Brand New Ideas for Programs

eppen

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Kate Bush's Running up that hill

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp43OdtAAkM

or the classic Wuthering Heights

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk-4lXLM34g

and for covers and rock lovers...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qrtf43qANkE

I am generally very happy that my favourite music does very rarely feature in FS programs. So, I almost wanna ask you to delete this post or at least modify the content not to include Kate... ;) So far the only program with her music that I can remember is Victoria Helgesson's This Woman's Work which was an ok cut - well, it did not make me wanna kill het right away at least. The way music gets treated in the hands of choreographers and people who do the cuts is cruel in general and I would not like to see Kate get treated like that.

Those song are perhaps a little monotonous for making one program, maybe a short from Wuthering Heights. But the kind of "let's take 3 (almost) random songs from artist/band x and call that a program" is definitely out of the question here... They never ever make good watching.

But if I would suggest sth for Kate, I'd go with The Man with the Child in his Eyes from her first album or Don't Push Your Foot on the Heartbrake from the second one. Or for an adventurous skater, a medley of the B side of the Hounds of Love album which is (apparently) a themed set of songs describing a woman drowning under ice - and I am serious about this, because the songs are just amazing!

Also, I am happy that the only song by Björk ever really to get used in FS is It's Oh So Quiet which is not one of my big faves. But Joga from Homogenic would be a perfect SP with just cutting away the last 30 s. An adventurous male skater might go for Venus as a Boy from the first album...

But mostly I would just prefer that these two women (and lots of others) would remain totally out of the minds of choreographers, coaches etc.

E
 

Ic3Rabbit

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I am generally very happy that my favourite music does very rarely feature in FS programs. So, I almost wanna ask you to delete this post or at least modify the content not to include Kate... ;) So far the only program with her music that I can remember is Victoria Helgesson's This Woman's Work which was an ok cut - well, it did not make me wanna kill het right away at least. The way music gets treated in the hands of choreographers and people who do the cuts is cruel in general and I would not like to see Kate get treated like that.

Those song are perhaps a little monotonous for making one program, maybe a short from Wuthering Heights. But the kind of "let's take 3 (almost) random songs from artist/band x and call that a program" is definitely out of the question here... They never ever make good watching.

But if I would suggest sth for Kate, I'd go with The Man with the Child in his Eyes from her first album or Don't Push Your Foot on the Heartbrake from the second one. Or for an adventurous skater, a medley of the B side of the Hounds of Love album which is (apparently) a themed set of songs describing a woman drowning under ice - and I am serious about this, because the songs are just amazing!

Also, I am happy that the only song by Björk ever really to get used in FS is It's Oh So Quiet which is not one of my big faves. But Joga from Homogenic would be a perfect SP with just cutting away the last 30 s. An adventurous male skater might go for Venus as a Boy from the first album...

But mostly I would just prefer that these two women (and lots of others) would remain totally out of the minds of choreographers, coaches etc.

E

First of all, blame the music editing experts for killing the music you love and editing it beyond recognition. Don't always blame the choreographers because it's not their idea most of the time to have the music butchered (well depending on the the choreographer). Lastly, Bjork has been used beyond "it's oh so quiet."
As for Kate, Rosalynn Sumners and I believe Elaine Zayak used her music (Sumners- This womans work).
 

eppen

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First of all, blame the music editing experts for killing the music you love and editing it beyond recognition. Don't always blame the choreographers because it's not their idea most of the time to have the music butchered (well depending on the the choreographer). Lastly, Bjork has been used beyond "it's oh so quiet."
As for Kate, Rosalynn Sumners and I believe Elaine Zayak used her music (Sumners- This womans work).

Should have maybe specified that I was thinking of exclusively in competition programs - whatever happens with gala or show programs really does not have any effect on me (don't watch them at all if I can avoid). However, in shows music does get treated differently and the cuts are usually more about length, not so much about slashing it into bits and pieces to make a competition program to fit time and content limitations. Like this program by Daisuke Takahashi to Björk's Bachelorette - here the problem for me is the lyrical content which is strictly first person female point of view and Daisuke skating it is really not necessarily the best fit (ignoring lyrics when they have been included in the music is not one of the things I like). But the song has been used as it was on Homogenic apart from minor infractions (for example around 1:50). I can listen to it without wanting to hit anyone.

The ban on lyrics and vocals until fall 2014 in singles and pairs did not favor using Kate or Björk as their voices are such an essential part of the music that using even instrumental versions seems to have been a no-no.

