hurting soles and no support; new boots | Page 2 | Golden Skate

hurting soles and no support; new boots

gliese

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 31, 2020
Country
United-States
This is getting off topic, but know that weight loss will not magically improve your skating. That logic has pushed so many into disordered eating patterns and eating disorders when it's literally not true. While weight impacts performance (sometimes by a lot as Sandra said), it's rarely at the forefront of an issue.

Weight should be kept between a doctor and patient and sometimes a coach educated in health. Without a qualification or education in the health field, no one has any business telling anyone that they need to gain or lose weight.

Skaters, if your coach is telling you that you need to lose weight to land a jump or skate better, find a new coach and check in with a doctor if you're concerned about your weight.
 

muzichips

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
Update: I went to a podiatrist to check my feet this week, finally. Despite going to my doctor and physiotherapist 6 months ago it turns out my feet are the source of all my issues with my knees and ankles. My arch and ankles "fall" to the inside of my feet which causes my knees to do the same. I also have super narrow ankles and she says that the skates I have now (Edea overture) are way way too wide at the ankle. Tomorrow I'll be going to a pro shop to try on some skates. My podiatrist said she will not make insoles for my skates, only my regular shoes, but if after purchasing new skates I still feel a lot of pain she will look into any modifications we could make, but both of us don't want to get to that point and hope I can get skates that fit me.
 

bostonskaterguy86

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 3, 2018
Country
United-States
My arch and ankles "fall" to the inside of my feet which causes my knees to do the same.

It sounds like you're describing pronation - is that what the podiatrist called it, by any chance? If so - it's not an uncommon issue at all, I have it too!

Getting the right boot is definitely the best thing to do for it. My tech also adjusted my blade placement and it helped a lot - if you pronate inwards, the center of balance for your foot is a little further inside, so moving the blades inward to match will help you balance over the blade more easily. I struggled a lot with one-foot glides and outside edges at first - but once my tech moved the blades they improved, and it relieved some ankle pain I'd been having too.

Good luck!
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Update: I went to a podiatrist to check my feet this week, finally. Despite going to my doctor and physiotherapist 6 months ago it turns out my feet are the source of all my issues with my knees and ankles. My arch and ankles "fall" to the inside of my feet which causes my knees to do the same. I also have super narrow ankles and she says that the skates I have now (Edea overture) are way way too wide at the ankle. Tomorrow I'll be going to a pro shop to try on some skates. My podiatrist said she will not make insoles for my skates, only my regular shoes, but if after purchasing new skates I still feel a lot of pain she will look into any modifications we could make, but both of us don't want to get to that point and hope I can get skates that fit me.
I find it a little odd that your podiatrist would make orthotics for your street shoes but not your skating boots. Does she have experience with skaters? Although some modifications for pronation can be done externally (for example, moving blades), many times skaters who pronate need to wear orthotics in their boots (either custom or something like super feet) - not necessarily because they have pain but because they struggle with things like outside edges. Obviously you should listen to your doctor, but just know that if you buy boots that fit without an orthotic and then find you need one, the boot may be too small to accommodate the orthotic.
 

Sunshine247

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
So, my daughter has been struggling with pronation as well. We discovered that she had warped her boots sideways rather than breaking them down in the traditional way. So while we are getting new boots, we are working on similar issues.

She was evaluated by a specialist in orthotics for skating, and she will be doing physical therapy in addition to the custom insoles with a slight correction. We will also carefully mount her blades and continue to monitor the effect of the small changes.

I understand why your podiatrist would be hesitant to work with your skates. A podiatrist différés from an orthopedist. An orthopedist more likely concentrates on biomechanics. And there’s also special training for making orthotics. And specialties within that even.

Since it is a common problem, ask around for skaters that have had similar issues. Your fitter and skate tech have probably helped others with the same issue. And skaters weirdly like to talk about their feet and their skates. lol. We were able to find the PT and the orthotics specialist that way. You could possibly find a stock insole that provides relief in addition to choosing well fitted boots.

