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- Mar 28, 2005
Assuming both max out combinations, then in the long program a program with quads and no triple axels is worth slightly more in jump value then a program with no quads and triple axels.
Mens' SP
- Thread starter mizu_iro
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Assuming both max out combinations, then in the long program a program with quads and no triple axels is worth slightly more in jump value then a program with no quads and triple axels.
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2005
You are so right there.
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- Mar 28, 2005
He had better have both a triple axel and a quad-triple by Worlds or he shouldnt even bother showing up. He just isnt competitive right now. :scowl: :no:
Sorry, Joe, I was referring to Johnny. I thought your "it ain't over" in bold caps was aimed at those of us celebrating Johnny's skate lol.
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- Jul 11, 2003
It's ok Dodhiyel. I do like Johnny's skating which is also musical and with plenty of flow. But it's Stephane who has such body language and nuances and versatility in his skating which grabs me. I will be happy if either of these two win but I think given the COC, Stephane could ensure the GP Final with a win here.
Joe
Joe
It's not as simple as that. Lambiel is not known for skating clean FSs and his jump landings are often iffy. He gets -GOE on some of his jumps, and that makes them LESS valuable than Johnny's textbook jumps.
At Cup of China, Lambiel didn't land either 4T attempt, and one was underrotated. He got -GOE on his loop and his lutz, and he fell on the flip. His only combination was a 3S2T, and he got only 6.7 points for it.
I am sure he's in better shape now than he was two weeks ago, but it's still very questionable as to whether he has all of his jumps back, AND if he will have sufficient stamina to get through the FS without major mistakes.
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- Mar 28, 2005
Actually look at the protocals for his competitions at Skate Canada and the Worlds last year in the long programs. He had some major mistakes on multiple jumps, but those jumps he landed cleanly (not a fall or major step out) he averaged very high +GOE for, I think only Joubert at Worlds had more. When he lands his jumps cleanly, not stepped out or two footed, he gets very good GOE generally.
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- Jul 27, 2003
I'm so happy for Johnny!!!
I really hope he goes for the quad in the LP!
Oops, just saw Lambiel beating him (so slightly) with a 2A and a 4T-2T. Lower TES but higher PCS. I'm sure having a quad helps to up the PCS, even without the 3A!
All the more reason for Johnny to add the quad in the long. (Not that I have any faith that Lambiel can skate a clean LP...)
No, having better CHOREOGRAPHY, TRANSITIONS, and INTERPRETATION helps with PCS.
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- Jul 27, 2003
Seriously, slutskayafan21. I think he KNOWS he's supposed to do a 4/3.
Can you stop acting like skaters are jumping machines and will be able to do just whatever jumps that their mind tells them to???
This is not last year. He was at least trying the 3A then, and did 4/3 combinations. This year, he simply is not in the same condition he was last season. He did well to just edge Johnny in the SP, and only by being boosted in the PCS scores.
People who watched the SP thought Lambiel's performance was a little lackluster, and not up to his standard. Stamina may be a major issue for him in the FS.
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- Jul 27, 2003
Who are the "people" that you mentioned? I felt he totally poured his heart into it and I've never seen another male skater dance like that on the ice. The jumps may have been all there, but the performance quality was so NOT lackluster. Amazing program.
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- Mar 28, 2005
Well I saw it on that Russian TV station that I was somehow able to download again screwing around with, and I thought he looked a bit heavy and slow compared to his best, but he looked in better shape then Cup of China atleast. He skated with passion and seemed to be happy and smiling, which he wasnt at Cup of China were he looked sad and unenthused. I hope he keeps working hard, getting back in better shape, and getting his jumps back to optimum. I also hope his next axel technique pays off for him later in the year and he can have a more solid triple.
Have you actually SEEN his new program, and how he performed it here? Or are you speaking on a previously biased opinion? (Since this new SP is vastly different in style and choreography than anything else he's done)
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- Mar 28, 2005
I liked his program. I thought his score was a bit low too. It will be interesting to see how his scores compare to Voronov did last week in the end. Well his SP is already a bit higher then Voronov last week, but the LP score of Voronov from last week might be a bit tougher challenge to match so it will be interesting to see if he can.
Well the thing about Lambiel and the triple axel is that it's obvious that he knows that he can win without it, so he won't put one unless he knows 100% that he will land it and considering that his quad is back, I think the chances of seeing tomorrow are next to none. Stephane, Jeff and their teams are not clueless, they know by now how much their PCS scores make for their lack of certain jumps. I mean look at Lutai and Jeff program, under the old system their difference would have been huge with CoP they have the same score but the difference that the old system had (the jumps) no longer counts.
If I'm not wrong Stephane has never been healthy due his knees surgery, so is it worthy to try a jump it's most likely to fail, fall and maybe get injured, all that considering that he knows he can win without bothering about it? No.
I think he should, to me it does bother me that Stephane is considered such a great skater when he does not have a 3a. I know that he has everything else, he is pretty much perfect in every other aspect, but part of being a great skater is having the whole package and he is missing a very important jump.
Jeff, I think the age thing is a factor. Sometimes I forget he is 25 and if you don't have a quad by 25, you shouldn't try it because in his case, it could be troublesome. Jeff should focus on the other jumps, against a clean Joubert, Stephane, Evan and Johnny he may not have a chance anymore to win, but Jeff has been injured so many times, that I don't think he should try to risk it, especially if he wants to make it until 2010. Now one has to wonder if he failed his jumps because his quad training, or something else.
If I'm not wrong Stephane has never been healthy due his knees surgery, so is it worthy to try a jump it's most likely to fail, fall and maybe get injured, all that considering that he knows he can win without bothering about it? No.
I think he should, to me it does bother me that Stephane is considered such a great skater when he does not have a 3a. I know that he has everything else, he is pretty much perfect in every other aspect, but part of being a great skater is having the whole package and he is missing a very important jump.
Jeff, I think the age thing is a factor. Sometimes I forget he is 25 and if you don't have a quad by 25, you shouldn't try it because in his case, it could be troublesome. Jeff should focus on the other jumps, against a clean Joubert, Stephane, Evan and Johnny he may not have a chance anymore to win, but Jeff has been injured so many times, that I don't think he should try to risk it, especially if he wants to make it until 2010. Now one has to wonder if he failed his jumps because his quad training, or something else.
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