Ladies' Grand Prix Final Points Breakdown

slutskayafan21 · Dec 6, 2007

Kwanford Wife said:
Oh how I wish you skating fans would make up your minds... is Kimmie only a jumping machine or is she a presentation only lady... I can't remember who to like and dislike if y'all don't figure out which box to put which skater in... Next thing you know - we'll have skaters who are just great, all around skaters and then what will we do??? (KW storms off - but not before giving sluskayafan a wink and a smile...)

chuckm · Dec 6, 2007

bekalc said:
I think that Rochette would help herself out a lot, by ditching the 3/3 in the short, and putting it in her long program. I don't know why she doesn't attempt it in her long.. I would think going for that triple/triple in the long would be less stressful, and once she started hitting it, she'd probably be able to develop confidence with it.

But yeah, the judges were totally willing to give Joannie the world championship in 2006, and she blew it.

Ditching the 3/3 in the short? She hasn't tried a 3/3 in the SP since the 2004-2005 season when she did a 3T+3T. I think she actually landed it cleanly just once; the other times she two-footed the second jump.

It's been 3 years since we've seen a 3/3 attempt from Rochette. She's talked about it a lot, but that's about as far as it's gone.

slutskayafan21 · Dec 6, 2007

chuckm said:
Ditching the 3/3 in the short? She hasn't tried a 3/3 in the SP since the 2004-2005 season when she did a 3T+3T. I think she actually landed it cleanly just once; the other times she two-footed the second jump.

It's been 3 years since we've seen a 3/3 attempt from Rochette.

Yeah kind of funny to read suggesting she "ditch" the triple-triple. That is like saying Oda or Weir should ditch the quad.

fumie_fumie · Dec 6, 2007

chuckm said:
Ditching the 3/3 in the short? She hasn't tried a 3/3 in the SP since the 2004-2005 season when she did a 3T+3T. I think she actually landed it cleanly just once; the other times she two-footed the second jump.

It's been 3 years since we've seen a 3/3 attempt from Rochette. She's talked about it a lot, but that's about as far as it's gone.

Joannie didn't talk about it a lot. It is the media that brought up 3/3 to Joannie. She is a smart lady and doesn't go around talking about things that she is going to do or she wants to do.

ChrisH · Dec 7, 2007

Mathman said:
^ Interesting. Missner is only 13th in technical scores, but third in presentation! :scratch:

Go Nana Takeda!

Yes, to hopefully answer that question and related ones, I think that I'll have to take a closer look at total jump downgrades and edge calls to see, for example, if the technical panel at the Trophee Eric Bompard was harsher than the others (except for the one at Skate America).

We all know that Kimmie is having rotation problems with her toe loop combos.

Kimmie's solo 3Lz (the 2nd jump in her free skate) has gotten her 7.20 points at SA and 7.00 points at TEB (Kimmie and Joannie have the best lutzes). Seemingly in concert with that, she has gotten dinged 3 out of 4 times for lips. Worst still, on her 3Lz+2T or 3Lz+3T combo in both of her free skates, she has singled her lutz and scrubbed the toe loop altogether. That 3T must be giving her nightmares. If she had hit one 3Lz+2T in either free skate, she'd comfortably be in 8th place in the TES and then her high PCS wouldn't feel so unbalanced.

BTW, Kimmie is tied with Nakano for the 2nd highest scoring spin this season (Czisny has the highest scoring spin while of course Caroline has the highest GoE for a spin). Her TEB free skate wasn't nearly as bad reported.

Perhaps Kimmie's jump problems have made it hard to see that she's improving on her weaknesses.

mizu_iro · Dec 7, 2007

ChrisH said:
Perhaps Kimmie's jump problems have made it hard to see that she's improving on her weaknesses.

That actually may be why her jumps are giving her problems...
She certainly has improved on the other aspects of her skating, even though I think her LP does absolutely NOTHING for her.

feraina · Dec 7, 2007

mizu_iro said:
She certainly has improved on the other aspects of her skating, even though I think her LP does absolutely NOTHING for her.