The responsibility of mishandling the music is IMO in the hands of the people who decide which bits and pieces get used and that is mostly the coaches and choreographers, in some cases maybe also the skaters themselves. The editor - if truly professional and knowledgeable of musical theory, structure and preferably also the language any lyrics are sung in - can actually save the cut from the worst excesses by suggesting tweaks in what need to be done. In the best of cases it is a discussion and collaboration between the two to produce ok results. But in the end, the editor does not decide what goes into the program, that is someone else. Also, not everyone can afford a pro to do the job and with the possibilities afforded by digital music and software, many probably dabble with the music themselves.

One of my least favorite uses of It's Oh So Quiet is my Miriam Ziegler and Severin Kiefer (AUT) and their short from 2015-6. I had to look it up and the choreo is apparently by Mark Pillay who is not half bad as a choreographer. Still they came up with a cut that in many parts skips and hops uncomprehensibly from one part of the song to another. That song is super simple lyrically, but even that was mangled.

Another horror case for me was Madison Chock & Evan Bates skating to Under Pressure by Queen and David Bowie. And I really don't have very strong feelings for that song. The song as it was released back in the day would almost have been ok for a 4 min program, but they chose to remix it using all sorts of weird versions (incl. song tracks on their own) and the end result is pretty terrible IMO. Christopher Dean in the lead here - I would imagine they were using a pro to edit, but would also hazard a guess that the ideas of what to do with the music came from him and not from the editor.

But in the end, as I said, the music I feel strongly about does not get used in competition programs (except very very very rarely) and I can let the things done to the other songs mostly just go in one ear and out the other.

Add - just to show that not everything is crap in my ears, a positive example. David Wilson/Jeffrey Buttle collaborating with Hugo Chouinard. The idea of the music came from Brian Orser (according to Javi he heard it played it at a rink and thought it could be a good choice for Javi). Black Betty by Ram Jam is not something I would listen to usually, but when I first heard it in the fall of 2014, I was pleasantly surprised to hear a rock song that is not Queen/Scorpions/Metallica/ACDC. The cut maintains the song structure but uses only one verse and chorus - and the verse is the second one with less weird content than the first. The original album version gets a little boring quickly, but I think they actually used a 2:24 long version of the song (a radio edit?) as a sort of a guideline for the cut and it works pretty good keeping the dynamic going for the program. There have been other programs made of the song, but these usually miss at least the lyrical content of the first verse.

E
 
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Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
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I think the Phantom Thread score could make a gorgeous program to skate to. It’s so lush and elegant.
https://youtu.be/bT_XjcdgT6g
https://youtu.be/8pGCLf5Ufgg

The fan in me would just die for a Legend if Korra program
https://youtu.be/CjbTEqSdZG4
https://youtu.be/snm0heTJ7lg

Sui/Han should do a Korra/Avatar themed program, either portraying all 4 elements together in sections across the program, or each simultaneously portraying an opposing element, in each half of the program. He's-the-earth-She's-the-wind / He's-the-water-She's-the-fire. :coffee:

Phantom Thread could be great for someone too.

Also, why have we not seen Downton Abbey used by any notable competitor? That main theme is so powerful, elegantly and wistfully so.
 

Ic3Rabbit

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Should have maybe specified that I was thinking of exclusively in competition programs - whatever happens with gala or show programs really does not have any effect on me (don't watch them at all if I can avoid). However, in shows music does get treated differently and the cuts are usually more about length, not so much about slashing it into bits and pieces to make a competition program to fit time and content limitations. Like this program by Daisuke Takahashi to Björk's Bachelorette - here the problem for me is the lyrical content which is strictly first person female point of view and Daisuke skating it is really not necessarily the best fit (ignoring lyrics when they have been included in the music is not one of the things I like). But the song has been used as it was on Homogenic apart from minor infractions (for example around 1:50). I can listen to it without wanting to hit anyone.

The ban on lyrics and vocals until fall 2014 in singles and pairs did not favor using Kate or Björk as their voices are such an essential part of the music that using even instrumental versions seems to have been a no-no.

The responsibility of mishandling the music is IMO in the hands of the people who decide which bits and pieces get used and that is mostly the coaches and choreographers, in some cases maybe also the skaters themselves. The editor - if truly professional and knowledgeable of musical theory, structure and preferably also the language any lyrics are sung in - can actually save the cut from the worst excesses by suggesting tweaks in what need to be done. In the best of cases it is a discussion and collaboration between the two to produce ok results. But in the end, the editor does not decide what goes into the program, that is someone else. Also, not everyone can afford a pro to do the job and with the possibilities afforded by digital music and software, many probably dabble with the music themselves.

