Alysa Liu changes coaches and moves to Colorado Springs | Page 8 | Golden Skate

Alysa Liu changes coaches and moves to Colorado Springs

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
@anonymoose_au said:
Although this thread is already pretty horrible with all the accusations tossed at Mr Liu, just because you like and admire Jeremy and Massimo doesn't mean Mr Liu can't disagree with the direction they're taken Alysa at the moment and you certainly have no proof of what Alysa thinks either. Like way to call him an abusive father with no evidence whatsoever, that's not a damaging accusation or anything.

(y)
 

Lutzedge

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mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Your TSL assessment is spot on.
To be honest, I'd stop right there...that channel is the cesspit of figure skating, like Twitter is a haven of fair and reasonable discussion compared to the "creators" of that dumpster fire (who should have been sued and thrown out every skating rink in the world after the trash they've put out).

Although this thread is already pretty horrible with all the accusations tossed at Mr Liu, just because you like and admire Jeremy and Massimo doesn't mean Mr Liu can't disagree with the direction they're taken Alysa at the moment and you certainly have no proof of what Alysa thinks either. Like way to call him an abusive father with no evidence whatsoever, that's not a damaging accusation or anything.
Is Alysa's father also her manager? If that's the case, this move is likely good for Alysa as well. There's a possibility that Alysa was unhappy where she was and he's just making it happen. Most coaches and managers ( If they're smart ) do not take behind the scenes decisions and put them out for the public to see, until all the "I's" are dotted and "T's" are crossed.
 

gliese

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Oct 31, 2020
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So, when you’re not overweight - say you are 105 and you want to lose 10 lb (which is just a few pounds) that is 10% of your body weight and it will take severe caloric restriction and probably purging to get there because you are already at the low end of weight.
Unfortunately I can testify that this is true. The reason people resort to extreme measures is not because they want to be miserable and unhealthy. It's because they have to.
 

gliese

Final Flight
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Oct 31, 2020
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Is Alysa's father also her manager? If that's the case, this move is likely good for Alysa as well. There's a possibility that Alysa was unhappy where she was and he's just making it happen. Most coaches and managers ( If they're smart ) do not take behind the scenes decisions and put them out for the public to see, until all the "I's" are dotted and "T's" are crossed.
AND they handle it in the way that will cause the least drama. If it was stated that Alysa wanted a coaching change, that's a lot more drama in the skating world than a parent handling it all.
 

MsLayback

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Dec 20, 2017
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Unfortunately Alyssa's jumps did not last puberty.. When I saw her skate at the 2020 nationals I was very underwhelmed by her jumps were small, unimpressive and very cheated. A triple axle is supposed to be a large expansive amazing jump watching Alyssa was like wait that's a triple axel? I'm not impressed.
The US federation did her no favors overinflating her scores when it was quite obvious that once she wasn't teeny tiny pre-adolescet the lack of power and poor technique would take its toll.
 

sailormoon

On the Ice
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Aug 9, 2016
Country
Japan


Alysa needs to land the triple axel at least once in a tournament to be more competitive, which is what Wakaba Higuchi and Mana Kawabe did when they got medal in the GP Series. The triple axel is included in her free program because she is reasonably successful in landing it in practice. She could just simplify the jump entry to secure the landing and the choreography prior to the jump looks too busy and distracting.
 
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NaVi

Medalist
Joined
Oct 30, 2014
Unfortunately Alyssa's jumps did not last puberty.. When I saw her skate at the 2020 nationals I was very underwhelmed by her jumps were small, unimpressive and very cheated. A triple axle is supposed to be a large expansive amazing jump watching Alyssa was like wait that's a triple axel? I'm not impressed.
The US federation did her no favors overinflating her scores when it was quite obvious that once she wasn't teeny tiny pre-adolescet the lack of power and poor technique would take its toll.
She's got her jumps except for the 4Lz(which isn't going to happen) about back to where they were as juniors... puberty has little to do with this. She was just a few points out of a medal at NHK(sure no Russians were competing there but still).
 

skatefan17

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
It’s no different than someone in school taking advanced courses because the regular courses are too easy.

This might not work in the long run, but it’s a great sign that her and her team want to take the next step, which is thinking internationally.

We should welcome more non Russians trying to compete with Russia. She needs to consistently find 30-40 more points to get in the mix with the big girls.

Whatever the result of this experiment, good for them for seeing that what they have now is not enough, and not making excuses for that.

And willing to do more than just sit around and accept their fate. I like this attitude.
Woah for common sense! I feel like I was slapped awake, and you are right. I think any doubts come from people wanting to protect Alysa. However ultimately that is her father’s and USFS’ job- I have faith it will work out!
 

skatinggold

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
People have to realize that Alysa doesn’t want to settle without no medals in the Olympics. You work so hard for 16 years and just go to the Olympics to skate and not win anyway. Why not take the risk and at least she will have a shot at a medal if she does 2 triple axle and 2 quad lutz in her program. Take the risk and have no regrets in life. She is very capable of doing it but it is up to her. Plus, with dartfish she will know what she needs to do for her jumps to be rotated. I believe in Alysa and I know she will be able to land those ultra c elements by the Olympics. Just look at how much she improved in such a short time. She should just focus on jumps from now on. Instead of doing difficult entrances into the triple axel, maybe she could do what she was doing two years ago before when she was landing it so successfully.
 
