Lipnitskaya vs. Edmunds

[Sam-Skwantch]

I swear those are hips???:confused2:

http://ffkm.ru/images/gallery/2014-08-20_Tests_d1/C0914.jpg

I really don't care for discussing this stuff and TBH if some skater is going to have a tough time with puberty, isn't that more reason to just simmer down and let people enjoy them while they can since some inevitable jump killing clock is ticking?

 

[papa]

What is it with this American big bottoms obsession?
I respect their femininity standards, but why do they try to impose them on rest of the world?
Moreover, if you just can't sleep at night thinking the best skater in the world is not "big" enough there, if you really, really need symptoms of Yulia development in "those" areas, just take a look at her 2012 pictures, when she was ~14yo and compare her figure then with the present one.
You'd have to be blind, to deny that she has "developed".

PS.
I wrote it before, I repeat myself once again: if you don't respect champions of your beloved sport for whatever reason (too young, too slim, too Russian) - you're hurting the sport, you're ridiculing it, you're making it laughable.

- So, who's #1 skater right now?
- XXX, but she hasn't got her hips yet, so...
- ???

Change the rules (minimum age?, puberty tests?, minimum hipline requirements?) or change your attitude and respect your champions.

 

[yyyskate]

^^ lol, be a dictator, whatever you wish. People will only respect champions that earned their respect. and who is hurting the sport, skating fans, LOL.
it is none other than the Sochi scandal that tarnished our sports and champions.

 

[papa]

People will only respect champions that earned their respect.

So what does Yulia Lipnitskaya have to do to earn your respect?
Start eating at McDonalds? :sarcasm:

 

[shine]

With her long limbs, Polina reminds me of Tanaquil LeClercq, the charter NYCB ballerina. Someone once said LeClercq could dance with both delicacy and attack. It will be interesting to see how Polina develops.

That's a great compliment to Polina!

OTOH, I was hoping to see more interesting discussion than all the "will she grow, will she not grow" posts that have taken up about half of the discussion in this thread.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

So what does Yulia Lipnitskaya have to do to earn your respect?
Start eating at McDonalds? :sarcasm:

I don't think everyone needs to respect or even like her. It's the level of disrespect that I find off putting.

 

[papa]

I don't think everyone needs to respect or even like her. It's the level of disrespect that I find off putting.

Like? Of course not.
For example, huge number of NBA fans dislike LeBron James, many sincerely hate him.
Same thing with Cristiano Ronaldo in football/soccer and so on...

But every single fan of the sport respects them and recognizes them as champions.

 

[shine]

Where exactly is the disrespect for Yulia and her accomplishments?

 

[Amei]

Really? Did she say that personally? If she'll really do so it will be a big waste. ..imagine if Kostner or Asada had quit at 19 hwell:

I'm not aware of any interview where she has said that she is retiring at 19; though I don't read Russian so everything I get is based off of what comes off the boards. But why do you say 'if she does it will be a big waste?' --- If she continues to the age of 19 (through 2018 Olympics) and only has minor success over the next 4 years, like only a couple of podium finishes every year & maybe 1 gold; she would be highly decorated athlete. Why would it be a big waste for a successful athlete to retire and move on to something else in her life on her own terms?

 

[Sandpiper]

What is it with this American big bottoms obsession?
I respect their femininity standards, but why do they try to impose them on rest of the world?
....
Change the rules (minimum age?, puberty tests?, minimum hipline requirements?) or change your attitude and respect your champions.

:yes:

I'm not aware of any interview where she has said that she is retiring at 19; though I don't read Russian so everything I get is based off of what comes off the boards. But why do you say 'if she does it will be a big waste?' --- If she continues to the age of 19 (through 2018 Olympics) and only has minor success over the next 4 years, like only a couple of podium finishes every year & maybe 1 gold; she would be highly decorated athlete. Why would it be a big waste for a successful athlete to retire and move on to something else in her life on her own terms?

We're too used to the "won't stop competing!!" generation of the past while.

 

[jkun]

my two favorite skaters for the next quad. Yulia does have problems with her skating but she is very charming on ice, and regardless of whether she's called musical or whatever, she always has my attention. Polina is more graceful and also has a certain charm to her. I wish both the best.

