Technique help -- explain to me like i'm 5 | Golden Skate

Technique help -- explain to me like i'm 5

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
I feel like this is one of those complex situations to gauge out without proper examination so i'm going to try my best to explain it in words and if anyone would like to see any videos for more isolated responses, I can respond with my skating instagram handle! So i'm not necessarily a beginner adult skater, I skated for quite a while as a kid (more seriously than recreational skating but enough to be competitive) to return later as an adult. Before I quit, I was learning (well, more like struggling) on axel, double sal and toe at the same time. Returning as an adult, its hard and complex because a lot of the bigger movements, like jumping, spins, etc, are not that scary or unnormal to me, but God the basics... I was taught the basics a while ago..like a long time. I first took lessons at 7, quit at 14 and im 24 now but they feel like such a struggle to fix.
So here are a few of the basics that I am trying to fix:
1) Checking -- the concept of this is so basic and yet... I can't figure out why I struggle so much on staying over/checking back to my right side. I know you use the upper body (i.e. shoulders and/or hips facing the circle or left shoulder staying in front and exaggeratedly over the right side but what do you tell yourself or feel to make sure you checked properly? Like for example my coach will tell me I need to check back after my three turn entry into a spin more or faster, but when i focus on doing that it feels like it's much harder to execute the spin at all. No control, like im rushing it. or trying too hard to stay over the right side
2) This is kinda isolated to axels but i'm sure it's probably shown up in other elements if I paid attention to it more. But the on-ice weight transfer to the right side? I can do off ice axels like butter, but i get on the ice and it feels like a completely different jump. Is this common? I never expected to land it on the ice first try but it only took me 3 weeks to get a fully rotated with nice snap and height on off-ice (granted, I did do them before at a point in life so that's def an advantage) so I thought I would get it just as quickly on ice. I know it's close and it's only been not even a full two weeks of attempting them, but still. I have watched videos from both my off ice attempts and on ice and it feels like after the take off on-ice, i'm not properly over my right side so
3) lastly this is kinda dumb, but it has to do with off-ice rotations. I can do 2S and 2T off ice. not consistently but usually I can get a few good ones during an off-ice session. But so far I have only ever been able to get to a close 2 rotations from two feet. Recently I did off ice with my coach and he told me I need to stop letting my left should lead me into the rotation but like WTH?! I tried to be more mindful of it and it feels like i do it EVEN MORE now. So I've just stopped doing them so I don't practice bad technique. And it really only happens with doubles. Sometimes if it's really bad, it shows up on singles but like not really. but what the heck? i have no idea how to fix that. What is the proper way for jumping off ice?

Is it a strength issue? Do I need to work out more? Core? like whatttt. My coach says I'm really strong, as I kinda really like doing off-ice -- its just easier for me. But then I get on the ice and it all goes to sh#t. He thinks I just need to practice them more and learn how to control the speed and power in my skating (he thinks thats really the issue) but these issues, mostly checking and the shoulder, show up in almost everything (i.e. jumps and spins mostly) and needing to either do it more or faster, so idk how much "practice" will fix it. It's not that I can't do jumps and spins either, I just feel like maybe I don't know or have the awareness to do these minuscule technique things more to make improvements in my skating. Granted I know these habits get better the more you do them, but I can't distinguish between what feels like i'm doing them right and making changes but it just feels uncomfortable or if it's just flat out wrong. I'm pretty sure all of this is a technique issue instead of equipment but I'm going to include that option there as a last resort, especially on spins. I know there is no one fix for skating but I feel like all of these issues kind of go hand in hand honestly, so I feel like there is something specific that I should be doing that i'm either not doing enough of or doing at all.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
Also for more context on the equipment side: I have narrow, flat feet that pronate? not excessively, as I don't really notice a difference or have any knee problems outside of like overuse and stuff. I have Edea Ice Flys, MK Gold Star and the Sidas custom insoles (they're black) and I had the Superfeet Carbon Pro I think before these but I don't actually notice a difference in my feet or boots with insoles tbh lol so idk if I should just keep them or switch back to regular edea insoles even tho they offer no support really or even the old super feet. I *think* my blade may need to be shifted but they're fully mounted already so idk how much of that is me just grasping for something that will fix everything lol. but so far, my coach has looked at the blades and have said to him, theyre fine. they might need a slight adjustment but that was up to me. I do need to hit up a skate shop soon for punching so hopefully if anyone can mention what i can ask them to assess for the blades, that would be awesome!