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Joekaz

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 13, 2018
People have to realize that Alysa doesn’t want to settle without no medals in the Olympics. You work so hard for 16 years and just go to the Olympics to skate and not win anyway. Why not take the risk and at least she will have a shot at a medal if she does 2 triple axle and 2 quad lutz in her program. Take the risk and have no regrets in life. She is very capable of doing it but it is up to her. I know I am going to get toasted for this but losing a few pounds will do wonders to her jumps. Plus, with dartfish she will know what she needs to do for her jumps to be rotated. I believe in Alysa and I know she will be able to land those ultra c elements by the Olympics. Just look at how much she improved in such a short time. She should just focus on jumps from now on. Instead of doing difficult entrances into the triple axel, maybe she could do what she was doing two years ago before when she was landing it so successfully.
She has zero chance of a medal at the Olympics. She is only 16, she should just enjoy the experience, concentrate on improving, and aim for the next Olympics. She is being pushed too much this year.
 

Lutzedge

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She's got her jumps except for the 4Lz(which isn't going to happen) about back to where they were as juniors... puberty has little to do with this. She was just a few points out of a medal at NHK(sure no Russians were competing there but still).
She landed her quad lutz when she was with Lorenzo Magri in Europe, which wasn't too long ago Both her 4Lz and 3A were landed, but both UR. Her main Problem is obviously UR. Her 3A could possibly be rotated and landed next season, but she will definitely need to get her regular triples rotated. I hope things work out well with this coaching change.
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
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People have to realize that Alysa doesn’t want to settle without no medals in the Olympics. You work so hard for 16 years and just go to the Olympics to skate and not win anyway. Why not take the risk and at least she will have a shot at a medal if she does 2 triple axle and 2 quad lutz in her program. Take the risk and have no regrets in life. She is very capable of doing it but it is up to her. I know I am going to get toasted for this but losing a few pounds will do wonders to her jumps. Plus, with dartfish she will know what she needs to do for her jumps to be rotated. I believe in Alysa and I know she will be able to land those ultra c elements by the Olympics. Just look at how much she improved in such a short time. She should just focus on jumps from now on. Instead of doing difficult entrances into the triple axel, maybe she could do what she was doing two years ago before when she was landing it so successfully.
She will not get a quad lutz back in a few weeks. She does not need to lose weight. She is not winning a medal at the Olympics other than having a good chance for a team medal (which is still a medal).
 

ribbit

On the Ice
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Nov 9, 2014
@skatinggold: A similar and equally despicable suggestion regarding Alysa's weight was made in the US Women's thread. This needs to stop.

First, simply losing weight does not lead to successful jumping. In the long term, skaters rotate and land their jumps when they have enough power to gain the height/air time required to rotate fully. Power means muscle mass and the ability to use it to the fullest. In fact, there are examples of skaters (Tanith Belbin comes to mind) who have spoken of being more successful once they had gained enough weight to build more core strength.

Second, neither you nor I nor anyone on this or any other internet forum has any idea of Alysa's weight, or her ideal weight, or her eating habits. None of us has any business suggesting that she or any other skater should change her weight or her eating habits. I hope these suggestions will never reach Alysa, but they do reach other readers and contribute to a larger culture. They can do real damage to the people – especially young people – who do read them, and pick up the idea that success and acceptance come from losing weight, or that their self-esteem should be founded on low weight. And they do real damage by perpetrating the myth that thin=healthy, that only thin people are healthy, that somehow we have the right to shame people – worse, that it is morally virtuous, or for people's own good, to shame them – for being what we imagine, again with no knowledge whatsoever, to be not thin enough. This does not create a healthy culture, or a culture of health.

Thin is not necessarily healthy. Thinner is not necessarily better. None of us has the right to make ignorant assumptions about strangers' bodies. None of us has the right to give ignorant and potentially damaging advice to strangers. We should all think before we speak (and post).
 

SNAKSuyun

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 23, 2018
Country
China
The chances of Alysa getting an individual medal at the Olympics are minimal. I do not see her beating any of the Russian ladies, unless she herself skates lights out (landing and fully rotating all her triples PLUS 3A + 4 Lz) AND the Russians fall on multiple jumps. There is just that big of a TES and PCS cushion for all the Russian ladies. As much as Alysa delights, and as much as she may work on - and even land - her ultra c elements, she just does not stand out in this current field (even next to the Japanese ladies or someone like You Young and Loena Hendrickx), and her youth and lack of explosive power (even on her regular triples) will be liabilities that cannot be fixed in just a few months.
 

