2020-21 US Ladies’ Figure Skating

Victura

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 8, 2012
I feel like this usually happens when someone wins based on their short program scores. It’s worth noting that Mariah was actually 4th in the free skate yesterday and only won overall by a slim margin due to her lead in the short.

Bradie won the second ISP points challenge and Mariah won the first one. I don’t think there’s some conspiracy or that Mariah is now the anointed one. Bradie herself has said that she’s had some minor injuries and such and she’s just had a coaching change. The two skaters have different styles, but both are hard workers and seem like lovely people, so I hope their combined strength can earn us 3 spots when it comes to qualifying for the Olympics.
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
This year is basically a wash, so I don't care so much, but when things get back to normal, I don't want to see Gracie Gold in a Grand Prix event until she proves in other competitions that she is back to an appropriate level. There are just too many other American skaters that deserve that spot ahead of her right now.
I get what you’re saying but it’s just hard to tell with Gracie. In practices (here and at nationals) she was landing 3-3s and other triples in general, so she is capable physically, it’s just mentally that’s the problem (and I’m not sure how you train that). Also, if you don’t kind me asking, what other American skaters are there that weren’t at Skate America?
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
It’s worth noting that Mariah was actually 4th in the free skate yesterday and only won overall by a slim margin due to her lead in the short.
I think the favoritism part comes from the fact that she made mistakes and was still virtually tied with those who were cleaner (and had better programs choreographically- still can’t believe that’s a Shae-Lynn program)
I don’t think there’s some conspiracy or that Mariah is now the anointed one
I feel like there kind of is based on how she is judged in the US. I know everyone country has their favorites, but it’s so blatantly obvious it’s her. Her combo was under in the short (as well as others) and she was the only one wasn’t called. She’s still a strong skater, I just wish she wasn’t handed things or had flaws over looked. I do think if we had worlds this past year, her and Bradie totally would have gotten that third spot back though!
 

surimi

Shan Ben Cao Tai, keep fighting! ^ ^
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2013
It was good to see Bradie and Mariah again. Bradie was my favorite here, though Mariah's skating is pretty to watch too. I was very impressed with Audrey Shin who I saw for the first time, and Karen Chen was great. Even some of the lower ranked skaters like Lin or Venetta were a pleasant surprise.
I have to say I felt concerned for Gracie. She looked like she didn't want to be there, didn't enjoy competing, and possibly didn't even enjoy skating :( I get that it's beyond disappointing for her to mess up her jumps like that due to injuries or mental block, but it's a pity it looked like she wasn't even trying in the other departments like the step sequence. I could still be her strong point. I really hope she doesn't force herself into skating competitively if doing so worsens her distress. At this point I am wondering if she wouldn't simply be happier focusing on her studies or teaching skating to others. And shows, when they re-start.
 

katymay

Medalist
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
I get what you’re saying but it’s just hard to tell with Gracie. In practices (here and at nationals) she was landing 3-3s and other triples in general, so she is capable physically, it’s just mentally that’s the problem (and I’m not sure how you train that). Also, if you don’t kind me asking, what other American skaters are there that weren’t at Skate America?
She can land all the jumps in isolation, but that isn't the problem. I think the most difficult part of skating is having the stamina to get through a program-long or short. Your heart pounds, you can't catch your breath, and your legs feel like rubber. It takes hard work. It takes doing a program, day after day after day with all the elements. Gracie's fitness level-or lack thereof-seems almost dangerous. Like sprinting the mile when you haven't really run in years.
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
She can land all the jumps in isolation, but that isn't the problem. I think the most difficult part of skating is having the stamina to get through a program-long or short. Your heart pounds, you can't catch your breath, and your legs feel like rubber. It takes hard work. It takes doing a program, day after day after day with all the elements. Gracie's fitness level-or lack thereof-seems almost dangerous. Like sprinting the mile when you haven't really run in years.
Yeah, I think after being gone so long that she, no matter what competition it is, just gets so nervous. At this point, I’m not really sure what her and her team are going to do but I hope she has some better skates next time that she can be proud of.
 

ali0125

Rinkside
Joined
Nov 3, 2019
Country
Australia
Congrats to Mariah - finally the winner takes it all :ROFLMAO: Strong performance from Bradie and Karen too! And best luck to everyone the rest of the season.
Audrey Shin really caught my eye this weekend - I checked her Instagram, she was practising quad too? She has a lot potential to become a strong competitor for Olympic team!
 

zanadude

Medalist
Joined
Feb 20, 2016
I get what you’re saying but it’s just hard to tell with Gracie. In practices (here and at nationals) she was landing 3-3s and other triples in general, so she is capable physically, it’s just mentally that’s the problem (and I’m not sure how you train that). Also, if you don’t kind me asking, what other American skaters are there that weren’t at Skate America?
She has lost whatever benefit of the doubt she had left. If she wants that spot back, she needs to earn it back in actual competition.

Also, my comment pertained to regular grand prix events, not the glorified exhibition we had last weekend. In normal times, you're not going to have spots for eleven American skaters in a single GP. For a COVID event, sure, whatever the organizers want.
 

