arthroscopic surgery, if that indeed, is what he needs. I think he will be skating Olys according to Mishin's advice., not the doctor's advice.

Lambiel suffered for years with the pain and sudden weaknesses that one gets with a problematic cartilege in the knee. He finally got the surgery and the rest is history.

As I say, it think it is too later for Evgeni to have the surgery. Let's hope he can keep it in check through the Olys.

Joe
 

hockeyfan228

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
slutskayafan21 said:
Weren't Lambiels long programs in the qualifying of Worlds(where the same skate that earned him a 153 in qualies likely would be more in the 160 range in the long), as well as the long of the 2004 Worlds clean?
Lambiel was "clean" in the 2004 LP if "clean" means he didn't fall, but he turned out of the 4T before completing the 3T, had some tilted and tight landings on several other jumps, and traveled on one or two of his spins, most noticeably in the "headless" scratch spin. In the Moscow qualis, he had a faulty 3F, for which he received -GOE, and he had tilted landings on a few other jumps, for which he received base score instead of +GOE, as well as a spin for which he received base score. His footwork sequences got base (SL) and .10 (circ).

I think his jumps and his presentation were stronger in his Moscow quali skate than in his 2004 Worlds LP, even if I thought the 2004 LP program was a better program choreographically and musically. The best program I've seen him do live was the Dortmund quali, where he used his 2003 program (Chocolat ?).

160 would have been conceivable in the LP if he were able to get +GOE on the elements where he got -GOE or base, and I'm sure that this would have translated into tenths in the PCS scores. However, I think the point is that he hasn't skated a LP and landed his "lesser" jumps as cleanly or as consistently as he would like, and he's giving up the precious points that will be critical to competing with Plushenko.

That said, his 3A has improved markedly this year, though, and I think with a full season of practice without injury leading up to the Olympics, he can clean up the rest. He also has one real "nerves" situation under his belt -- the gold medal was his to lose in Moscow -- coming into the LP as the favorite. And while year's podium was a long shot for him because he fell in the SP, a nemesis for him, he delivered a great SP in Moscow.
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
hockeyfan228 said:
Lambiel was "clean" in the 2004 LP if "clean" means he didn't fall, but he turned out of the 4T before completing the 3T, had some tilted and tight landings on several other jumps, and traveled on one or two of his spins, most noticeably in the "headless" scratch spin. In the Moscow qualis, he had a faulty 3F, for which he received -GOE, and he had tilted landings on a few other jumps, for which he received base score instead of +GOE, as well as a spin for which he received base score. His footwork sequences got base (SL) and .10 (circ).

I think his jumps and his presentation were stronger in his Moscow quali skate than in his 2004 Worlds LP, even if I thought the 2004 LP program was a better program choreographically and musically. The best program I've seen him do live was the Dortmund quali, where he used his 2003 program (Chocolat ?).

160 would have been conceivable in the LP if he were able to get +GOE on the elements where he got -GOE or base, and I'm sure that this would have translated into tenths in the PCS scores. However, I think the point is that he hasn't skated a LP and landed his "lesser" jumps as cleanly or as consistently as he would like, and he's giving up the precious points that will be critical to competing with Plushenko.

That said, his 3A has improved markedly this year, though, and I think with a full season of practice without injury leading up to the Olympics, he can clean up the rest. He also has one real "nerves" situation under his belt -- the gold medal was his to lose in Moscow -- coming into the LP as the favorite. And while year's podium was a long shot for him because he fell in the SP, a nemesis for him, he delivered a great SP in Moscow.


I agree with everything you said. He has skated clean programs as far completing each element, but still giving away minor things with low landings,
crooked form on something, little wobbles, etc....

In the short at Worlds he did the same thing on two jumps. His triple axel was done well. His quad had a low landing, crouched, with almost a hand won; his triple lutz his leg was dragging along the ice for awhile. He could have scored 84+ like Plushy did at the GP final without these problems.

I hope he can be fully healthy for a full year, which he wasnt in 2004 and 2005, so he can iron out these reoccuring kinks on some of his elements.
 

brad640

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 8, 2004
hockeyfan228 said:
The best program I've seen him do live was the Dortmund quali, where he used his 2003 program (Chocolat ?).

Right you are, hockeyfan! Chocolat is starting to become legendary as the first time Stephane showed he the potential to be the best in the world. Here is a link if anyone wants to download the 2003 worlds QR performance from Asian television:

http://s7.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2E1C1LBLRODC43400Z85U01JYL

Stephane skated clean with a 4-3, one 3a, and his typical low landings on the other triples. The thing that impressed me the most this year was how much he improved between Euros and worlds by upgrading the spins and changing to a completely different LP.
 

emma

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
Thanks for that link...what a great skate!!!!! So...forgive the dumb question, but how die Stephane do in the rest of the 2003 worlds event...I remember Plushy won and Tim got silver then, right? I am totally blanking on the rest.
 

brad640

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 8, 2004
In 2003 he finished 10th, 3rd in his QR behind Plush and Goebel, 16th in the SP, 10th in the long. You can see the results here
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
brad640 said:
In 2003 he finished 10th, 3rd in his QR behind Plush and Goebel, 16th in the SP, 10th in the long. You can see the results here
That was when he was skating 2 sessions of 2 hours each and a five hour drive for the coaching. It was also the beginning of the knee problems.

