2021 NHK Trophy: Pairs Short Program

[SnowWhite]

I don't think I ever really watched this team before (yes, I know, world champions, I'm not a pairs devotee): she is absolutely adorable, and he's a charmer too. I really like the choreo, and the peppy ballet.

have they always been like this?

I've always found them charming (besides the extremely ill-chosen Je Suis Malade program), but they definitely improved on the performance side after they moved to Moskvina.

I love Alexander and his lunges especially.

 

[gold12345]

I'm wondering what camera angle the tech panel had for Cain-Gribble/LeDuc's jumps. On replay, you can definitely see her toe pick down with at least a quarter turn to go. This is generally how she jumps, which is why she receives a < or q frequently. The mistake she made today was likely because she was underrotated. They got a very lucky break there to receive credit for full rotation. I don't think they were within 3 points of Miura/Kihara today, especially with the Level 1 twist that came down a bit clunky. M/K got a q on their jump which was deserved; she didn't get much lift off the ice. They also had a small error on their throw. But I would have had a slightly bigger gap between 3rd and 4th place.

 

[Seven Sisters]

Well.... prior to Moskvina, they skated to Je Suis Malade like they were waiting for a bus. [ @Seven Sisters]

You’ve seen that program, I take it. Did I lie? Be honest!

 

[skylark]

I'm wondering what camera angle the tech panel had for Cain-Gribble/LeDuc's jumps.

It's pretty clear that your agenda is to tear down Ashley and Tim, since you spent roughly 10 times the time and words on that effort that you did commenting on anyone else. Sure, you want other US teams to be ahead of them, that's obvious. But those teams aren't here.

No matter. Ashley and Timothy skated a beautiful skate. It's lovely to see them rewarded for everything that they do so well.

 

[moonvine]

Lol thanks. I wasn't sure if I was missing something obvious about its meaning.

He’s a bleeding heart and she’s heartless.

 

[labgoat]

Miura/Kihara,

That darn fingertip graze on the ice. And why is their Death Spiral only a level 3?

Oh I just love thsi Japanese team. Beautiful speed, unison, jumps, skating skills - everything. Love to watch and rewatch them. Go Team Japan!

 

[labgoat]

I really am rooting for both German teams, but they both seem to be struggling this year.

 

[Seven Sisters]

He’s a bleeding heart and she’s heartless.

But unless I’m missing something (entirely possible, of course), there nothing in the program to suggest that either is the case! There really is no emotion in it at all, as far as I can tell

 

[labgoat]

Really love Ashley & Tim's costumes - so beautiful and elegant. The program showcases them well I love how well timed the movements are to the music. I think Ashley is so anxious going into the SBS junps that it affects her timing on the takeoff. She sort of has a bit of a swing that pre-rotates her jump, but makes her slightly crooked ending short of rotation. She needs to find that sweet spot for her.

 

[labgoat]

I have agree that Mishina galliamov are the best of the event. This short is classic Moskvina, full of wonderful elements and a bit of sass.

 

[labgoat]

Tarasova & Morozov are so classically beautiful. It is interesting since I just re watched 2018 and I see little change or development in them. I don't know if they feel the pressure of expectations or are the sort of perfectionists that get down on themselves with any mistakes. Their lack of expression at times suggests they are very guarded emotionally.

 

[skylark]

I don't think I ever really watched this team before (yes, I know, world champions, I'm not a pairs devotee): she is absolutely adorable, and he's a charmer too. I really like the choreo, and the peppy ballet.

have they always been like this?

IMO, 7 minutes will tell you everything you are wanting to know about M/G! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDRfdujpMLE

The box in the 2nd half shows their teammates (captain Evgenia M.) singing along. You may notice Anastasia herself singing as she skates. She's fine with her partner being a bit of a diva. When they come off the ice, watch her while Max T. and her partner sing some sort of fight song. She is both adorable and down-to-earth; a great combination. This is from last years Channel 1 Russia team comp.

 

[LadyB]

I’ve yet to catch up with everything. Even though I’ve predicted T/M to be in the lead, I knew that M/G are on fire this season. I love both pairs. Looking forward to see R&R and Cain/Leduc, who continue their good run.

 

[gold12345]

It's pretty clear that your agenda is to tear down Ashley and Tim, since you spent roughly 10 times the time and words on that effort that you did commenting on anyone else. Sure, you want other US teams to be ahead of them, that's obvious. But those teams aren't here.

