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Thread: La Kwan?

  1. #31

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    Re: Divas

    Pasha still is a diva, she lives in Southern CA now too. She recently had a baby, and she coaches quite a bit. The problem with this thread is that everybody has a different definition of diva. To me a diva is a negative thing, it's someone who's conceited or self-absorbed, or who acts like success has spoiled them. I know to some people diva means something positive, so no one can agree on who the divas are.

  2. #32

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    re Shine

    Hi Shine2002, it wasn't the Yawnforum, sorry, it was another board, I think, the uncensoredskating chat2 or something like that. Gee, that's a definitely uncensored place.

    At least I spelled definitely right this time Granny!

  3. #33

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    Divas on Ice

    GBM, I think maybe we have different definitions of what is a diva.

    I looked it up.

    Etymology: Italian, literally, goddess, from Latin, feminine of divus divine,

    If we stick with this definition then most of the top lady skaters are divas, because they skate divinely. To me diva means an opera singer (male or female) who is extremely talented, arrogant, and entitled, e.g. Pavarotti, Battle, and Callas.

    I can agree with you that Yuka is a diva because she skates divinely. She does not come across as arrogant, or entitled. LOL, she said when the skates are off; she is just a house wife trying to do laundry.

    I love Sarah Hughes; I know she is not perfect. I know about some of her ways of dealing with frustration. I will give her a few get out of “foot n mouth” free card.

    I don’t know Michelle had stomach ache that night, but I will give her a few get out of “signing autograph” free cards. That girl endured a serious death threat when she was 15, and FBI was involved. I think she should be careful about people approaching her; some may not be fans with good intention.

    Whether Michelle truly believes that she is a skating goddess or not, no one knows. We haven’t seen any reports about MK behaving in an entitled way.

    Red Dog, I told the second hand UCLA story because I think MK has a sense of humor, and is able to laugh at herself. ITA, she was tired of answering the same question 10000 times. She could choose to walk away, or tell those people to buzz off, but she dealt with it in a humorous way.

  4. #34

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    Re: Divas on Ice

    Elta, you are right, they are just humans, and if they ever act divaish in the negative sense, its probably because of atta lot of insanely involved fans. Michelle couldn't fly to HongKong without one of her fans on board from MKforum wanting to give her a ring of gold or some such thing.

    You are kind to want to give them extra cards. I think that Yuka is very Japanese. She has been taught not to gloat or brag. I see the most humility in Yuka, Kristi, Luchen, Michelle, Fumie and others with the cultural background.

    I still believe they are divas in the true sense of the word which obviously comes from the divine. I had no idea Kathleen Battle was such a DIVA, as you know my opera education has been sorely lacking. I think Michelle's clue to her self thought has been her telling us a few years ago, she has always wanted to be a "legend" in FS. Watching the Divas show today made me just realize that Ice Princess is a real phenomenon. I think that the FS divas for the most part are better role models than celebrities/actors/pop singers because they keep their lives such a secret. They all try to do that.

    I never heard that Michelle had death threats at 15. What are the details. Was this published some where or is it insider knowledge?

    Thanks for the definition. I wonder who is considered the biggest diva in opera in terms of its negative connotations? How does Maria Callas rate? All I know of her was her life long affair with Onassis.

  5. #35

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    Death Threat

    It was mentioned in some TV fluff piece and the book by Epstein

    Born to Skate (out of print)

    I think it was the 95 - 96 sseason. The death threat was from a French guy. Interestingly, GPF was in France that year, and she won.

  6. #36

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    Divas in the negative

    There definitely needs to be a consistent definition of Diva.

    I believe Elta gave the kind definitions. Unfortunatley, the word diva has attained negative status. Many think of someone who feels she is entitled to act as she pleases without regard for others and make demands of others. This could mean stocking a particular brand of water and throwing tantrums if the correct brand is not available. It could mean refusing to share a dressing room or bringing a huge entourage of hanger's-on who cause more trouble than they are worth.

    I can think of some skaters who have diva-ish qualities (i.e. Pasha comes to mind), but haven't heard of any outright negative divas.

  7. #37
    Jimmy Hoffa 2

    0 Not allowed!

    Re: Divas in the negative

    <blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Michelle gets special treatment on the COI tour. Did you hear the story of one poster on this or some website last year? Michelle didn't want to sign autographs, and was thus led off by COI security. Sarah was annoyed and said out loud as she signed a zillion, "It must be nice to be someone important around here." and she was of course by then the owner of Oly Gold.[/quote]
    I remember that incident. It was one or two shows after Hughes herself bypassed autographs to be "led off by COI security" -- while Kwan hung around and signed.

    I also read that report. The poster said that Kwan was backstage and told someone that she was sick. The poster asked Kwan for her autograph but Kwan was led away before she signed anything, then Hughes made the comment.
    <blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>A lot of people think Michelle is overrated and that it's unfair but seem to be afraid to post it.

    Afraid of others posters attacking. When kwanophiles attack!
    I've seen it hundreds of times, though mainly on MKF.[/quote]
    Well, yeah, if you go to a fan board for a skater and start putting her down, you're not going to get the nicest response. That doesn't take much to figure that one out.