 

[chuckm]

I don't see that it's disrespectful to say that Yulia isn't past puberty yet. Let's face it: Mao Asada's skating was far smoother, lighter and easier in 2006 than it was in 2010 and 2014, and her 3a was certainly more secure. She was 15 in 2006 and didn't get much taller, and not much fuller in the body, but her body did change, and the changes did affect her skating.

Yulia's skating is light, smooth and easy now, and deserving of accolades. Whether she can continue with the same degree of success for the next four years remains to be seen.

 

[skatedreamer]

With her long limbs, Polina reminds me of Tanaquil LeClercq, the charter NYCB ballerina. Someone once said LeClercq could dance with both delicacy and attack. It will be interesting to see how Polina develops.

Wow, I can't think of a better compliment. If Polina (or anyone, for that matter) can develop into that kind of a skater, both she(he) and the skating world would be very fortunate, indeed.

 

[RABID]

I know this might sound irrelevant but seeing her apparent close relationship to the ebullient Jason Brown and her own cheerful and up-beat personality gives me an idea of her personality and then when you compare that to what she has accomplished in only a few short years makes me think about the trajectory she is on; her "bell curve" is very, very attractive. I would say that if "alchemy" is an important part of success then she has it in spades... Yulia, on the other hand seems equally fascinating but very Russian; very different. I think this thread comparing the two is very timely and fascinating and I expect by the end of this coming season even relevant as in very relevant...

 

[lefeury]

I am a retired working musician, vocalist, teacher, and performance coach. Have to agree with Sam-Skwanch on his understanding of musicality. Performance coaching for some involves using tried and true facial and hand movements with little depth. For those who have a more artistic and creative aspect, the coaching calls for more embodiment of the emotion and interpretation of the music and development of the character.

 

[RABID]

I am a retired working musician, vocalist, teacher, and performance coach. Have to agree with Sam-Skwanch on his understanding of musicality. Performance coaching for some involves using tried and true facial and hand movements with little depth. For those who have a more artistic and creative aspect, the coaching calls for more embodiment of the emotion and interpretation of the music and development of the character.

The history of music and its various interpretations of "expression" has proven that music belongs to all of us. Some of us are more sensitive to the various nuances, true, but unless one is tone deaf all of us are intimate with the idea of "musicality"; any place in the world, any age, any gender and any race.... The above highlighted quote inferring that one who approaches a performance from this angle has little to no musicality reminds me of the old saying, "there are many roads that lead to Mecca". Just a reminder, it was this approach that Yuna is quoted as using. Then again some might say that she is deficient in her sense of musicality. Everyone has their opinion...

 

[Chipi]

Both girls are not good at music as you guys assume.

 

[Amei]

Both girls are not good at music as you guys assume.

Totally Agree I do like that Yulia mentioned in an interview that doing shows helped her with connecting to the music.

I take musical interpretation similar to musical taste; there are people in this world that think Jay-z and Justin Bieber are great musicians - I think those 2 are so far from a 'musician' that Pluto and planet Earth are closer to each other... But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

 

[Krunchii]

Both girls are not good at music as you guys assume.

Nope they're not that great YET, they're both 16, so much time to develop, I'm not worried at all because they both seem focused on furthering themselves and this sport in their own ways.

 

[YLFan]

chuck, you magically don't seem to have have the same concerns for Polina Edmunds nor for girls who haven't even gone through their 15 year growth spurt.

You just keep wanting to put Yulia in this box and discreding all her wins while desperately hoping for anything to derail her career.

The other day I was looking at a picture of Yulia on the podium next to Tatiana and Ksenia and her size isn't that radically different than them.

I think its fair to say Yulia will always be more naturally more petite than Tatiana or Ksenia. So basically in the next few years her body will be somewhere between where it is now and still slimmer than those girls.

Thats not much of a change. And theres nothing to suggest that would prevent her from continuing to be one of the top skaters in the world.

Girls who get heavily derailed by growth seem to either be not that talented in the first place or have an extreme size/weight gain.

Yulia is too naturally small to ever have an extreme size gain. Sure when shes in her 20's and not competitively training or had kids, her body will be bigger.

But we aren't talking about that far in the future. We are talking about the next 3 1/2 years.

Frankly if Yulia lost some consistency on her jumps it wouldn't affect her standing that much because the competition isn't super strong and most of her real competition hasn't even gone through the 15 year growth spurt yet so the things you are prescribing for Yulia could affect her competitors more.