You can find videos here on my instagram https://www.instagram.com/skatingchis/. I've posted a few on ice axel attempts, and a lot of other on ice jumps and spins. Granted these are obviously the best of the best attempts and it's normal to have technique be off sometimes, thats just life, so I hope this is an accurate enough depiction of my skating. I'm not sure how to upload videos on here but if anyone would like to the bad attempts to really see whats off, maybe i can try to upload one?
 

gliese

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 31, 2020
Country
United-States
Checking -- the concept of this is so basic and yet... I can't figure out why I struggle so much on staying over/checking back to my right side. I know you use the upper body (i.e. shoulders and/or hips facing the circle or left shoulder staying in front and exaggeratedly over the right side but what do you tell yourself or feel to make sure you checked properly? Like for example my coach will tell me I need to check back after my three turn entry into a spin more or faster, but when i focus on doing that it feels like it's much harder to execute the spin at all. No control, like im rushing it. or trying too hard to stay over the right side
Checking is a form of stopping rotation. It is a very bad term for the concept. I tell my students (lower level than you) to quite literally "stop you're rotation" and after they master that, tell them it's called checking. You are either prone to rotating towards the right (clockwise) or towards the left (counter-clockwise) when you are doing anything with rotation. When rotating to the right, you will need to counter the rotation by pushing towards the left. You generally will do this by pressing your right shoulder forward, though certain movements will also require you to push your left shoulder backwards. Only do this if your coach asks you do. When rotating to the left, you will want to to counter rotation by pushing towards the right. You will do this by pressing your left shoulder forward and, if necessary, your right shoulder backwards. Your shoulders should never rise up towards your ears when doing this motion. As my ballet teacher always told me, "they are not earrings." This is a hard movement to master. Practice in the mirror. As for the spin, timing is very hard to master. That comes with your coaches feedback (telling you you're doing things too early or too late) and just time and practice. Figure skating is hard and requires you to think about many parts of your body at the same time. This is something you will just have to get used to. This also comes with practice. Your coach can't help you with that part sadly.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
If your coach isn't helping and delving into this with you and trying to fix it then you have the wrong coach. Basics are the core of everything, jumps are nothing if you can't get the basic moves perfect. Also, why are you wearing Ice Flies at your level?!
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
Checking is a form of stopping rotation. It is a very bad term for the concept. I tell my students (lower level than you) to quite literally "stop you're rotation" and after they master that, tell them it's called checking. You are either prone to rotating towards the right (clockwise) or towards the left (counter-clockwise) when you are doing anything with rotation. When rotating to the right, you will need to counter the rotation by pushing towards the left. You generally will do this by pressing your right shoulder forward, though certain movements will also require you to push your left shoulder backwards. Only do this if your coach asks you do. When rotating to the left, you will want to to counter rotation by pushing towards the right. You will do this by pressing your left shoulder forward and, if necessary, your right shoulder backwards. Your shoulders should never rise up towards your ears when doing this motion. As my ballet teacher always told me, "they are not earrings." This is a hard movement to master. Practice in the mirror. As for the spin, timing is very hard to master. That comes with your coaches feedback (telling you you're doing things too early or too late) and just time and practice. Figure skating is hard and requires you to think about many parts of your body at the same time. This is something you will just have to get used to. This also comes with practice. Your coach can't help you with that part sadly.
thank you! thank you for explaining that in the nicest of ways. Obviously I can rationalize that it really just takes practice and time, but unfortunately i am a bit of a perfectionist and kinda too much attention to detail so even before posting on here, i decided i’d focus less on jumps (natural jumper here hehe) and go on a spin rehab for a bit. I just reassess technique almost after every attempt (i do a lot of recording) so i just wanted to make sure i was practicing things the right way.
I do the left shoulder in front and most times even the right shoulder back a bit more, so this is why i’m just a bit lost on what he means by more and/or faster, cause i’m already doing it. I guess it really does take time. I’ve only been back skating like 8 months so really i think i’m fine but I just want to be a well rounded skater all around and i like to think of my return to skating as a second chance to do things better than the first time.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
If your coach isn't helping and delving into this with you and trying to fix it then you have the wrong coach. Basics are the core of everything, jumps are nothing if you can't get the basic moves perfect. Also, why are you wearing Ice Flies at your level?!
My coach, to me, is really good and cool. He’s kinda technique driven, like me, so most of the corrects he makes are the same ones i’m posting it. I’m just kindaaaa tired of hearing it 😂 a lot of these things he has told me, i’ve asked for more clarification on a few times, and he says the same thing but also that i just need to keep practicing it. The only clash i think is because i think very short term. (i.e. 100% improvement in one day) vs he thinks long term (10% improvement per day/week/month). I’m trying to work on it, since it’s really not healthy athleticism.

