2021 Nebelhorn Trophy Entries | Page 2 | Golden Skate

2021 Nebelhorn Trophy Entries

N.P.

Spectator
Joined
Sep 3, 2021
N means not skating for olympic qualification, I guess S just means they are? That makes sense, but I wish they would provide a legend to help people understand it better and more easily.
 

SnowWhite

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 30, 2016
Country
Canada
N means not skating for olympic qualification, I guess S just means they are? That makes sense, but I wish they would provide a legend to help people understand it better and more easily.
There is a legend, at the bottom of the entries for each discipline on the ISU page. It says "S - Substitute Entry. N - not for Olympic Qualifying".
 

Olympic

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
NO Tursy is the biggest story. She was capable of winning and getting KAZ a spot, but it won't happen now. Looks like the top skaters will be Liu, Safonova, Kurakova and Paganini. No Christy Leung for HKG, so there's kind of a drop to #5. I think Liu should qualify if she skates competently. I wouldn't say any of them are consistent.

For the men, Zhou has a shot at winning, but I'm honestly afraid to make predictions concerning him. Like Liu, a competent set of skates will give the US a 3rd spot easily Otherwise, based on the size of their substitute list, RUS will send whoever does well at their test skates and not necessarily Aliev (I thought since he was selected, he was suddenly doing better), but RUS has plenty of talent and should also qualify their #3. For the rest, I suppose Sadovsky Siao Him Fa (FRA), Lee (KOR), Litvintsev (AZE), Kerry (AUS) and Fentz (GER) will fight for qualification at the Olympics. But, someone is going to be left out. Sadly, I think it will be either Kerry or Fentz.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
No Norwegian woman entered whatsoever?

I think they most likely already know it´s impossible to get a spot for OG at this point and also they are aiming for OG in 2026. They have a development team for novice and juniors with the goal to go to OG 2026. And it looks promising.

I think the main goal for the senior team now is to concentrate to get one of the skaters to EC firstly. I think they don´t know who will have the spot (and i´m actually not sure who has the requirements either) so I guess they are maybe aiming to send the skaters together to one or more Senior B events later this fall to decide and to collect minimums.

I think it makes sense, earlier only one or two skaters was sent to Challenger and I guess it´s also a money question. I just checked and they have actually not listed any of the skaters as elite skaters this season. I think usually they only send the elite skaters to the Challenger-series, they cost more.
 

DenissVFan

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
I think they most likely already know it´s impossible to get a spot for OG at this point and also they are aiming for OG in 2026. They have a development team for novice and juniors with the goal to go to OG 2026. And it looks promising.

I think the main goal for the senior team now is to concentrate to get one of the skaters to EC firstly. I think they don´t know who will have the spot (and i´m actually not sure who has the requirements either) so I guess they are maybe aiming to send the skaters together to one or more Senior B events later this fall to decide and to collect minimums.

I think it makes sense, earlier only one or two skaters was sent to Challenger and I guess it´s also a money question. I just checked and they have actually not listed any of the skaters as elite skaters this season. I think usually they only send the elite skaters to the Challenger-series, they cost more.
I was just surprised because almost every other skating nation that hasn't secured a spot yet but has an eligible skater is sending someone regardless of how small their chances of qualifying are, so Norway stands out here with no entry.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
I was just surprised because almost every other skating nation that hasn't secured a spot yet but has an eligible skater is sending someone regardless of how small their chances of qualifying are, so Norway stands out here with no entry.
I just checked and it seems it could also be the requirement of the general Olympic selection in Norway that could cause the problem. For individuals it seems the skater must either have a championship medal or place very high in EC or WC (which of course is out of the question), or they must place no lower then 12. place in at least two events which they recognize. It doesn´t say when the requirements must be done, but nobody did any international event last season so everything must probably happen this fall and it seems like a difficult task. It´s possible they will only will recognize nothing less then a top 12. placement in Challengers event.
 