It will also help to move your blade as others have mentioned. Bring your issue to the attention of the tech mounting your blades. Make sure your blade is only mounted with a temporary mount at first so small adjustments can be made before the final screws go in. Typically my skaters blades are mounted at a specific appointment where the tech évaluâtes them first.

Take time to evaluate each correction. It will be worth the time you put in up front. All those small adjustments can really have a big impact. It seems like you’re on the right track, good luck with your new skates!
 

muzichips

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
And another update: I just got back from my skate tech, and turns out I was wearing half a size too big, which added to all my pain I was experiencing. We talked about my feet and asked what he thought would be best for me. I tried on risports, but my little toes were uncomfortable, I couldn't try on any jacksons but he said that those would most likely be a little too wide for me and we decided to go back to trying on Edea's. I tried on some skates and we came to the conclusion Edea Ice fly's are the boots that simply fit all my needs and really sit nicely on my feet. He told me that with my ankle and need for extra support (he and my podiatrist agree on that) he said that getting a slightly stiffer boot could do the trick for me.

My current skates came with their own blades and there was no mounting required from my tech. (I changed techs by the way, I went to a better tech today) I haven't had any issues with balance or edges, despite my pronation. There is still 2 to 3 months left until I can actually buy and pick up my skates, since it's a birthday present. I'm currently wearing regular/thick socks and bunga pads to try to get my ankles to be secure in my skates. This was recommended to me by my doctor.

I don't know how much experience my podiatrist has with figure skaters, but she seemed quite confident in her knowledge. The main reason she doesn't want to make orthodics for my skates is because it will make the skates like blocks on my feet. She says that when we jump, we get the power from our knees and feet. By adding an insole into my skates, in my case I will lose most of my ability to get a good "jump movement". Once I get my skates and I find that the pain in my feet remains, she will try to modify the soles a little, but not as much as adding an orthodic. But this is all very personal and if she says that that's right for me, I trust her judgement.

So far I can't tell what will work for me but by consulting with my doctor, tech and coaches I think I'm definitely going in the right direction.
 

Sunshine247

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
@muzichips The skate orthotics specialist said something similar to what your podiatrist did. There is a lot of complicated movement that comes from your feet and ankles so it could simply be that for you less is more. The trick is to provide enough support and control movement just enough. Properly sized boots is a big deal right there. My skater is getting a minimally corrective insole. So your foot is obviously different and a lot will be corrected with proper sizing. Just don’t dismiss using an insole If you still have problems. Many many skaters use them. Especially in Edea. My daughter has been in Edea and Jackson both. Oddly, a similar situation with oversized Jackson’s too. Jackson might want to look into their training. good luck with your new skates.
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
Hi! I'm an almost 16 y/o , average ish height but on the heavier side than girls my age. I went back on the ice last summer after a 3 year long break, but because I did synchro before I quit I'm only doing singles and the basic spins, although progressing quickly! I'm working on axels and combination spins, and I'm already almost there. I have pretty deep edges because of my synchro carreer. I'm currently in Edea Overture, but I've had several issues with them.

- I have broken them down in less than 6 months. I didn't expect them to last me forever but this was a little faster than anticipated
- Even before I broke them down, I didn't feel like I had enough support when jumping and doing steps, lately I've had to tie them so super tight (even at the top) to even to keep my balance. And from what I know, this isn't how it's supposed to be.
- You know that feeling when you've walked several hours, hiking for example, and your feet hurt at their soles? I get that kind of pain after a few minutes of skating, especially if I skate on 1 foot for a long time (spins and steps)
- Sometimes it feels like the Edeas are too wide for me. It's not that my feet are falling out of them, but a less extreme version of it.

I'm planning to keep skating for many years, so I'd rather invest in a little bit of a stiffer boot than have to buy new ones every year. I definitely am getting new blades (currently stock blades from edea), the CorAce is what I'll probably get. I don't think I wanna continue wearing Edeas, so I'm considering Risports and maybe Jacksons. I will get fitted and try on different skates, but only in May ish. So I've been doing my own research on boots to know what to consider. My current picks are risport rf3pro, risport royal pro and maybe elite(because I broke my boots down so fast and am afraid my new ones will be the same), Jackson fs2800 premiere fusion and Jackson debut fusion firm fs2450. Where I live no one sells riedells, grafs or other brands I didn't mention, so I don't have the opportunity to try them on and thus don't consider them at all. Does anyone have any advice for me?