Discussing that someone underrotated a jump and that the panel may have missed it certainly isn't tearing down a skater. This is a thread about the NHK Pairs SP, it's not a Cain/LeDuc cheerleader thread. I've always been respectful of you for cheerleading for them without saying thing anything personal. I'm making educated observations about the competition I just watched and I enjoy dissecting the technical elements.

The underrotation/q call-- that Miura/Kihara received and Cain/LeDuc didn't-- ended up having an impact on today's scoring. I was very surprised by the call, or lack thereof, especially since panels have never let C/L get away with any UR at a quarter or more. She was shaky on the jump because she wasn't fully rotated. So that's why I discussed it. I also commented on a few other pairs in this event. But I'm more interested in the US pairs scene than most people, so I tend to discuss that more. Johnny Weir says that the technical panel only has one camera angle to judge rotations from (I'm wondering if this is accurate), and that there should be more. He has a point.

We all gravitate towards different pairs. I'm not nearly as into C/L as you are, and that's totally fine. C/L have some great lines and I appreciate what they do well, but I also recognize that there is no section for lines on the protocol sheet. I enjoy discussing actual aspects of the scoresheet more. I'm a bit undecided where I think C/L should fall in the US pairs pecking order at the moment. Today wasn't all that more convincing for me although they looked better than they did in their other SPs this season. I try to look at skating more objectively than subjectively. Under-rotations and elements are obviously a big part of skating and worthy of discussion.

 

[gold12345]

I'm watching Miura and Kihara again. I loved how confidently they skated. His joy coming out of the SBS spin- he just looks so happy in this program. So far at least, they seem pretty unfazed by the rising expectations they must have for themselves. She put her hand down on the throw, but picked it up fast. A couple judges gave them +3s which is too high. I thought the judges who gave it +1 were fine. So as much as I think Cain/Leduc benefited from a missed call, one could say M/K's score was a bit high too, so maybe the gap between the two teams is about right.

 

[labgoat]

ISU Videos for 2021 NHK Trophy will be found in the Grand Prix Video Archive (spoiler free)
https://www.goldenskate.com/forum/t...read-2003-present-ijs-only.88901/post-2820570

 

[rollerblade]

You’ve seen that program, I take it. Did I lie? Be honest!

Of course I've seen that expressionless Malade.... but I think your comment about the bus waiting is epic, which is why I continue to quote it when opportunity arises.

 

[skylark]

Discussing that someone underrotated a jump and that the panel may have missed it certainly isn't tearing down a skater.

It's not about my being a C-G/L cheerleader. But I said what I needed to. You may not have realized that your remarks aren't objective, but are made subjective by what you dwell on, and about whom. No big deal; carry on.

 

[Seven Sisters]

Of course I've seen that expressionless Malade.... but I think your comment about the bus waiting is epic, which is why I continue to quote it when opportunity arises.

If you thought that comment was epic, you should hang out in the competition threads more often. You probably wouldn’t believe some of the things we get up to

 

[gold12345]

It's not about my being a C-G/L cheerleader. But I said what I needed to. You may not have realized that your remarks aren't objective, but are made subjective by what you dwell on, and about whom. No big deal; carry on.

Nobody is completely objective, we all have our personal preferences. But we can still talk about skating in a more objective way and break down elements and other aspects of skating. Breaking down the skating allows us to form educated thoughts on the skaters. And we should respect each other's thoughts instead of accusing people of tearing down skaters just because it's difficult to hear something critical about a skater we like. This is the second time you've told me I was taking digs at C-G/L-- the first time I was speaking about Calalang/Johnson and merely mentioned C-G/L's name as they are in a close domestic race with them, and the second time (in this thread) I was talking about Ashley Cain's jump. Neither of these can be construed as ripping C-G/L to shreds.

This thread is for breaking down NHK Trophy, and yes, sometimes it's hard to hear critical things about our favorite skaters. Some fans only want to hear very positive and glowing things, but no skater is perfect, and competitions allow us to analyze their strengths & weaknesses, mistakes & attributes, the protocols & scores, etc. A poster mentioned that Tarasova/Morozov leave them cold. It's their opinion and I can't tell that person to not have that opinion just because I don't feel the same. I can only say why my opinion differs. Healthy debate is a good thing.

Cain/LeDuc have had under-rotation issues throughout their partnership, it's not as if I've brought up something new or I'm dwelling on something that's never been an issue. It's perfectly okay to discuss whether her jump was around or not in the SP. If you prefer to focus on other things and call her 'Ash' as if you're her personal friend, that's great and I respect you. The more pairs fans, the merrier, I feel.