2014 Rostelecom Cup Ladies Free Skate 11/15

[Barb]

Actually Javier is the new Carolina Kostner (High score in Russia except competing against a Russian). He is 2 times European Champion, and has already been VERY popular in Russia since his days with Morozov before he was even an European Champion. This is practically his home event. Just as well as it is Michal Brezina's and Misha Ge's home event (born in Moscow) as far as GP series go.

So, a skater doesn´t need his/her federation is politicking for him/her, Javi is an example.

 

[OS]

So, a skater doesn´t need his/her federation is politicking for him/her, Javi is an example.

Actually politicks matters, why do you think many picked a Russian coach early in their career as possible? Why did you think Javi went to Morozov? And now Orser?

I don't even know why you are focussing on Javi so much, when a much more equivalent to So Youn today is someone like Michael Christian Matinez... and guess what, this year he has gone to Morozov

So Youn (Don't you dare go anywhere near La Morozv)

 

[Barb]

Actually politicks matters, why do you think many picked a Russian coach early in their career as possible? Why did you think Javi went to Morozov? And now Orser?

I don't even know why you are focussing on Javi so much, when a much more equivalent to So Youn today is someone like Michael Christian Matinez... and guess what, this year he has gone to Morozov

So Youn (Don't you dare go anywhere near La Morozv)

I really like So Youn but I don´t like people is doing with her the same they did with Yuna, putting her all the time in the role of victim, we get it but it is enough, the reality is she wasted a big opportunity to win this in her SP.
Javi, Denis T. are not from big federations and nobody put them in the victim role like people does with Yuna and So Youn.

 

[OS]

I really like So Youn but I don´t like people is doing with her the same they did with Yuna, putting her all the time in the role of victim, we get it but it is enough, the reality is she wasted a big opportunity to win this in her SP.
Javi, Denis T. are not from big federations and nobody put them in the victim role like people does with Yuna and So Youn.

I think your view will be alot different if you start to look at what i have said is of value vs I am a Yuna fan therefore I am an enemy.

If Javi and Denis received lesser PCS than they deserve, what is wrong with pointing them out? And did they? So what is your point? Other than the fact I am a Yuna fan?

 

[Icey]

Has anyone one gone back to anaylze Mirai's 2008 nationals win and her 4th at the 2010 olympics? Was she UR'ing then? Has she had this problem all her career? What happened to the emotion she had in her long at the olympics? That was a great program.

Mirai had no ur's in either of her programs at the Olympics 2010. The only call she got was ! on the 3lz+2T in the short.

Some of the jumps in her long were : 3lz+2t+2t ; 2a+3T; 3lo+2a

 

[silverfoxes]

Actually politicks matters, why do you think many picked a Russian coach early in their career as possible? Why did you think Javi went to Morozov? And now Orser?

I don't even know why you are focussing on Javi so much, when a much more equivalent to So Youn today is someone like Michael Christian Matinez... and guess what, this year he has gone to Morozov

So Youn (Don't you dare go anywhere near La Morozv)

Morozov is not MCM's coach. And maybe people choose Russian coaches because they are good at their job. Where should Javi have gone? Is there some great Spanish coach nobody has heard of? Or Filipino? Politicking may be part of their job, but it isn't everything and it doesn't turn a mediocre skater into a great one or magically gift them great scores. If TAT is so great at politicking, why is Artur doing so badly?

 

[OS]

Morozov is not MCM's coach. And maybe people choose Russian coaches because they are good at their job. Where should Javi have gone? Is there some great Spanish coach nobody has heard of? Or Filipino? Politicking may be part of their job, but it isn't everything and it doesn't turn a mediocre skater into a great one or magically gift them great scores. If TAT is so great at politicking, why is Artur doing so badly?

I don't deny Russian coaches are good at their job, including Tat AND Morozov, but it doesn't fix everything. The skater needs to deliver, and nothing is black and white.