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ladyjane

Medalist
Joined
Jun 26, 2012
Country
Netherlands
I just checked and it seems it could also be there requirement of the general Olympic selection in Norway that could cause the problem. For individuals it seems the skater must either have a championship medal or place very high in EC or WC (which of course is out of the question), or they must place no lower then 12. place in at least two events which they recognize. It doesn´t say when the requirements must be done, but nobody did any international event last season so everything must probably happen this fall and it seems like a difficult task. It´s possible they will only will recognize nothing less then a top 12. placement in Challengers event.
A bit like the Swedish then (which of course also is part of Scandinavia, just like beautiful Norway) where both Nicolaj Majorov and Josefin Taljegard qualified spots at the WC, but the demands of the National Olympic Committee on top of qualification are rather difficult to obtain. I don't know exactly the points minimum but it is a lot higher than just gaining the minimum TES for Worlds or Europeans.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
A bit like the Swedish then (which of course also is part of Scandinavia, just like beautiful Norway) where both Nicolaj Majorov and Josefin Taljegard qualified spots at the WC, but the demands of the National Olympic Committee on top of qualification are rather difficult to obtain. I don't know exactly the points minimum but it is a lot higher than just gaining the minimum TES for Worlds or Europeans.
Yes, it made me think of when the Swedes did not send Alexander Majorov to OG 2018 because of almost impossible requirements (which was even stricter, all though he earned a spot for the mens which is difficult enough) but they only sent Anita Östlund because she somehow was in a promising and young talent-quota. All though, it seems the Norwegian Olympic Committee has some sort of possible special treatment quota as well, there is possible in very special occasion to send a athlete after results of a National event if it holds international standard (I guess for figure skating that would be judging). I think only the National championship would come in question because thats the only events with 5 judges, i´m not sure that would be good enough. Also it´s difficult to know what they would consider as a special enough occasions.

I hope Sweden will send both Josefin and Nikolaj to OG. I´m not so worried for Nikolai because he is younger and they may send him because of that and there aren´t many alternatives, but I´m a bit afraid they will punish Josefin for being older and not have the most difficult layout. I really hope they don´t and pull an Alexander Majorov on her, because that seems so unfair when she secured Swedens spot in WC. And she is a good performer and consistent. Maybe it´s a bit early to decide, but I guess Nationals will have something to say also.
 

DenissVFan

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
I just checked and it seems it could also be the requirement of the general Olympic selection in Norway that could cause the problem. For individuals it seems the skater must either have a championship medal or place very high in EC or WC (which of course is out of the question), or they must place no lower then 12. place in at least two events which they recognize. It doesn´t say when the requirements must be done, but nobody did any international event last season so everything must probably happen this fall and it seems like a difficult task. It´s possible they will only will recognize nothing less then a top 12. placement in Challengers event.
If it's an issue with money or internal requirements, then it's a pity because Nebelhorn in an Olympic season would be great for gaining experience.

A bit like the Swedish then (which of course also is part of Scandinavia, just like beautiful Norway) where both Nicolaj Majorov and Josefin Taljegard qualified spots at the WC, but the demands of the National Olympic Committee on top of qualification are rather difficult to obtain. I don't know exactly the points minimum but it is a lot higher than just gaining the minimum TES for Worlds or Europeans.
What the Swedish Olympic Committee is doing must be really demotivating for skaters :confused: You gain a spot but someone who didn't even make the FS at Worlds will go instead because your country said so.

I hope Sweden will send both Josefin and Nikolaj to OG. I´m not so worried for Nikolai because he is younger and they may send him because of that and there aren´t many alternatives, but I´m a bit afraid they will punish Josefin for being older and not have the most difficult layout. I really hope they don´t and pull an Alexander Majorov on her, because that seems so unfair when she secured Swedens spot in WC. And she is a good performer and consistent. Maybe it´s a bit early to decide, but I guess Nationals will have something to say also.
I hope that at least they don't discriminate based on age because Josefin had a better showing at Worlds than Nikolaj.

But I'm not so sure Nikolaj will get an exception because as far as I remember his mother (?) said in an interview that the score requirement applies to him too and it's much, much higher than his PB.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
If it's an issue with money or internal requirements, then it's a pity because Nebelhorn in an Olympic season would be great for gaining experience.


What the Swedish Olympic Committee is doing must be really demotivating for skaters :confused: You gain a spot but someone who didn't even make the FS at Worlds will go instead because your country said so.


I hope that at least they don't discriminate based on age because Josefin had a better showing at Worlds than Nikolaj.

But I'm not so sure Nikolaj will get an exception because as far as I remember his mother (?) said in an interview that the score requirement applies to him too and it's much, much higher than his PB.