  8. #38

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    Divvy up the diva

    Opera fans, stop insisting the word diva is exclusive to opera singers. One of you went as far as to say while it only applies to opera singers, it can apply to males, too. That's clearly not the "traditional definition" either. Words and their meanings evolve through popular usage, so get with the times. The word "diva" has long since ceased to describe only opera singers. The point of language is to communicate using a pool of shared symbols. And diva, in this linguistic pool, symbolizes a performer, usually female, who, while talented, has an arrogant attitude.

    Celebrities are the Olympian gods of our age. We ascribe superhuman qualities and antics to them, both positive and negative. We tell tales of their wild exploits that fire up our imagination. I'm sure many celebrities, especially the ones in skating, have exceptional talents and temperaments. Fame and fortune is not something one merely attains by aspiration alone. But mostly, celebrities are just average people with publicists.

    For skaters and other celebrities, I judge them like I would anybody else I'm not personally familiar with. I see them interact with people under a very glaring public eye, if they behave nicely, I'll assume they're nice. I don't have any reason to suspect they lead some sordid double life, so I won't. As far as I can see, Michelle and Sarah are perfectly nice, Sasha's a bit shy and guarded, Irina's charming and funny, and so on.

  9. #39

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    Re: Prima Donna

    According to the on-line Merriam-Webster Dictionary the definition for the word <em>diva</em> is as follows:

    <blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>One entry found for diva.

    Main Entry: di•va
    Pronunciation: 'dE-v&
    Function: noun
    Inflected Form(s): plural divas or di•ve /-(&quot vA/
    Etymology: Italian, literally, goddess, from Latin, feminine of divus divine, god -- more at DEITY
    Date: 1883
    : PRIMA DONNA 1[/quote]

    However, if you click on <em>PRIMA DONNA</em>, the following is displayed and definition #2 is closer to the discussion and view points on this thread (except for Kathleen Battle who, as described, fits #1 and #2):

    <blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>One entry found for prima donna.

    Main Entry: pri•ma don•na
    Pronunciation: "pri-m&-'dä-n&, "prE-
    Function: noun
    Inflected Form(s): plural prima donnas
    Etymology: Italian, literally, first lady
    Date: 1782
    1 : a principal female singer in an opera or concert organization
    2 : an extremely sensitive, vain, or undisciplined person[/quote]

    Of course just knowing the definition will not change any one’s mind about a certain skater or another. It’s just one our human frailties – seeing only what we want to see.
    And conveying verbally what we see is the subject of this thread; it is not about the religious aspect of any skater’s personality. Of course Fetal will say I’m wrong and that’s its prerogative isn’t it?

    We all carry a lot of baggage and that baggage colors what we see/hear. So with that in mind, aren’t our opinions a product of not only what we see/hear but also what we bring to the table in order to process what we see/hear?

    I know that certain colors, sound frequencies, note combinations, skeletal movements bring me pleasure and make me feel good about not only what I see and hear but also about the media delivering the pleasure. By close approximation, I feel better about my self.
    If I choose to convey verbally the pleasure I feel, am I wrong – no. But if I promote those media that pleasures me to the exclusion of anything or any one else – then I am wrong.

  10. #40

    0 Not allowed!

    Re: Prima Donna

    I don't care what the etymology of the word diva is.

    In my humble opinion, there was only one Diva and that was La Callas. Maybe Tetrazzini and Melba before my time.

    For figure skating there is the one and only La Kwan. She'll generate adoration and loathing not unlike Callas but I wouldn't call her or any figure skater a diva.

    I could say Le Button, but I won't and he really is the one and only. In addition to superlative skating of his time, he has claimed verbiage that no one can approach. (The Russian boys just don't do it for me. They are not terribly exciting off the ice.)


  11. #41

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    Re: Prima Donna

    Joe, though some remain unconvinced I woud mostly agree with your post. I would say that Figure Skating had one true Diva and that would be the one and only Sonja Henie. She did it all and was larger than life in many ways. Like Callas, she changed the face of her profession.

  12. #42

    0 Not allowed!

    Re: Prima Donna

    Sk8m8 - I have to agree. If there is or was a figure skating diva it had to be Sonia. She was all that the opera singers could achieve both in adoration and loathing. She was special.

    I was afraid I would get a list of the 10 most likely figure skating divas! - all of recent times. Not the real thing.

    There are <span style="color:blue;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:small;">special</span> people in this world. We cannot name our favorites of today to this category. It is a special list not easily named.
    Check out the Nobel prize winners. Not easy for them to decide. But fs fans will toss names around without recourse to any deep thought.

    Cheers - Joe

  13. #43

    0 Not allowed!

    Re: Divas on Ice

    I use La Kwan a lot as well, as Joe said it means "The Kwan"
    in English.

    It's my new pet name for her, and a nice change from calling her "MK" all the time

  14. #44

    0 Not allowed!

    Re: Divas on Ice

    Love the sound, LA KWAN. So classy and unique.

  15. #45

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    Nicknames galore

    Here are some other potential names for La Kwan:

    Spongebob SquareKwants


    Puerto RiKwan

    Kwan't Touch This




    Apolo Kwanton Ohno

    A Fish Named Kwanda

    I Kwant Kwandy

    The Ku Klux Kwan

    The Wu-Tang Kwan

    Kwanned Parenthood

    Ooops, I almost forgot the most insulting one:

    Kwancy Kerrikwan

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