Joe
 

nicole_l

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
And in QR A?
1. Weiss
2. Honda
3. Jahnke

Wow, he has some serious potential. Get consistent before you retire, Ryan! Please! Here's how he did in Washington: third in QR A, 9th in the short, 18th in the long to finish 13th overall.
 

emma

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
brad640 said:
In 2003 he finished 10th, 3rd in his QR behind Plush and Goebel, 16th in the SP, 10th in the long. You can see the results here

Thanks! I think I'm just busy and stressed...I looked at the results and still couldn't remember that competition, even though I KNOW I watched it.

Anway, I too hope we get to see many more great programs from Lambiel (and all those other great guys too...Plushy may his injuries not deter him, Weir, Buttle, Sandu, Li and others who I'm sure to be forgetting at the moment)
 

shine

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
brad640 said:
Right you are, hockeyfan! Chocolat is starting to become legendary as the first time Stephane showed he the potential to be the best in the world. Here is a link if anyone wants to download the 2003 worlds QR performance from Asian television:

http://s7.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2E1C1LBLRODC43400Z85U01JYL

Stephane skated clean with a 4-3, one 3a, and his typical low landings on the other triples. The thing that impressed me the most this year was how much he improved between Euros and worlds by upgrading the spins and changing to a completely different LP.
That QR at 2003 Worlds was sensational. He was just so smooooth and lively. Chocolat is one of my all time favourite programs... The music, the choreography, and Lambiel skating to it--everyting about it is a just little magical, and I was an immediate fan. I still can't believe the judges had Goebel ahead of him--IMO he could have won the QR with that skate. I can only hope Stephane will live up to his "long program potential" next year.
And while we are at it, here's Lambiel's rocking SP from the 2002 season which probably most of us missed (again from Japanese TV--how great are they?)
http://s17.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1RS0BMNAQ1C662VRTG23JHA71V
 
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brad640

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 8, 2004
shine said:
And while we are at it, here's Lambiel's rocking SP from the 2002 season which probably most of us missed (again from Japanese TV--how great are they?)
http://s17.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1RS0BMNAQ1C662VRTG23JHA71V

Stephane does a tango! Thanks shine for posting that SP. I had never seen it before. And I agree that Stephane wuzrobbed by Goebel in the 03 QR. Why is Goebel always wuzrobbing someone of something? Why?! :mad:

nicole_l said:
Wow, he has some serious potential. Get consistent before you retire, Ryan! Please!

Thinking about Jahnke's unrealized potential is so frustrating! I don't see any way for him to make the Olympics, but I would love to see him skate clean at nationals and maybe go to 06 worlds when someone backs out.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
It's not just goeble robbing Stephane. stephane wuzrobbed constantly. He should have beaten Joubert when they first came on the scene in Euros; he should have beaten Lindemann in Dortmund, Just my opinions, though.

But then again, he's been absent so much for injuries that no one took him seriously. Maybe things will change. Hope so.

Joe
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
You also have to wonder if his legs will hold out. He's only 19 and has already had two knee surgeries. Practicing jumps, especially quads and 3As, can be rough on the body. Look at Plushy--he's only 22 and has a chronic knee problem, a bad back, and has had to have two hernias repaired.
 

soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
chuckm said:
You also have to wonder if his legs will hold out. He's only 19 and has already had two knee surgeries. Practicing jumps, especially quads and 3As, can be rough on the body. Look at Plushy--he's only 22 and has a chronic knee problem, a bad back, and has had to have two hernias repaired.

However Lambiel took time to take care of his injuries verses Plush who kept on skating despite the injuries. I think Lambiel's (and Klimkin's) body will hold up fine for the Olympic season.
 

icedancer2

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 22, 2004
shine said:
That QR at 2003 Worlds was sensational. He was just so smooooth and lively. Chocolat is one of my all time favourite programs... The music, the choreography, and Lambiel skating to it--everyting about it is a just little magical, and I was an immediate fan. I still can't believe the judges had Goebel ahead of him--IMO he could have won the QR with that skate. I can only hope Stephane will live up to his "long program potential" next year.
And while we are at it, here's Lambiel's rocking SP from the 2002 season which probably most of us missed (again from Japanese TV--how great are they?)
http://s17.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1RS0BMNAQ1C662VRTG23JHA71V

Thanks for posting this -- I just LOVE this guy's music choices throughout his career and his musicality as well. I hope he continues to do well!
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Joesitz said:
It's not just goeble robbing Stephane. stephane wuzrobbed constantly. He should have beaten Joubert when they first came on the scene in Euros; he should have beaten Lindemann in Dortmund, Just my opinions, though.

But then again, he's been absent so much for injuries that no one took him seriously. Maybe things will change. Hope so.

Joe

I agree with you. He was undermarked at both the Europeans in 2002 and 2003, where Joubert received such inflated scoring. At the 2004 Worlds he should have won his qualifying round, but was placed below a cautious Sandhu with a fall, and Joubert who took some elements out, he deserved 6th in the short where he fell, but should have been 2nd in the free behind Plushenko; overall he should have won atleast bronze, probably silver. I also agree with you about the qualifying at the 2003 Worlds, how can Goebel without a quad advantage beat Lambiel, it is crazy. :rofl:

I think alot of it was not being established as far as an elite contender yet. I also think alot of it was coming from a smaller country with little political power, or importance in the sport anymore. Now that Stephane is the reigning World Champion, and is now considered by 90% of skating fans and experts as the is the best or second-best skater in the World today, I expect he will get more credit for what he delivers on the ice. :rock:
 
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