Thanks for the information. Do you know what the technical requirement/score is? I never heard of that before, I thought they only based it on placement. Must they both have a high placement in a special event and have a certain score? And if Nikolaj hasn´t surpassed it yet i´m a bit worried because he has landed 3A and even a quad (maybe not fully rotated, but still). And he really has some nice and high triples with positive GOE.
 

DenissVFan

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
Thanks for the information. Do you know what the technical requirement/score is? I never heard of that before, I thought they only based it on placement. Must they both have a high placement in a special event and have a certain score? And if Nikolaj hasn´t surpassed it yet i´m a bit worried because he has landed 3A and even a quad (maybe not fully rotated, but still). And he really has some nice and high triples with positive GOE.
198.77 points for Josefin (PB 178.10 points) and 258.45 points for Nikolaj (PB 218.07 points)… o_O

ETA: To put these scores into perspective, the required score for Josefin is higher than Nikolaj's and Alexei Bychenko's scores at WC2021 (and about half a point lower than Boyang's), and for Nikolaj it's 12 points higher than the silver medallist's of EC2020.
 
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Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
198.77 points for Josefin (PB 178.10 points) and 258.45 points for Nikolaj (PB 218.07 points)… o_O

ETA: To put these scores into perspective, the required score for Josefin is higher than Nikolaj's and Alexei Bychenko's scores at WC2021 (and about half a point lower than Boyang's), and for Nikolaj is 12 points higher than the silver medallist's of EC2020.
Like wtf??? They are serious?! That´s crazy high scores, they must have been drunk while deciding the scores. I mean, i´m seriously impressed by the scores they have already achieved. Almost 200 points in the ladies field is also around the top ladies at JGP-circuit so far, and almost only achieved by the Russians except for Levito. Of course there is a bit difference on junior and senior score, but come on.

It seems like an almost impossible task and how did they even come up with those scores? The numbers seems to be super random. I´m wondering if they even want the athletes to succeed:palmf:

Only way I can see they achieve the scores must be at Nationals or at Senior B events with a very generous judges. Will Nationals scores be valid? It seems most likely now that Josefin will succeed, but she really have to start stepping up her content with triple triple and lutzes to have a shot. Lucky enough she seems to have her nerves under control.

I just had to check, not even Joshi or Victoria Helgesson was near that score. It actually seems Josefin holds the Swedish record, so this is crazy requirements.

Edit: It seems they choose the lowest score from top 8 at the recent WC. That´s just crazy.
 
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Gia_Sesshoumaru

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Country
United-States
Like wtf??? They are serious?! That´s crazy high scores, they must have been drunk while deciding the scores. I mean, i´m seriously impressed by the scores they have already achieved. Almost 200 points in the ladies field is also around the top ladies at JGP-circuit so far, and almost only achieved by the Russians except for Levito. Of course there is a bit difference on junior and senior score, but come on.

It seems like an almost impossible task and how did they even come up with those scores? The numbers seems to be super random. I´m wondering if they even want the athletes to succeed:palmf:

Only way I can see they achieve the scores must be at Nationals or at Senior B events with a very generous judges. Will Nationals scores be valid? It seems most likely now that Josefin will succeed, but she really have to start stepping up her content with triple triple and lutzes to have a shot. Lucky enough she seems to have her nerves under control.

I just had to check, not even Joshi or Victoria Helgesson was near that score. It actually seems Josefin holds the Swedish record, so this is crazy requirements.

Sweden requires athletes to have a score equivalent to the top 8 in the World the previous Worlds OR they can be sent "for the experience" if they haven't been before. This is why Alexander Majorov wasn't sent in 2018.

So basically first alternates in both women's and men's should be prepared to go just in case Sweden relinquishes their spots.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
Sweden requires athletes to have a score equivalent to the top 8 in the World the previous Worlds OR they can be sent "for the experience" if they haven't been before. This is why Alexander Majorov wasn't sent in 2018.

So basically first alternates in both women's and men's should be prepared to go just in case Sweden relinquishes their spots.
Yeah I just figured out the scores. They must really do something about this requirements, it´s clearly they don´t know the level of the sport. It´s crazy to also think about that the requirements will be different based on if the top skaters have a good or bad day on the ice :palmf:
 

Gia_Sesshoumaru

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Country
United-States
Yeah I just figured out the scores. They must really do something about this requirements, it´s clearly they don´t know the level of the sport. It´s crazy to also think about that the requirements will be different based on if the top skaters have a good or bad day on the ice :palmf:

To me, it's always been obvious that Sweden cares more about having a competitive skater than having a skater at the Olympics at all. It's not easy to get a spot, and it's an accomplishment to do so even if you're not top-10 material.
 