I wear Risport Royal Pro. They last me about 12-15months.

I am 140lbs and I have axel and dbl Sal. Lately I’ve been working on/landed a couple dbl flip and dbl lutz. These boots have plenty of support for these jumps at my weight. I skate 10hrs/wk so 15 months is pretty good for that frequency.
You don’t need the Elite. Also, these are best boots in the world and I will never shut up about them. I LOVE my boots and I will never wear anything else. I went through customs Jackson’s and custom Harlicks and they were awful and now no one will take my Risports from me lol. Thanks IceRabbit 😉😂
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
@muzichips @Sunshine247 I don't quite understand the thinking on the orthotics, I've worn orthotics in my skates for over 20 years and they were recommended and "prescribed" by an orthopedist. They don't affect my jumps (triple triples), nor do they bother my ice dancing technique.

@Nimyue You're welcome! ;)
 

shumaislife

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
@muzichips @Sunshine247 I don't quite understand the thinking on the orthotics, I've worn orthotics in my skates for over 20 years and they were recommended and "prescribed" by an orthopedist. They don't affect my jumps (triple triples), nor do they bother my ice dancing technique.

@Nimyue You're welcome! ;)
I also want to understand more as to why the podiatrists steered them away from orthotics. But what I do know is every professional opinion differs... and some are more valid than others. It's totally possible that a different provider would have the opposite recommendation after seeing the same foot and ankle.

Another thing: While custom orthotics can be soft or hard, many I've seen designed to prevent pronation are very rigid and have no flex (on purpose). While that may fix the pronation to the delight of many athletes, others face a difficult time adjusting to the loss of flex. Maybe that was what the podiatrists were referring to?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
I also want to understand more as to why the podiatrists steered them away from orthotics. But what I do know is every professional opinion differs... and some are more valid than others. It's totally possible that a different provider would have the opposite recommendation after seeing the same foot and ankle.

Another thing: While custom orthotics can be soft or hard, many I've seen designed to prevent pronation are very rigid and have no flex (on purpose). While that may fix the pronation to the delight of many athletes, others face a difficult time adjusting to the loss of flex. Maybe that was what the podiatrists were referring to?
I had some of the best orthopedists, so I still question it.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
I recently got orthotics as was getting pain in the ball of my foot (apparently due to high arches and stock insoles not providing enough arch support). It was like magic lol, pain completely gone. Have had them about six weeks now and jumps have improved. So yes, I am also curious about being told not to wear orthotics in skates.
 

Sunshine247

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
I wanted to clear up that the orthopedic specialist recommended a correction that was a premade insole and not a custom orthotic. It was the recommendation to start there. She modified the insole to fit snugly within her skate so that she could have the benefit of a mild correction. and also some shock absorption. There is a rigid section along the arch and a section that prevents pronation along the inside edge of the arch. So she is getting correction with her insole. Just not a custom orthotic. I was trying to Specify it was an commonly available product rather than a custom made option. But I probably didn’t explain well. So yes. There will be correction! And there was lots of advice about ankle and foot mobility and expertises to make the foot and ankle work better together. There will also be some PT and not just the insole.
 

muzichips

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
I also want to understand more as to why the podiatrists steered them away from orthotics. But what I do know is every professional opinion differs... and some are more valid than others. It's totally possible that a different provider would have the opposite recommendation after seeing the same foot and ankle.