One of my least favorite uses of It's Oh So Quiet is my Miriam Ziegler and Severin Kiefer (AUT) and their short from 2015-6. I had to look it up and the choreo is apparently by Mark Pillay who is not half bad as a choreographer. Still they came up with a cut that in many parts skips and hops uncomprehensibly from one part of the song to another. That song is super simple lyrically, but even that was mangled.

Another horror case for me was Madison Chock & Evan Bates skating to Under Pressure by Queen and David Bowie. And I really don't have very strong feelings for that song. The song as it was released back in the day would almost have been ok for a 4 min program, but they chose to remix it using all sorts of weird versions (incl. song tracks on their own) and the end result is pretty terrible IMO. Christopher Dean in the lead here - I would imagine they were using a pro to edit, but would also hazard a guess that the ideas of what to do with the music came from him and not from the editor.

But in the end, as I said, the music I feel strongly about does not get used in competition programs (except very very very rarely) and I can let the things done to the other songs mostly just go in one ear and out the other.

Add - just to show that not everything is crap in my ears, a positive example. David Wilson/Jeffrey Buttle collaborating with Hugo Chouinard. The idea of the music came from Brian Orser (according to Javi he heard it played it at a rink and thought it could be a good choice for Javi). Black Betty by Ram Jam is not something I would listen to usually, but when I first heard it in the fall of 2014, I was pleasantly surprised to hear a rock song that is not Queen/Scorpions/Metallica/ACDC. The cut maintains the song structure but uses only one verse and chorus - and the verse is the second one with less weird content than the first. The original album version gets a little boring quickly, but I think they actually used a 2:24 long version of the song (a radio edit?) as a sort of a guideline for the cut and it works pretty good keeping the dynamic going for the program. There have been other programs made of the song, but these usually miss at least the lyrical content of the first verse.

E

I've done parts of the process (some myself, some with an editor) as a skater and now a professional and I know how it works and don't need the 411 on it.
I'm just saying don't blame the choreographers all the time and also, I know you are talking about competitive.
 

CaroLiza_fan

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A few days ago, I watched the film "Belle" (2013). And while listening to the music during the end credits, I was picturing it being skated to in my head. And I do think it would work very well.

Here is the YouTube playlist for the soundtrack:

Rachel Portman - "Belle" OST

Sorry, but I can't say off the top of my head what pieces were played, or in what order. And I can't check, because I deleted the film after watching it. :bang:

Incidentally, the film was VERY good! :agree: :biggrin:

CaroLiza_fan
 

Harriet

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A few days ago, I watched the film "Belle" (2013). And while listening to the music during the end credits, I was picturing it being skated to in my head. And I do think it would work very well.

Here is the YouTube playlist for the soundtrack:

Rachel Portman - "Belle" OST

Sorry, but I can't say off the top of my head what pieces were played, or in what order. And I can't check, because I deleted the film after watching it. :bang:

Incidentally, the film was VERY good! :agree: :biggrin:

CaroLiza_fan

That's one of my favourite soundtracks; I frequently listen to it while I'm working. And I would definitely love to see a certain person skate to it. :)
 

Bluediamonds09

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“I See Fire” cover of an Ed Sheeran song sung by opera group Zyrah (Zyrah Rose?). Very dramatic and powerful.
 

Harriet

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For various reasons, I've recently been reminded of the existence of the bizarre little Australian musical Keating! The Musical* and now I'm really wishing that one of the Aussie ice dance teams would pop up with a brand-new RD using 'The Ruler of the Land', 'The Light on the Hill' and 'The A*** End of the Earth'. Of course, they'd have to bleep out some of the lyrics in that last one, but that's just Keating for you. :laugh:

*If Lin-Manuel Miranda thought he was the first to come up with the idea of a political debate as a rap battle, he was wrong. And ours is funnier. Particularly because at least half the lyrics in 'On the Floor' are verbatim Keating quotes!
 

Seren

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I always wanted to compete a Long Program to Gattaca (by Michael Nyman, here's a sample), never got the chance. As far as I know, no skater has ever used this music. I've never shared my 4:30 cut of the soundtrack or tried to alter it for someone else, but probably by now I should. The music is haunting and inspirational, one of the best film scores ever in my opinion (the film is excellent too), and would go well not only with skating movements, but also if you've seen the film, the entire competitive mindset and drive to get through a Long Program.

Gattaca is one of my favorite films. The soundtrack is really beautiful. I never thought of it as a skating program but I'm sure it would have been beautiful!
 

Bluediamonds09

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Hadestown soundtrack. It’s relatively new. Probably would work best in ice dance.

Please just something different!
 

Ic3Rabbit

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