Also I think my boots are fine. I’ve always kinda been in Edeas. I do jump really high, and i do a lot of off ice so the boots don’t really feel like too stiff or anything. Knee bend isn’t really an issue unless i’m half ass-ing it. They just feel like boots to me. It’s usually the blades that are my adjustment.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
My coach, to me, is really good and cool. He’s kinda technique driven, like me, so most of the corrects he makes are the same ones i’m posting it. I’m just kindaaaa tired of hearing it 😂 a lot of these things he has told me, i’ve asked for more clarification on a few times, and he says the same thing but also that i just need to keep practicing it. The only clash i think is because i think very short term. (i.e. 100% improvement in one day) vs he thinks long term (10% improvement per day/week/month). I’m trying to work on it, since it’s really not healthy athleticism.

Also I think my boots are fine. I’ve always kinda been in Edeas. I do jump really high, and i
My point with the boots is, you aren't jumping triples and quads, you're barely doing doubles. Concerto and chorus should be more your speed.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
My point with the boots is, you aren't jumping triples and quads, you're barely doing doubles. Concerto and chorus should be more your speed.
Oh! idk, i literally haven’t even tried any other brands except Edea and Riedell. I skated too young to really have an opinion on equipment (my dad did all of them) and my last pair before quitting were the Chorus, so i just got the Ice fly’s because they were the next boot up. I skate 10 hours a week, primarily doing jumping (i hate spins, obviously). They could be out of my level but i’ve been managing fine i think ? As i’ve seen people doing much less in them. but most of the people in my level Axels +up, ice flys aren’t uncommon.
I’m also pretty tall. so idk. I’ve asked but people said as long as i can get proper knee bend and it doesn’t feel like theyre never broken in or hindering my skating in anyway, i’m fine. What is your opinion?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
Oh! idk, i literally haven’t even tried any other brands except Edea and Riedell. I skated too young to really have an opinion on equipment (my dad did all of them) and my last pair before quitting were the Chorus, so i just got the Ice fly’s because they were the next boot up. I skate 10 hours a week, primarily doing jumping (i hate spins, obviously). They could be out of my level but i’ve been managing fine i think ? As i’ve seen people doing much less in them. but most of the people in my level Axels +up, ice flys aren’t uncommon.
I’m also pretty tall. so idk. I’ve asked but people said as long as i can get proper knee bend and it doesn’t feel like theyre never broken in or hindering my skating in anyway, i’m fine. What is your opinion?
I gave you my opinion.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
I gave you my opinion.
i didn't mean on me! i meant about people saying about the knee bend, etc. i've always been told that rating is for children or people of lighter weight and that its different for adults. I was asking your opinion on the validity of such statements
 

TQB

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 29, 2021
I gave you my opinion.
I just want you to know that every time I see another itty bitty skater Free Skate level skater in Ice Flies I think of you ;). They ALL have them, and only some of them are even working on 1A. I think they are beautiful LOOKING but even if there truly isn't an over-booting concern (Edea claims "you can't overboot in Edea" which is a bit self-serving) the price jump from the Chorus was not something I could deal with - and my feet aren't growing.