Another thing: While custom orthotics can be soft or hard, many I've seen designed to prevent pronation are very rigid and have no flex (on purpose). While that may fix the pronation to the delight of many athletes, others face a difficult time adjusting to the loss of flex. Maybe that was what the podiatrists were referring to?
Yes, this is what I think my podiatrist was referring to. I am currently easing into wearing my insoles in my regular shoes, and they are so super stiff and hard, it can feel like I'm walking on one of those rocky beaches or needles. And this is the case for most people with the same issue I have. I can hardly imagine myself putting anything like my insoles in my skates.
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Yes, this is what I think my podiatrist was referring to. I am currently easing into wearing my insoles in my regular shoes, and they are so super stiff and hard, it can feel like I'm walking on one of those rocky beaches or needles. And this is the case for most people with the same issue I have. I can hardly imagine myself putting anything like my insoles in my skates.
It sounds like perhaps your condition requires a different kind of orthotics than the ones I’m used to. I pronate pretty badly in both feet, and mine have always had a harder heel cup but they are soft and flexible in the forefoot. I’ve had several different pairs, and none of them required an extended break in period, nor were they ever stiff, hard, and uncomfortable in the way you describe.
 

MCsAngel2

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 10, 2019
Country
Scotland
Yes, this is what I think my podiatrist was referring to. I am currently easing into wearing my insoles in my regular shoes, and they are so super stiff and hard, it can feel like I'm walking on one of those rocky beaches or needles. And this is the case for most people with the same issue I have. I can hardly imagine myself putting anything like my insoles in my skates.
What type of insoles are you wearing? Because this sounds like the experience I had with yellow superfeet, which everyone said was for figure skates. Except, they aren't, they are made for feet with high arches. I have flat feet, and the correct superfeet insoles for flat feet are black superfeet. The yellow ones made my soles feel like they were being stabbed by knives. Corrective insoles should not hurt at all, if they do you've got the wrong type.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
What type of insoles are you wearing? Because this sounds like the experience I had with yellow superfeet, which everyone said was for figure skates. Except, they aren't, they are made for feet with high arches. I have flat feet, and the correct superfeet insoles for flat feet are black superfeet. The yellow ones made my soles feel like they were being stabbed by knives. Corrective insoles should not hurt at all, if they do you've got the wrong type.
I tried the yellow superfeet (I have high arches) and absolutely hated them. Wonder what sort of people they work for. I have orthotics now that are structured but quite squishy and very comfortable. Supports the arch and ball of the foot, where I was getting pain. They also aren’t too thick. I was baffled how people wear the superfeet as I found the heels so thick they pitched my balance way too far forward.
 

Flying Feijoa

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 22, 2019
Country
New-Zealand
I tried the yellow superfeet (I have high arches) and absolutely hated them. Wonder what sort of people they work for. I have orthotics now that are structured but quite squishy and very comfortable. Supports the arch and ball of the foot, where I was getting pain. They also aren’t too thick. I was baffled how people wear the superfeet as I found the heels so thick they pitched my balance way too far forward.
I have medium collapsible arches and tried the yellow superfeet briefly (in between 2 different custom orthotics). Arch itself felt ok, but the lack of cushioning at the ball of the foot hurt my metatarsal heads over time. I think flexible-flat-arched people might be more tolerant to the arch height of over-the-counter orthotics than rigid feet, flat or archy. However, most OTC orthotics won't fit skates - they're often too high-volume and don't lie flush with the footbed due to the boot's raised heel. Yellow superfeet are designed to fit skates by being thinner and having a heel drop, but I wonder if they might have overcompensated a bit...

My first skate orthotics were made by a podiatrist who'd never encountered patients that skate. They had the same arch height as my regular orthotics and had extra material underneath to make the underside flat. My current skate orthotics, made by a podiatrist whose kid does synchro, are a lot flatter than my street orthotics and don't have that extra material - it's just a plastic shell running underfoot with some plush foam layers on the upper surface. The reduced motion control felt a bit weird at first, but it did resolve some foot issues. I might double-check with an orthopedist some day.
 

tinna

Spectator
Joined
Dec 15, 2018
Hi, I had Edea Overture, and the boots broke down in about eight or nine months. I am an adult skater of light build (50-52kg) and was only doing single jumps at the time. So six months sounds about right to me.
I have heard from several at my rink that the Overture breaks down really fast. Overture might be worth it for kids, but not for adults or bigger teens.
 
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