U.S. Figure Skating honored coach once suspended for alleged sexual relationship with 16-year-old

[JimR]

U.S. Figure Skating honored coach once suspended for alleged sexual relationship with 16-year-old

Last week, USFS and PSA honored skating coach Christopher Pottenger, who was suspended in 2010 for alleged sexual relationship with 16-year-old boy.

usatoday.com

Is it time for the ISU to get involved to hold USFS to account?

It's not just the award that is the issue, but that as a current coach he's presumably coaching children or at least around them. How is this appropriate?

Especially with everything that happened with the national gymnastics team that any organisation would take these kinds of crazy risks in hiring let alone handing out an award to someone that has been previously suspended for dating a child.

 

[macy]

USFS is looking a whole lot like USAG right now also with their new nepo-hire senior manager of high performance development who openly supported John Coughlin. in her position she is a mandatory abuse reporter.

John Coughlin scandal rocked U.S. Figure Skating. Now a supporter of his has been hired.

Olympian Ashley Wagner, one of at least four skaters who accused John Coughlin of sexual assault, rips USFS for hiring a Coughlin supporter.

www.usatoday.com

TSL, Tai Babilonia and Ashley Wagner are basically the only well known/relevant people in the skating world bringing attention to this currently, it's very interesting how hardly anyone is talking about it or calling out USFS. I haven't seen any skating media outlets report on it besides Christine Brennan. Jackie Wong has so far been silent. it seems they might be afraid of putting contracts and credentials in jeopardy, and no way would any current skater bite the hand that feeds them (i don't blame them). but what about everyone else?

Ashley's twitter with many recent posts about both issues: https://twitter.com/AshWagner2010?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author

You'll see the name Alan Medina arguing with her in defense of Chris Pottenger. This has been highly discussed in the figure skating subreddit with some knowing who he is- he is the co-director with Chris of the Pottenger Academy and very close to Chris personally.

I have a lot of respect for Ashley for never being afraid to speak up for herself and others and hold USFS accountable.

The silence from USFS has spoken volumes.

 

[yesterday]

Oof. That's a bizarre way of "I don't care what others think about me" that USFS is showing?

 

[bettysharlene]

USFS knows they can wait out the story. As long as it is social media drama, they can ignore it. The story is already dying down.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Is it time for the ISU to get involved to hold USFS to account?

Where and when has the ISU ever shown any exacting moral authority, effective leadership, and responsibility on any issues, much less sensitive social conduct issues, involving abuse claims?

The entire sport is bankrupt in regard to a number of pressing concerns! Plus, I'd be surprised to see the ISU getting directly involved in internal fed affairs of this nature. Have they done so in Hungary? Have they done so in France? Have they done anything effective or responsible regarding Russian doping scandals? The only answer to these questions is, 'No.'

It's good that some people in the skating community have the courage and autonomy to speak up. But nothing will change until it does, which may require passing out, or cleaning out of the old guard.

 

[Magill]

Where and when has the ISU ever shown any exacting moral authority, effective leadership, and responsibility on any issues, much less sensitive social conduct issues, involving abuse claims?

The entire sport is bankrupt in regard to a number of pressing concerns! Plus, I'd be surprised to see the ISU getting directly involved in internal fed affairs of this nature. Have they done so in Hungary? Have they done so in France? Have they done anything effective or responsible regarding Russian doping scandals? The only answer to these questions is, 'No.'

It's good that some people in the skating community have the courage and autonomy to speak up. But nothing will change until it does, which may require passing out, or cleaning out of the old guard.

And yet the silence of this community, even on this board, is thundering.
With so many and so vocal American posters (and the board itself being US-based), I, non-American, have expected a heated discussion and response. Exercising the pressure of public opinion. Nothing of the sort happened. So telling.
I guess this silence and indifference is in fact like a double blow to the victims, both those who came out and were vocal about it, and for those who decided to remain silent. Seeing the results, why would they choose otherwise?
Kudos and words of my deepest respect and compassion for Ashley Wagner and other unnamed victims. They must feel awful about it and seem to have been betrayed by their fed and their community.