Flying Feijoa

On the Ice
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Sep 22, 2019
Country
New-Zealand
Fixing technique/timing would go way further towards solving her URs than weight loss. Just to illustrate this point, neither Marin Honda nor Wakaba Higuchi are immune to URs, but in the years since their World Junior medals, their careers have taken drastically different trajectories. Wakaba just won a GP medal while Marin just scraped through to Nationals, which is I think the clearest indication that technique > 'ideal' physique. (Just to add, it's far from my intention to shame any skater for their physique - both Marin and Wakaba are beautiful, healthy young women.)
So yes, Dartfish would help. Although it's hardly exclusive to Colorado Springs (plus, doesn't the more widespread/economical practice of taking slow-mo iPad videos give a similar benefit?)
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
Record Breaker
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Mar 14, 2007
Country
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@skatinggold: A similar and equally despicable suggestion regarding Alysa's weight was made in the US Women's thread. This needs to stop.

First, simply losing weight does not lead to successful jumping. In the long term, skaters rotate and land their jumps when they have enough power to gain the height/air time required to rotate fully. Power means muscle mass and the ability to use it to the fullest. In fact, there are examples of skaters (Tanith Belbin comes to mind) who have spoken of being more successful once they had gained enough weight to build more core strength.

Second, neither you nor I nor anyone on this or any other internet forum has any idea of Alysa's weight, or her ideal weight, or her eating habits. None of us has any business suggesting that she or any other skater should change her weight or her eating habits. I hope these suggestions will never reach Alysa, but they do reach other readers and contribute to a larger culture. They can do real damage to the people – especially young people – who do read them, and pick up the idea that success and acceptance come from losing weight, or that their self-esteem should be founded on low weight. And they do real damage by perpetrating the myth that thin=healthy, that only thin people are healthy, that somehow we have the right to shame people – worse, that it is morally virtuous, or for people's own good, to shame them – for being what we imagine, again with no knowledge whatsoever, to be not thin enough. This does not create a healthy culture, or a culture of health.

Thin is not necessarily healthy. Thinner is not necessarily better. None of us has the right to make ignorant assumptions about strangers' bodies. None of us has the right to give ignorant and potentially damaging advice to strangers. We should all think before we speak (and post).
Thank you…it’s just unreal how these suggestions are so casually tossed around.

It’s my understanding that at one point Tanith was eating a handful of nuts (only) a day and was too weak to assist Ben with the lifts.

I know Ashley has spoken about problems in this area also.

And Gracie has said she started skating worse (because she was weaker) and people continued to praise her for weight loss.

You’re so correct about power coming from muscle mass and when one has no fat left to burn their bodies start burning muscle, including heart muscle.

One wouldn’t think it to look at me but before I became disabled I was a therapist and I know something about eating disorders. It doesn’t seem like it’s a bad idea to implant ideas in skaters heads that weight loss = better skating. But it absolutely is.

I hope Alysa is in a good situation In Colorado Springs and that she gets the results she is looking for.
 

mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
is @skatinggold: A similar and equally despicable suggestion regarding Alysa's weight was made in the US Women's thread. This needs to stop.

First, simply losing weight does not lead to successful jumping. In the long term, skaters rotate and land their jumps when they have enough power to gain the height/air time required to rotate fully. Power means muscle mass and the ability to use it to the fullest. In fact, there are examples of skaters (Tanith Belbin comes to mind) who have spoken of being more successful once they had gained enough weight to build more core strength.

Second, neither you nor I nor anyone on this or any other internet forum has any idea of Alysa's weight, or her ideal weight, or her eating habits. None of us has any business suggesting that she or any other skater should change her weight or her eating habits. I hope these suggestions will never reach Alysa, but they do reach other readers and contribute to a larger culture. They can do real damage to the people – especially young people – who do read them, and pick up the idea that success and acceptance come from losing weight, or that their self-esteem should be founded on low weight. And they do real damage by perpetrating the myth that thin=healthy, that only thin people are healthy, that somehow we have the right to shame people – worse, that it is morally virtuous, or for people's own good, to shame them – for being what we imagine, again with no knowledge whatsoever, to be not thin enough. This does not create a healthy culture, or a culture of health.

Thin is not necessarily healthy. Thinner is not necessarily better. None of us has the right to make ignorant assumptions about strangers' bodies. None of us has the right to give ignorant and potentially damaging advice to strangers. We should all think before we speak (and post).
This is true. Tonya Harding looked like she was really thick until I saw her in person. Muscle weighs more than fat and if a skater goes on a crash diet, there's a chance they'll lose muscle as well. Stamina will also become an issue if she tries a crash diet while she's in intense training for Nationals and the Olympics.
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
Country
United-States
This is true. Tonya Harding looked like she was really thick until I saw her in person. Muscle weighs more than fat and if a skater goes on a crash diet, there's a chance they'll lose muscle as well. Stamina will also become an issue if she tries a crash diet while she's in intense training for Nationals and the Olympics.
They are all tiny in person. All the singles skaters. The pairs guys can be taller and more muscular.
 
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