OP, i am not at your level but my two cents is that I was having trouble with the entry to my forward scratch spin and another coach, just in passing, mentioned i might be dropping my hip. Bam. Sometimes fresh eyes on a situation can see or make words around an issue that "click." Also, as a former kid skater returning as an adult, the way we think about our bodies is so different. I was taught very hands-on, coaches physically repositioning your body (oh, the 80s). Adapting to learning on a more intellectual, deliberate level from that instinctive kid level is hard. I'm always complaining to my coach "You want me to think about ALL FOUR limbs, AND my head?!"

As my 9 year old told me, "ice hurts and skating is hard."

Folks who coach, what are the big differences between working with kids and adult skaters - are there challenges working with adults who try and overthink stuff, or is it easier because we can communicate at a higher level?

ETA - i checked out your insta and the only tidbit i can offer (because i'm struggling with same) is the check out of your (very nice) backspin - I think it's your free leg that's not checking out. But please ask your coach before you listen to some strange lady (aka ME) on the interwebs.
 
Last edited:

marcopolobear

Rinkside
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Country
Canada
Hi,

For the stiffness, I understand what you are saying. To me, it can also depend on your strength/body weight/style/etc. I think good indicators are if you can do a shoot the duck all the way down to your butt, or a 90 degree or more sit spin. Do the skates allow you to maintain a bent knee position when skating normally, or do they force you up? Can you do backward crossovers with full extension of both feet?

Ah, I looked at some of your videos. You are not getting enough ankle bend on your sit spin and it looks like your boots are limiting the bend a bit. Maybe as they break in more. Anyway, on your sit spin you need to get your shoulders down and rolled back more, and your chest out more. Keep a bit of elbow bend and wrist bend and really push your chest forward. Practice this position on shoot the ducks.

You look strong, but light, so you may have a bit of a time breaking in those boots.

Another indicator can be how fast you are breaking down your boots. Don't move up "just because" but move up because you need the support on landings and/or because your boots are breaking down too fast.

On your Axel, your left arm is not helping much in your take-off but just kind of hanging out. This is making your take off whip around. Bringing it back and forwards/up at the same time as the other arm should help get your weight to the other side. Everything goes together - both arms back together with the free leg/free hip, then everything together going forwards. With a good take-off, the rotation comes by itself, if you are trying to make it happen, you are rushing it a bit. For getting your weight over too, think about landing so that you can do a loop jump after your Axel landing, or at least landing in the backspin position and continuing the spin (those are good to practice).

Keep going, you are doing great though. You have nice nice pop and height on your Axle which is half the battle I think.

M.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
Hi,

For the stiffness, I understand what you are saying. To me, it can also depend on your strength/body weight/style/etc. I think good indicators are if you can do a shoot the duck all the way down to your butt, or a 90 degree or more sit spin. Do the skates allow you to maintain a bent knee position when skating normally, or do they force you up? Can you do backward crossovers with full extension of both feet?

Ah, I looked at some of your videos. You are not getting enough ankle bend on your sit spin and it looks like your boots are limiting the bend a bit. Maybe as they break in more. Anyway, on your sit spin you need to get your shoulders down and rolled back more, and your chest out more. Keep a bit of elbow bend and wrist bend and really push your chest forward. Practice this position on shoot the ducks.

You look strong, but light, so you may have a bit of a time breaking in those boots.

Another indicator can be how fast you are breaking down your boots. Don't move up "just because" but move up because you need the support on landings and/or because your boots are breaking down too fast.

On your Axel, your left arm is not helping much in your take-off but just kind of hanging out. This is making your take off whip around. Bringing it back and forwards/up at the same time as the other arm should help get your weight to the other side. Everything goes together - both arms back together with the free leg/free hip, then everything together going forwards. With a good take-off, the rotation comes by itself, if you are trying to make it happen, you are rushing it a bit. For getting your weight over too, think about landing so that you can do a loop jump after your Axel landing, or at least landing in the backspin position and continuing the spin (those are good to practice).

Keep going, you are doing great though. You have nice nice pop and height on your Axle which is half the battle I think.