Frank Carroll is one of America's greatest coaches of all time, but he couldn't help someone as talented as Mirai and Gracie, but they certainly benefitted a great deal from better internationally standing because of him and his expertise, at least within their own federations. Look at what his complaints about the judging at Sochi did and how that helped to boost Gracie's PCS between Team event to Individual event. Look at what his complaints about Liza and her bat out of hell jumps did few years ago and how it affect her PCS for years! So yes politicks matters, personal relationship matters. Otherwise how can you explain the scoring we saw? Please do?

 

[Icey]

Probably the blame belongs to some degree with both Tat and Artur, as in a marriage lol.

 

[chloepoco]

Actually politicks matters, why do you think many picked a Russian coach early in their career as possible? Why did you think Javi went to Morozov? And now Orser?

I don't even know why you are focussing on Javi so much, when a much more equivalent to So Youn today is someone like Michael Christian Matinez... and guess what, this year he has gone to Morozov

So Youn (Don't you dare go anywhere near La Morozv)

Maybe skaters go to Russian coaches and to Orser because they are good coaches? Imagine that!

So since you say the top three were over scored and had politicking from their federations, what order would you have them all placed in?

 

[[email protected]]

OK, I am back at home now. Watched everything live. The ladies' event was the weakest. Rika Hongo was a highlight. But not a mind blowing highlight. Very good speed, very confident jumps. But her posture is sort of hmm not upright. And choreography needs some work. Still a well-deserved win.

Anna could not sustain the pressure. I was with my wife and we asked each other why she was doing so many triples during the warm-up: many more than anybody else. She landed all of them and she kept jumping. Then we she started the program the very first combo was flopped. Still she was as fast as Rika - they were much faster than everybody else. And she related to her firebird image quite well. Whatever the points should be, her second place is well deserved.

Same as the well-deserved third place of Chartrand. She was quite fast as well and quite confident. There were a couple of visible mistakes but overall quite a good impression.

Which brings us to Mirai and So Yun as all the others are not worth analyzing. Mirai....I am not excited by her skating either on TV or live. But if it were not for a double-footed flip and a shaky axel her skating was solid. All these URs are not visible live. So Yun. As I already said we liked her stylish and delicate skating. But she is truly slower than Anna, Rika, and Alaine, and she still fights with a 3Lo. For the time being, I think she is not the one to compete for podiums - she is the one to watch. May be next year will be different - still some time before 2018.

 

[Blades of Passion]

Thank you RIKA HONGO for saving this competition!! What a dreadful affair it was otherwise.

Mirai's team needs to change her gameplan. 3F+3T is clearly never going to happen for her unless she improves her basic technique. They need to just go for 3T+3T and 3Lo in the SP and then 3Lz, 3F, 3S / 3Lo+2T+2Lo, 3T+2A, 3Lo, 3T+2A in the LP.

Lutz off the top of the program so she can actually focus on rotating it. There's absolutely no point in trying to repeat the Flip. She pretty much never rotates it the second half. No point in risking an underrotated 3T on the end of another jump either. 3T+2A sequence is a better way of gaining points for her. It's not even a huge base value loss. If she put more focus on going out there and skating that content cleanly, with more speed and interpretation, she would be FAR more rewarded.

 

[OS]

Maybe skaters go to Russian coaches and to Orser because they are good coaches? Imagine that!

So since you say the top three were over scored and had politicking from their federations, what order would you have them all placed in?

I already used SYP's 114 at Skate America as my benchmark, so based on that, yes the the top 3 are over scored. Do you disagree? Why do you disagree exactly?

Hongo, is a young skater in her first season, who last received 50.67 PCS at Asia Trophy earlier in the year where she was beaten by So Youn there, despite So Youn's lower PCS of 47.20 in her FS (where she received 2x4s, 11x5s, infact one judge give her all 5s. While Hongo receives all consistent 6s, vs some 7s SYP got.)

