I agree with what you said. Judges do whatever they want, but the rulebook clearly states a Lutz must take-off from an outside edge.
It is very hard for most skaters to correct, especially once the judges know you have issues. Look how long Wakaba has had flip issues.
Incorrect edges are devilishly hard to correct once the technique is baked (which typically happens before a skater reaches the elite level). It can be done (Mao managed it at the very end of her career, for instance, sadly past the point where it would have mattered), but it usually takes a long time.
She needs to figure out something quick, because her whole strategy is about maximizing her point total without a 3A or quad. This already puts her at the mercy of the judges and the other top girls making big mistakes, so she can't afford to give any points away at all.
The scoring difference was just about politics. The almost the entire panel at Worlds was European. Her GOEs at Worlds were incredibly low considering the quality of her elements. PCS is where the real controversy is Kaori does deserve high SS marks. Certainly, higher than Anna/ Liza. I would agree with you that below the waist she is incredible. However, I wouldn't give her the marks she got here for musical interpretation. However, considering how overscored Anna/ Liza also were in PCS , I guess this competition was a bit more equitable than Worlds.
It must be very difficult for a skater to maintain their focus and enthusiasm for training when they get 20 pts less when it really matters, for basically the same performance, than they do in an exhibition which means nothing. I actually think her score at World's was closer to reality than here, though. I would say the 210-212 range would be more fair. This takes into account correctly called wrong edge calls on the lutz's, acceptable PCS scores, to me, if you exclude the Russians, and a couple of extra points for somewhat low GOE compared to the non Russian skaters. I do think the 5 pt GOE is problematic, however. Just more room for arbitrary score manipulation. For instance, speed is not a bullet point for jumps, and jumping the farthest or highest does not give you bonus points, it just helps to satisfy a bullet point. But people constantly talk about Kaori's speed and length as reasons she should get the highest GOE, which is not necessarily the case.
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There were massive changes to the system that just so happened to coincide with the time when Mao turned professional including full downgrades on jumps with mandatory negative GOE and the potential for high positive GOE, reduction in the relative value of the triple axel, and the introduction of highly selective edge calls and all were. made at the highly biased whims of tech crew that looked at jumps from certain skaters like Mao with an eagle eye under a microscope and turned a blind eye to the mistakes of others. Furthermore, the scoring bias was carried over into PCS deflation, GOE deflation, devaluation of spirals, spins and step sequences and ignoring Mao's graceful and challenging transitions and massive rink coverage skating all the way to the boards.Yet, she still won worlds 3 times, and in my opinion 4 because of her relative underscoring in 2007, and a solid argument could be made that she should have won the Grand Prix Final 5 times including in 2007. Mao's PCS scores alone in the Grand Prxi LP in 2007 were laughably low below 60 and the tech slashing of scores was really extreme.I feel that their careers overall have too much of a gap for them to be considered to be on the same level. I'm not saying that Mao had a mediocre career by any means. In fact, she had a great career with 3 world golds and 1 Olympic silver. However, that can't exactly be compared to 1 Olympic gold, 1 Olympic silver, and 2 world titles considering Yuna skipped some seasons. Mao had crazy high technical content but the rules during that time would punish HARSHLY for any underrotations. Back then, underrotating a jump meant that it would be downgraded to the base value of the same jump with one less rotation, so Mao and other skaters who struggled with rotations would frequently get disappointed by their scores. I don't remember if it was mandatory for underrotated jumps to get negative GOE because figure skating rules change so often, but it was customary for underrotated jumps to be punished harshly in GOE also. Judges handed out edge calls more freely (and in my opinion, this is the correct way to do things), so that was a huge factor too. These flaws in her jumps really held Mao back, so even before Yuna became dominant, it was generally understood that she WOULD win if she just skated clean (around late 2007- 2008ish?). Best example of this is the 2007 GPF where Yuna won over Mao, I suggest you watch the competition to get a clearer idea of how things stood then if you haven't already. Thing is, she didn't perform her best for two worlds in a row, which delayed the timing of her dominance. So I would not exactly say that Mao was considered to be slightly better than Yuna past their first senior seasons.
I guess this is one viewpoint
It's frustrating for me because I feel that judges have already set something of a roof for Kaori's scores. I cannot possibly see how she could be a real contender for a podium finish at Worlds or the Olympics unless she gains a triple axel or a quad... By this, I mean her name is always in the mix for a potential bronze, but she always ends up a few placements lower even with good skates. It's a shame bcs she has such good skating skills and jumps, and I personally don't find her artistry particularly lacking either. I might get a lot of flack for this, but if the judges helped Osmond out the way they did during the last Olympic cycle, I don't see why they shouldn't with Kaori
We all know skating is full of corruption and politics. But the national federations are no different. Everything you just complained about for Kaori and against Osmond and the international judges are the same things the other Japanese skaters fans complain about Kaori and the JSF and their judges in domestic competition. The sport has been corrupt for a very long time, internationally and nationally. Whether its the JSF pretending Satoko's jumps are fine or Kaori is graceful and musical, it usually doesn't fly at World's or Olympics. Evidently the JSF does not have enough clout when it matters most.It's frustrating for me because I feel that judges have already set something of a roof for Kaori's scores. I cannot possibly see how she could be a real contender for a podium finish at Worlds or the Olympics unless she gains a triple axel or a quad... By this, I mean her name is always in the mix for a potential bronze, but she always ends up a few placements lower even with good skates. It's a shame bcs she has such good skating skills and jumps, and I personally don't find her artistry particularly lacking either. I might get a lot of flack for this, but if the judges helped Osmond out the way they did during the last Olympic cycle, I don't see why they shouldn't with Kaori
Not saying any skater should be getting special treatment, but I just don't think judges will ever want to help Kaori out in the way they did Katelyn (or some other skaters, for that matter). And I don't know what a skater like Kaori is lacking than some of those other skaters
As much as I follow the discussion here in the Japanese ladies' thread, I simply canNOT agree with the above statement: I don't think (and can't imagine) any other Jpn skaters 'complain' about Kaori. Figure skating is such an individual sport, and, of course skaters are rivals with each other in the competitions. But no matter what the final result is, I think most skaters would come down to the realization that the only rival is themselves. I just don't get this point about how other skaters complain about one skater (but I can get how dedicated fans complain or over-worrying about any particular skater...).
You are correct. I should have just said fans. None of the skaters openly complain, even internationally. However, common sense and seeing their reaction to other's scores on occasion would indicate they are not happy with the situation. My point was really just about how national feds play favorites just as much as the isu does in scoring, and I used Kaori in Japan as the counter to Osmond in the Olympic year, as was brought up. I was a little sloppy in my phrasing about complaining, since that wasnt the main thrust of my point.
Should Satoko still be considered special? Im not sure. Not the way she jumped this season. In my opinion if Satoko makes the Olympic team, that means the Japanese women had a very disappointing season overall.
It's based on Nationals' results. So, according to the rules, she should.
Ok. I didn't know that. Is that a rule every year? I didnt know it was so cut and dry.
