2021 Finlandia Trophy: Men's Free Skate | Page 18 | Golden Skate

2021 Finlandia Trophy: Men's Free Skate

yume

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
But Jason has spent his competitive skating life maximizing the athletic gifts he has for PCS, and can we hope perhaps change the system (ETA: so that scoring is as it should be) for other skaters as well?
Yes for skaters who don't skate under the right flag. Who should be in 90s but are in low 80s because of that.
 

Hyena

Tous les whiskys
Medalist
Joined
Jan 9, 2014
I can’t believe that his PCS was finally rewarded as it should be, even when the jumps are less good. I’m still in shock, Jason fans are accustomed to getting hosed on that.

But Jason has spent his competitive skating life maximizing the athletic gifts he has for PCS, and can we hope perhaps change the system (ETA: so that scoring is as it should be) for other skaters as well?
I always think it's important to add that skaters like Jason don't just maximize PCS, but levels and GOE as well. His FS spins and step sequence all got Level 4s and very high GOEs. His opening 3F also got GOEs in the range of 3-5. He doesn't always attempt quads but everything he does do, he always attempts to do extremely well.

I know you know this El :) but I think sometimes we forget tech isn't just about jump difficulty, it's difficulty across your elements and doing those elements well.
 

Jontor

Medalist
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Country
Sweden
I always think it's important to add that skaters like Jason don't just maximize PCS, but levels and GOE as well. His FS spins and step sequence all got Level 4s and very high GOEs. His opening 3F also got GOEs in the range of 3-5. He doesn't always attempt quads but everything he does do, he always attempts to do extremely well.

I know you know this El :) but I think sometimes we forget tech isn't just about jump difficulty, it's difficulty across your elements and doing those elements well.
Yes, doing wonky quads with negative GOEs will get you nowhere. I think the current judging system with the +5/-5 is perfect in the sense that it promotes skaters who do the elements well, not the tech itself. It promotes clean skates.
 

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
Record Breaker
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Mar 3, 2014
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United-States
Yes for skaters who don't skate under the right flag. Who should be in 90s but are in low 80s because of that.

Jason doesn't get 90s just because he is a big fed skater, but because he does what he does so well. He is, dare I say, the standard for maximizing all skating elements much the way other skaters are a standard for maximizing jumps. And even Jason can get lower PCS to someone who scores the "quad bonus".

But I am a fan of many small fed skaters and would love to see their other gifts valued as much as jumps.:pray:
 

yume

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Jason doesn't get 90s just because he is a big fed skater, but because he does what he does so well. He is, dare I say, the standard for maximizing all skating elements much the way other skaters are a standard for maximizing jumps. And even Jason can get lower PCS to someone who scores the "quad bonus".

But I am a fan of many small fed skaters and would love to see their other gifts valued as much as jumps.:pray:
That's not what i meant. I meant that being Americain help judges to aknowlegde his skills. If he was Chinese for example i don't think judges would have really opened their eyes. Politic power exists.

And outside Chen i don't see who gets higher PCS thanks to quad bonus over him. Since three season judges reward him well.

Anyway, great for him. At least there is one who gets deserved scores.
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
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Mar 14, 2007
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Yes, doing wonky quads with negative GOEs will get you nowhere. I think the current judging system with the +5/-5 is perfect in the sense that it promotes skaters who do the elements well, not the tech itself. It promotes clean skates.
Huh??? It did not “promote clean skates” at Worlds when Karen Chen came in 4th and the others were splatfests with higher tech content. For that matter Keegan was very clean, close to perfect at Worlds WITH quads and came in 6th. And “doing wonky quads with negative GOEs” can absolutely land one on the podium. Sorry, I think it is very very far from perfect and DESPERATELY needs to be fixed. I’ve been complaining about it for 50 million forevers.
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
Country
United-States
Jason doesn't get 90s just because he is a big fed skater, but because he does what he does so well. He is, dare I say, the standard for maximizing all skating elements much the way other skaters are a standard for maximizing jumps. And even Jason can get lower PCS to someone who scores the "quad bonus".

But I am a fan of many small fed skaters and would love to see their other gifts valued as much as jumps.:pray:
Me too.
 

NoNameFace

GS given name - Beatrice
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
@Novalis @NoNameFace are you dancing in the audience?
Of course I did!! It was high time to remind myself that Latin ballroom lessons I took while being younger snd more confident ;). Donovan is one of those few skaters who just wear heart on their sleeves and pour emotions into everything, glaxing it with smile. Plus he felt that music just all right - yes, not everything was perfect, but he made us feel festive and cheerful.
20211008_170145.jpg
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
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Mar 14, 2007
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Totally agree. Some people complain that it is all about the jumps these days, but JB proves that is not true.

And again not really. There were no super clean skates with quads. So Jason could take the opportunity and win. But he’s losing so many points not having quads that this win was extremely unusual for him. Now I think it shouldn’t be true.

I just looked up Jason on Rink Results and his previous golds internationally have been Golden Spin in 2018 and 2019. He did have a silver at Worlds in 2018 I think. This is not to disparage his skating which I love. To be clear, I’m saying he doesn’t win as much as I believe he should. Of course unless one’s favorite skater happens to be Nathan Chen that’s true of most fans I bet😀
 

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
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Mar 3, 2014
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United-States
@NoNameFace I hope you will share your thoughts both here, or maybe in the appropriate Fan Fests, if you have time:pray:.

I am so so so so glad you decided to go and that you saw Donovan, Jason and others live and in person. I hope it was worth the trip. :)
 

yume

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Kolyada is recycling his step sequence again, as last season. It's the same in both programs. At least Mishin isn't Daniil and Misha isn't an Eteri's student. Otherwise they would have been mocked all over internet.
I wonder how choreographers feel when Mishin does that.
 

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
Record Breaker
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Kolyada is recycling his step sequence again, as last season. It's the same in both programs. At least Mishin isn't Daniil and Misha isn't an Eteri's student. Otherwise they would have been mocked all over internet.
I wonder how choreographers feel when Mishin does that.

The step sequence has been noted and commented on:




I am afraid to say I don't follow Misha closely enough to notice, but if Mishin is recycling, that's a shame. Misha K. is talented and deserves better.
 

labgoat

Bearing witness
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Joined
Jan 3, 2007
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My guess would be 'yes.' It isn't that we have so many Puritans still, although they exist in one form or another. It's more that America was established by the Puritans and the taboos infiltrated, even though the prudery didn't exist, beforehand, in other groups that contributed as much to the general ethos. Particularly Scots-Irish. And the pearl-clutching could persist when the religion changed.



My guess would be no. I'm tempted to say 'never,' but I try never to say never.



Me too! (shaking hands across the universe) When I spent 6 weeks in England, my friends and I had fun comparing.
Well said. I'd add that the Puritan types are often quite vocal about things that upset them.
 
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