Here Hongo's PCS climbed to 58.96 for lesser TES performance (2 x < and an edge call on her lutz) than Asia Trophy. I strongly feel her PCS wouldn't have been pushed so high had Anna not received the PCS she had for an under par performance. The judges are simply backed into a corner! Since Hongo clearly had a better skate than Anna. I would have her ahead of Anna certainly. While Alaine Charterand is no Katlyn Osmond (but politically she is the probably the nearest thing?) and this is not an amazing skate. Her previous best was simply 5th Junior Worlds, 7th, 4CCs, 4th US Classics which is her best Senior International result. I havn't been follow this girl before, but she was strong in her SP, and she received 2 points PCS increase vs her last outing at a B competition (where they are known to be generous with their PCS).

So consider everything I'd have Hongo 1st but with lower PCS, So Youn 2nd with higher PCS and bit more generous with GOEs, Anna in 3rd based on her higher TES, lower PCS but much lesser overall score than 114, something like 108 can still secure a podium, PCS I'd have her at 54, 55 (1-2 point less than what she received at cup of china last year coming first), Alaine in 4th in FS due to lowest TES. Overall, what be will be.

Actually even though I complain about Anna's score here, she is by far the LEAST over scored Russian ladies skaters around.... I still couldn't get over Julia's 69, and Liza's 67 for their SP with their 3T3T, vs Kostner's far superior Shoskovich have only ever gotten 60s-63s with 3T3T. Their scores are so high, that even Kanako brought 3lz3T plus 3A, it wouldn't be enough to catch up scoring wise, and that is a superior choreographed program!

 

[Imagine]

Congrats to Rika! I looooove Anna's program but she should've been 3rd in all honesty. The Canadian girl was great too and maybe she could've gotten silver...that or swap her with Mirai.

 

[cooper]

Uh, so who do you think should have won? So Youn?

actually no one is arguing that she should have won.. you're probably the only one who is assuming it.. some are just saying that her PCS = tooooo loooowwww..

 

[Sabrina]

In Skate Canada Ana's Firebird was amazingly beautiful. Here it was so different, I almost felt sorry for her. I love Anna, but this was not her day. What bothers me is the marks. That was not the skate for silver medal. I know neither Mirai nor Alaine were perfect. Sill I have Alaine on second, and Anna on third. Mirai was too far away...but in a way she was better than Anna, despite the under rotated jumps. Judges are so corrupt...

 

[chuckm]

It seems as if Anna has an injury. Every time she tried the lutz, she seemed to be in pain and backed off. But she was marked as if her programs were only slightly off when they were VERY off, like Max Aaron's were, only he got SLAMMED for it and she didn't. Her TES was low, so her PCS scores were very inflated because they had to be in case Chartrand nailed her FS big time.

I, too, thought Park was being deliberately held down in both SP and FS, mainly on PCS, because she was a real threat to Anna's podium placement. Nagasu OTOH wasn't held down in the SP because she was guaranteed to take herself out of contention in the FS with URs. Maybe Chartrand was thought to be safe, too, because normally she URs too in the FS, but she didn't rush as much as usual this time and was more careful.

 

[peg]

After the first two GP events, people were speculating that maybe the Japanese would get gold in all the men's events and the Russian girls would win all the ladies' events. Last week put an end to that when a Russian beat Yuzuru. This week, Rika evened the score for Japan by beating Anna

 

[satine]

After the first two GP events, people were speculating that maybe the Japanese would get gold in all the men's events and the Russian girls would win all the ladies' events. Last week put an end to that when a Russian beat Yuzuru. This week, Rika evened the score for Japan by beating Anna

We're jinxing the events :hopelessness:

 

[peg]

We're jinxing the events :hopelessness:

Maybe this week lifted the jinx from last week?

 

[chz]

Nowadays, it's hard to justify the marks from judges..It's really impossible. We watch a programme, we thought it is good, sometimes it is bad but when we see the scores...??????????????