M.
thank you for this! I can actually do a shoot the duck no problem both legs backwards and forward. My sit spin getting low actually has more to do with mobility than the boots (at least my off ice trainer thinks so). I believe the term he used was bottom mobility? or something like that. My on ice coach also thinks i can get a low sit spin no problem since he says he can’t do a shoot the duck but can do the really low sit spins so i should be able to. it’s just something i’m still working towards. I really don’t know how i can do a shoot the duck but not a sit spin. There’s a video on my instagram too but it’s a little bit dated back. https://www.instagram.com/p/CKuODUpj-gy/?utm_medium=copy_link. Same ice fly’s just my last pair. These ones i’m currently wearing are new! Just got them in March. So maybe that’s the stiffness thing you mentioned

Also thank you so much for the tips! I see what you mean for the sit spin. I will try to implement those. I’m doing a bit of a “spin rehab” where i focus most sessions primarily on spinning. I can spin (i think?) pretty well I just don’t spin well consistently so that’s really what i’m hoping to fix with gathering advice on here.
I also see what you mean for the axel. I don’t do that on my off ice axels but my coach mentioned not letting the left shoulder lead so i have just been trying to make it do as least as possible haha.

Thank you a lot for the tips!
 

marcopolobear

Rinkside
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Country
Canada
Hi,

Off-ice helps a ton for sit spins. Just do the same movement as on ice. Start with an open position like the forward entry, then bring the free leg and free arm around and forwards together to meet the skating arm, and at the same time lower all the way down to your butt. Then do the exact reverse movement to go back up. Work up to 10-15 of these in a row -- then you will have reserves of strength and endurance for your sit.

For the shoot the duck, no holding the free leg! That causes your weight to go back as you can see as you are way back on the heel of the blade. Do the shoot the duck like I described for the off ice sit spin practice. Everything together coming forwards as you go down. Remember to keep your shoulders down and rolled back and your chest out forwards.

I don't get what your coach means with your left shoulder not leading. Are you sure he didn't mean your right? These are nice off-ice exercises: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3KMZXvl7KA


M.
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
I just want you to know that every time I see another itty bitty skater Free Skate level skater in Ice Flies I think of you ;). They ALL have them, and only some of them are even working on 1A. I think they are beautiful LOOKING but even if there truly isn't an over-booting concern (Edea claims "you can't overboot in Edea" which is a bit self-serving) the price jump from the Chorus was not something I could deal with - and my feet aren't growing.

OP, i am not at your level but my two cents is that I was having trouble with the entry to my forward scratch spin and another coach, just in passing, mentioned i might be dropping my hip. Bam. Sometimes fresh eyes on a situation can see or make words around an issue that "click." Also, as a former kid skater returning as an adult, the way we think about our bodies is so different. I was taught very hands-on, coaches physically repositioning your body (oh, the 80s). Adapting to learning on a more intellectual, deliberate level from that instinctive kid level is hard. I'm always complaining to my coach "You want me to think about ALL FOUR limbs, AND my head?!"

As my 9 year old told me, "ice hurts and skating is hard."

Folks who coach, what are the big differences between working with kids and adult skaters - are there challenges working with adults who try and overthink stuff, or is it easier because we can communicate at a higher level?

ETA - i checked out your insta and the only tidbit i can offer (because i'm struggling with same) is the check out of your (very nice) backspin - I think it's your free leg that's not checking out. But please ask your coach before you listen to some strange lady on the interwebs.
thank you! my backspin (and my loop) are my two most improved elements 😂 a lot of my backspin struggles are kind of the same ones i am making in my axel mostly so rationally, i know it’ll just get there with time.
Checking out was one of my bigger issues in backspin (still is tbh!) but before was worse. and crossing my leg properly. That one took me ages to stop crossing with an open hip.
I know the simple fix is just practice and time but sometimes i wish that technique changes that are like those Halloween stores that pop up seemingly overnight 🤣
 

sk8chis

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2018
Hi,

Off-ice helps a ton for sit spins. Just do the same movement as on ice. Start with an open position like the forward entry, then bring the free leg and free arm around and forwards together to meet the skating arm, and at the same time lower all the way down to your butt. Then do the exact reverse movement to go back up. Work up to 10-15 of these in a row -- then you will have reserves of strength and endurance for your sit.