 

[icewhite]

And yet the silence of this community, even on this board, is thundering.
With so many and so vocal American posters (and the board itself being US-based), I, non-American, have expected a heated discussion and response. Exercising the pressure of public opinion. Nothing of the sort happened. So telling.
I guess this silence and indifference is in fact like a double blow to the victims, both those who came out and were vocal about it, and for those who decided to remain silent. Seeing the results, why would they choose otherwise?
Kudos and words of my deepest respect and compassion for Ashley Wagner and other unnamed victims. They must feel awful about it and seem to have been betrayed by their fed and their community.

There isn't much discussion of such topics in general here, is there?
To me the most problematic aspect recently (I'm a complete outsider who doesn't know much about US skating) is to put someone who has openly doubted and discredited victims of a abuse into a position to which victims can/should turn to. That's a big *** you.
A relationship between a 16 year old and a 21 year old on the other hand doesn't get my blood boiling per se. I am not at all familiar with the details which might look ugly, and the fact that it's a coach and he gets honoured for developing look bad, but it's not something that really enrages me in principle.

 

[el henry]

I am not certain what is gained by saying "Why aren't posters outraged"? Why I have stopped participating in these discussions:

1. One, I do not know enough about Christopher Pottenger and what discipline has already been imposed, when, why, how, to express an opinion about this award (I do note the award was to four? five? coaches at the "Pottenger Academy"). On such an important subject, I feel the need to educate myself

2. I wouldn't trust Christine "MeMeMeMeI'mImportantMeMeMe" Brennan if she told me the sun rose in the East. When I have said that in the past, I get pushback about how brave wonderful Christine is the only journalist calling out the USFS, yadee yadee. So there is that.

3. We don't know each other offline, for the most part. I have seen (again, in the past, not directed at anyone here) : How can you excuse such and such? You are an enabler! You don't understand! Without knowing thing one about that person's history. That is not productive, in my opinion.

4. Mostly, what is the point? To excuse other coaches with history of abuse? To say how outraged one is?

Or to change a system going forward to protect skaters? I think we would all like to do that.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

I agree with @el henry. There have been discussions in threads here about abuse issues in the sport. Plenty of posters have spoken out about their feelings. And others choose not to engage in such discussions on skating forums, which is probably wise. That doesn't mean these same 'silent' people aren't working quietly in other ways to support victims of abuse through donations, volunteer work, and/ or writing to advocacy groups, and to legislators. Also, those who feel strongly about this topic, and a variety of other issues in fs, can start letter writing campaigns to U.S. fed, the ISU, and the IOC. Or else start a blog for purposeful engagement and/ or for education and awareness.

BTW, absolutely nothing gets solved by speaking out on skating forums about complex, problematic socio-cultural issues. I don't think skating forums were created for convening such issues. Most of the threads where sensitive, controversial topics are intensely discussed, get closed due to triggered emotions and "heated discussions," which often end up in offensive, circular arguments. This is why threads tend to be closed before that happens.

Obviously, the current news on such topics is able to be brought up here and politely discussed. However, not everyone chooses to engage in such conversations on social media platforms, and they don't have to.

 

[icewhite]

I agree with @el henry. There have been discussions in threads here about abuse issues in the sport. Plenty of posters have spoken out about their feelings. And others choose not to engage in such discussions on skating forums, which is probably wise. That doesn't mean these same 'silent' people aren't working quietly in other ways to support victims of abuse through donations, volunteer work, and/ or writing to advocacy groups, and to legislators. Also, those who feel strongly about this topic, and a variety of other issues in fs, can start letter writing campaigns to U.S. fed, the ISU, and the IOC. Or else start a blog for purposeful engagement and/ or for education and awareness.

BTW, absolutely nothing gets solved by speaking out on skating forums about complex, problematic socio-cultural issues. I don't think skating forums were created for convening such issues. Most of the threads where sensitive, controversial topics are intensely discussed, get closed due to triggered emotions and "heated discussions," which often end up in offensive, circular arguments. This is why threads tend to be closed before that happens.

Obviously, the current news on such topics is able to be brought up here and politely discussed. However, not everyone chooses to engage in such conversations on social media platforms, and they don't have to.