GraysonXIV

Spectator
Joined
Oct 25, 2020
Sorry, I don’t see how the judges are biased towards Mariah when she’s only won against Bradie 3 times including the ISP Points Challenge where Bradie won one of the competitions. Mariah very rightfully bested Bradie at US Nats. So Skate America is really the only data point suggesting any bias in Mariah’s favor, and Bradie had more unders and basically a fall on that 3S. Their scores were virtually tied. How quick we are to forget that USFS propped up Bradie at points in prior seasons too.
I like both of them so much and I’m really hoping they get 3 spots back for the US so they both get to go to the Olympics.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Le professionnel d'élite
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
Gracie was having boot and other issues coming into Skate America.

Also to whomever asked about training your mental, it's working with a Sports Psychologist, which I'm sure she does.
 

Joekaz

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 13, 2018
I agree, I think it’s only domestically though. Once international competitions happen (at some point😬) again, I think Bradie will be scoring higher (especially since she always has been for the past few years). It is disheartening though to see these judges not really judging the skates they are seeing and instead just pushing forward a federation favorite no matter what they do.
Bradie is very stiff and mechanical, she is lucky to get the PCS she got. It doesn't matter much because none of the Americans have a chance to podium at World's if there is one anyway.
 

brightphoton

Medalist
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Who did Bradie upset at the ISU because look at the pictures they posted of her on their social media. They're horrible. Espeically when compared to Mariah and Audrey's pictures.




Someone has to be doing this on purpose.
I had to take a look at ISU's Instagram for myself. The juxtaposition of the photos made me laugh, but it's actually not very funny. The comments say that people are complaining about Bradie's pictures being horrid, but ISU is deleting their comments.

I wonder if anything happened with Bradie and the higher up officials. When she made the GP final last year, she was the only lady who wasn't invited to the gala. And there were only 6 lady participants.

 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Bradie is very stiff and mechanical, she is lucky to get the PCS she got. It doesn't matter much because none of the Americans have a chance to podium at World's if there is one anyway.
I think Bradie is trying to improve her artistic score. I just like when skaters try to improve on their weaker areas. Also Bradie’s programs have a completely different vibe than Mariah’s so she can’t be all cheesy and smiley in her programs. Also, my small problem was after nationals a lot of people kept saying that the US (or more Mariah) had a chance to medal at worlds and it was quite ridiculous. The US ladies wouldn’t even be top 5 at worlds once you consider the Russians, Japanese, and Koreans.
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Also, my comment pertained to regular grand prix events, not the glorified exhibition we had last weekend. In normal times, you're not going to have spots for eleven American skaters in a single GP. For a COVID event, sure, whatever the organizers want.
Oh yeah, I agree. If this was a normal year, I don’t think Gracie would have gotten the host pick.
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Sorry, I don’t see how the judges are biased towards Mariah when she’s only won against Bradie 3 times including the ISP Points Challenge where Bradie won one of the competitions. Mariah very rightfully bested Bradie at US Nats. So Skate America is really the only data point suggesting any bias in Mariah’s favor, and Bradie had more unders and basically a fall on that 3S. Their scores were virtually tied. How quick we are to forget that USFS propped up Bradie at points in prior seasons too.
I like both of them so much and I’m really hoping they get 3 spots back for the US so they both get to go to the Olympics.
When I think about the favoritism of Mariah, I don’t really think about the amount of times she’s beaten in Bradie. It’s more just the hype people build up around her. She seems to be seen as the leading lady by many but I just don’t think that’s warranted since last year Bradie made the final and skated two personal bests at FCC and got bronze (and she’s been just more reliable for the past few years). Also when it comes to some GOEs on jumps, she gets the benefit of the doubt when virtually no other skaters do. Favoritism to me is just having mistakes overlooked or getting plus points for things that don’t deserve it all the time. But I get that it may be subjective for a lot of us and some thing she is favored and some think she’s not, which is completely okay. This is all just my opinion.
 

oly2018

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 13, 2018
I don't know why it's necessary to talk down Mariah in order to say that Bradie was wronged. Bradie made the final over Mariah on ISU technicalities. It isn't like Mariah was so far off from being there too. If anything, they are pretty neck and neck because they have different strengths. Ultimately, they need each other because neither is getting a world medal. They just both need to hope they are both favored so they can place well enough to earn a third spot for the Olympics so they both have a good chance of going.
 

Skatefan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
They just both need to hope they are both favored so they can place well enough to earn a third spot for the Olympics so they both have a good chance of going.
I just hope there’s worlds for them to earn the third spot because iirc worlds is on Sweden(?) I’m not sure how the coronavirus situation is working out over there or if they will want to have skaters from around the world travel there.
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I agree and I don't like it. Bradie is an excellent skater and when she skates well, I have her ahead of Mariah. It seems that the judges are willing hand their head to head meetings to Mariah no matter how they skate. It's actually disheartening.
Considering that Tennell placed 1st in the freeskate and Bell 4th, I don't think the judges were thinking "How should we score these two skaters head to head in this program to make sure that Bell comes out ahead overall?"

They're certainly not supposed to be directly comparing skaters under IJS, nor keeping track of score totals in the current program or the previous phase.

Even under 6.0, judges were not supposed to be worrying about how their freeskate scores would combine with the factored placements from earlier phases to produce overall results.
 
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