For the shoot the duck, no holding the free leg! That causes your weight to go back as you can see as you are way back on the heel of the blade. Do the shoot the duck like I described for the off ice sit spin practice. Everything together coming forwards as you go down. Remember to keep your shoulders down and rolled back and your chest out forwards.

I don't get what your coach means with your left shoulder not leading. Are you sure he didn't mean your right? These are nice off-ice exercises: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3KMZXvl7KA


M.

Oh this is my fault. I didn’t clarify but the left shoulder leading has to do with the two foot double rotation on off ice mostly. it happens on axel too but if it does it’s usually because i wasn’t checking going into the snap.
this is similar to what he means but in ballet terms. https://www.instagram.com/p/CQaftY7APw9/?utm_medium=copy_link
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
I just want you to know that every time I see another itty bitty skater Free Skate level skater in Ice Flies I think of you ;). They ALL have them, and only some of them are even working on 1A. I think they are beautiful LOOKING but even if there truly isn't an over-booting concern (Edea claims "you can't overboot in Edea" which is a bit self-serving) the price jump from the Chorus was not something I could deal with - and my feet aren't growing.

OP, i am not at your level but my two cents is that I was having trouble with the entry to my forward scratch spin and another coach, just in passing, mentioned i might be dropping my hip. Bam. Sometimes fresh eyes on a situation can see or make words around an issue that "click." Also, as a former kid skater returning as an adult, the way we think about our bodies is so different. I was taught very hands-on, coaches physically repositioning your body (oh, the 80s). Adapting to learning on a more intellectual, deliberate level from that instinctive kid level is hard. I'm always complaining to my coach "You want me to think about ALL FOUR limbs, AND my head?!"

As my 9 year old told me, "ice hurts and skating is hard."

Folks who coach, what are the big differences between working with kids and adult skaters - are there challenges working with adults who try and overthink stuff, or is it easier because we can communicate at a higher level?

ETA - i checked out your insta and the only tidbit i can offer (because i'm struggling with same) is the check out of your (very nice) backspin - I think it's your free leg that's not checking out. But please ask your coach before you listen to some strange lady on the interwebs.
To answer your question: It's a mixed bag coaching adults, it's easier from the perspective that you can communicate on a higher level, but it's difficult because many overthink especially with jumps. So it evens out. ;)
 
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WednesdayMarch

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 24, 2019
Country
United-Kingdom
I just want you to know that every time I see another itty bitty skater Free Skate level skater in Ice Flies I think of you ;). They ALL have them, and only some of them are even working on 1A. I think they are beautiful LOOKING but even if there truly isn't an over-booting concern (Edea claims "you can't overboot in Edea" which is a bit self-serving) the price jump from the Chorus was not something I could deal with - and my feet aren't growing.

OP, i am not at your level but my two cents is that I was having trouble with the entry to my forward scratch spin and another coach, just in passing, mentioned i might be dropping my hip. Bam. Sometimes fresh eyes on a situation can see or make words around an issue that "click." Also, as a former kid skater returning as an adult, the way we think about our bodies is so different. I was taught very hands-on, coaches physically repositioning your body (oh, the 80s). Adapting to learning on a more intellectual, deliberate level from that instinctive kid level is hard. I'm always complaining to my coach "You want me to think about ALL FOUR limbs, AND my head?!"

As my 9 year old told me, "ice hurts and skating is hard."

Folks who coach, what are the big differences between working with kids and adult skaters - are there challenges working with adults who try and overthink stuff, or is it easier because we can communicate at a higher level?

ETA - i checked out your insta and the only tidbit i can offer (because i'm struggling with same) is the check out of your (very nice) backspin - I think it's your free leg that's not checking out. But please ask your coach before you listen to some strange lady (aka ME) on the interwebs.
In answer to the coaching question, the difference I found was mainly in the fear level. Communicating as a coach means finding 50+ ways to explain the same thing and it's important to note that children like to understand what they are doing as much as adults. I also used to use fun things like, "Be a shark!" for children to get their crossovers lower and more powerful but discovered quite quickly that adults also find that hilarious and fun so...
 
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