DenissVFan

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
Like wtf??? They are serious?! That´s crazy high scores, they must have been drunk while deciding the scores. I mean, i´m seriously impressed by the scores they have already achieved. Almost 200 points in the ladies field is also around the top ladies at JGP-circuit so far, and almost only achieved by the Russians except for Levito. Of course there is a bit difference on junior and senior score, but come on.

It seems like an almost impossible task and how did they even come up with those scores? The numbers seems to be super random. I´m wondering if they even want the athletes to succeed:palmf:

Only way I can see they achieve the scores must be at Nationals or at Senior B events with a very generous judges. Will Nationals scores be valid? It seems most likely now that Josefin will succeed, but she really have to start stepping up her content with triple triple and lutzes to have a shot. Lucky enough she seems to have her nerves under control.

I just had to check, not even Joshi or Victoria Helgesson was near that score. It actually seems Josefin holds the Swedish record, so this is crazy requirements.

Edit: It seems they choose the lowest score from top 8 at the recent WC. That´s just crazy.
Yeah, they want them to suddenly improve their PBs by 30 and 40 points 😱

Here's the interview I mentioned earlier. It's in Russian but if Google Translate is correct, he won't be allowed to go for experience because his application was rejected (and Josefin was out of the question because of her age...) and he has to get that score in the fall:

https://m.sport-express.ru/figure-s...-vystupit-na-olimpiade-2022-v-pekine-1806455/
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Country
United-States
For the men, Zhou has a shot at winning, but I'm honestly afraid to make predictions concerning him. Like Liu, a competent set of skates will give the US a 3rd spot easily Otherwise, based on the size of their substitute list, RUS will send whoever does well at their test skates and not necessarily Aliev (I thought since he was selected, he was suddenly doing better), but RUS has plenty of talent and should also qualify their #3. For the rest, I suppose Sadovsky Siao Him Fa (FRA), Lee (KOR), Litvintsev (AZE), Kerry (AUS) and Fentz (GER) will fight for qualification at the Olympics. But, someone is going to be left out. Sadly, I think it will be either Kerry or Fentz.
It ain't over til it's over... I want both Kerry and Fentz to make it. They are interesting skaters.

But you're right in one regard... someone... a lot of someones... isn't going to make it.

Top four on my wishlist... in no particular order... Kerry, Fentz, Sadovsky, Zhou. Of course, all these skaters are skating for national berths and still have to earn their way onto their teams, but I'm hopeful we'll see them all at the Olympics.
 

anonymoose_au

Insert weird opinion here
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Australia
To me, it's always been obvious that Sweden cares more about having a competitive skater than having a skater at the Olympics at all. It's not easy to get a spot, and it's an accomplishment to do so even if you're not top-10 material.
To this I say boo! That's not in the Olympic spirit at all. And it's not as if these are skaters don't train just as hard as the "top tier" skaters. It's rather insulting and I certainly hope no one on these countries Olympic Committees are anything less than a previous top ten contender... otherwise what are they doing with losers on their OCs? 🤬
 

DenissVFan

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
To this I say boo! That's not in the Olympic spirit at all. And it's not as if these are skaters don't train just as hard as the "top tier" skaters. It's rather insulting and I certainly hope no one on these countries Olympic Committees are anything less than a previous top ten contender... otherwise what are they doing with losers on their OCs? 🤬
It's especially frustrating knowing how hard getting an Olympic spot in figure skating is, compared to for example cross country skiing, where in some cases you can take up the sport shortly before the Olympics and still make it, depending on where you are from.
 

Gia_Sesshoumaru

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Country
United-States
A few changes:

- Anete Lace replaces Angelina Kuchvalska (LAT)
- Basar Oktar is replacing Burak Demirboga has the qualifying competitor from TUR (both are competing)
- Mark Kondratiuk is replacing Dmitri Aliev (RUS)
- Nikola Rytcharikova (CZE) withdraws. (She was a non-qualifying competitor.)
- Carolina Portesi Peroni / Michael Chratesky are replacing Carolina Moscheni / Francesco Fioretti (ITA)
 
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