Of course nobody has to. However I don't get this "forums are not made for this/not the suitable place" - that seems to be a very common opinion about/in forums in general, but personally I much prefer to speak about such topics in a well-moderated forum instead of the hells of other social media where aggressive trolls that add nothing will always have the upper hand.
For some sports there is only one or two major international fora. And if nobody there talks about certain issues or events that happen in that sport it's actually very irritating to me, too.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

^^ Yeah @icewhite, for clarity, there are platforms on social media for debate on all kinds of topics. My point is that skating forums, in my estimation, are primarily for sharing enjoyment of figure skating, and meeting other fans. There are more than enough disagreements that happen during the season regarding skater preferences and competition outcomes.

Difficult topics are certainly allowed to be brought up here, and discussed. But such threads tend to be closed because of heated arguments. Just recently, I recall that you said you were leaving the thread about the Russian athlete ban, to avoid responding in a way that might get you in trouble. Some posters were engaging in negative attacks and argumentative opposition. In such situations, nothing helpful is accomplished.

Also, in terms of "well-moderated," that's a matter of opinion from site-to-site, based on the rules of each site. Again, if a forum is created specifically for debating and engaging in discussion on sensitive, emotional topics, or political controversies, fine. There can be a place for public debate on controversial issues, in certain venues specifically designed for such engagement.

To come on a skating forum and say more people need to speak out against an abuse-related situation, is what I disagree with. Sure, we all want abusive behavior to end, and for skaters to be safe. But advocating for or trying to police people speaking out will not be successful on a skating forum. Every individual gets to decide for themselves whether they want to speak out publicly, or not. The circular arguments are tiresome, and the offensive attacks are unkind and counterproductive.

Again, abuse issues will not be resolved on skating forums. Circular arguments, attacks and insults are unproductive, and that's why threads get closed when 'heated discussions' ensue.

 

[TT_Fin]

I really can't understand how it helps the athlete, if during the off-season when many of the members don't visit the forum at all, they are criticized for not discussing the matter enough. I do volunteering in real life in many ways. I don't like to discuss much about problems I work with in the internet. It is more helpful to act than just to play my mouth. Sorry about hard words but I most critisism I got are from the people who do nothing themselves. Always when I help somebody, somebody says "wrong way to help, wrong person to help, do not help animals, help people". I help both people and animals. And was this topic about to blaim other members or to discuss about the issue about itself? As there are only couple of messages with are related to issue, this subject can be closed. It happens when people do not keep the subject in the topic. I would not be on the forum at all, if I hadn't healthy issues.

But to the topic: Was it harrasment or relationship? For example, in Finland a relationship, also sexual, is legal between 16-year old and 21-year-old. But if it harrasment, or pressure by the coach, then the situation changes.

 

[dorispulaski]

The best place to open a controversial thread is in Speakeasy. However, not everyone can post there. You must have 100 posts and you can't be a moderator if you want to post there.

 

[mrrice]

USFS knows they can wait out the story. As long as it is social media drama, they can ignore it. The story is already dying down.

It sure is. I know nothing about it. The stories about John were everywhere but, I have no idea who this person is.

 

[NanaPat]

But to the topic: Was it harrasment or relationship? For example, in Finland a relationship, also sexual, is legal between 16-year old and 21-year-old. But if it harrasment, or pressure by the coach, then the situation changes.

There are two separate issues: ages and relative positions of people involved. Both age differences and position can lead to a power imbalance. My gut feeling is that there is ALWAYS a major power imbalance between a skater and a coach, but I realize that there are examples of such relationships that I consider perfectly acceptable.

 

[JimR]

And yet the silence of this community, even on this board, is thundering.
With so many and so vocal American posters (and the board itself being US-based), I, non-American, have expected a heated discussion and response. Exercising the pressure of public opinion. Nothing of the sort happened. So telling.
I guess this silence and indifference is in fact like a double blow to the victims, both those who came out and were vocal about it, and for those who decided to remain silent. Seeing the results, why would they choose otherwise?
Kudos and words of my deepest respect and compassion for Ashley Wagner and other unnamed victims. They must feel awful about it and seem to have been betrayed by their fed and their community.

Things that are completely outside an athlete's control (especially a child they can't even vote or sign a contract), people want to see athlete's receive the most punitive punishments ever seen in the sport, but something completely within the power of the sport and federations to control and influence there's basically just silence.

I would say the hypocrisy is kind of amusing, but there's nothing amusing about it for the athletes who ply their trade under such circumstances. It's terrifying for them.