Her SP is wonderful, she's not naturally musical or artistic, but she skates her SP with speed, confidence, and polish. Her LP, though... It was a very late replacement, so perhaps she'll get more comfortable with it as the season progresses.

Wrlmy · Dec 7, 2007

Her SP is surprisingly good. Not up to par with Kwan's, but it is still excellent. The music is ber suitable for a technical skater Kimmie is. But I have to agree about her LP. I don't know who edited Nessun Dorma, but he/she really butchered the beautiful music, and the choresgraphy is quite hideous. There's nothing memorable about the choreagraphy nor does it flow with the music. I will never understand why Lori Nichol would throw in 3 or 4 turning camel thingys (I'm not sure what it's called. Kimmie's usual entry to her flying camel) to everywhere.

GoldMedalist · Dec 7, 2007

dlarry1 said:
You CANNOT compare points between events.

Yes you can. That's why there are world-records for points and such now.

Even with different callers and judges at events it's a better way of determining than placements, which can often be arbitrary.

cassieandcheetah · Dec 7, 2007

Wrlmy said:
Her SP is surprisingly good. Not up to par with Kwan's, but it is still excellent. The music is ber suitable for a technical skater Kimmie is. But I have to agree about her LP. I don't know who edited Nessun Dorma, but he/she really butchered the beautiful music, and the choresgraphy is quite hideous. There's nothing memorable about the choreagraphy nor does it flow with the music. I will never understand why Lori Nichol would throw in 3 or 4 turning camel thingys (I'm not sure what it's called. Kimmie's usual entry to her flying camel) to everywhere.

I like Kimmie, but I'm soo tired of her airplane arms and wooden performances that don't seem to improve at all even though years have already gone by. Even a fourteen year old like Caroline Zhang feels her music better. I just can't find any excuse for this. People say Nancy Kerrigan was terrible at artistry. No, she's great compred to Kimmie.

Tonichelle · Dec 7, 2007

cassieandcheetah said:
I like Kimmie, but I'm soo tired of her airplane arms and wooden performances that don't seem to improve at all even though years have already gone by. Even a fourteen year old like Caroline Zhang feels her music better. I just can't find any excuse for this. People say Nancy Kerrigan was terrible at artistry. No, she's great compred to Kimmie.

different strokes for different folks... I think Kimmie does just fine... Nancy bores me...

Kimmie's made improvements, I think she holds her arms better this season...

Bennett · Dec 7, 2007

cassieandcheetah said:
I like Kimmie, but I'm soo tired of her airplane arms and wooden performances that don't seem to improve at all even though years have already gone by. Even a fourteen year old like Caroline Zhang feels her music better. I just can't find any excuse for this. People say Nancy Kerrigan was terrible at artistry. No, she's great compred to Kimmie.

But it doesn't prevent her from getting decent PCSs

The same goes with MIki.

kikakiks · Dec 8, 2007

Bennett said:
But it doesn't prevent her from getting decent PCSs The same goes with MIki.

Looks like Kimmie got the third highest PCs (well, now I don't remember exactly the ranking)...i'm still asking myself how is that possible...Miki and Kimmie are for me two technical skaters and that's about it...

zephyrskates · Dec 8, 2007

i just hope that kimmie maxes out her combos. for the past year or so, most of the times in the LP she has only been doing two combinations.

Joesitz (RIP) · Dec 8, 2007

GoldMedalist said:
Yes you can. That's why there are world-records for points and such now.

Even with different callers and judges at events it's a better way of determining than placements, which can often be arbitrary.

I'm with diarry1 on this. I believe the sole purpose of the points is to arrive at a winner in the said competition only. If the points were of such importance to select world records, why shouldn't Joannie be in the Finals to even higher her total? After the last GP Joannie earned a total of 328.09 points and those points were ahead of Sarah Meier and Miki Ando in 7th and 8th places. She also beat out Caroline Zhang (309.9), Caroline Kostner (308.55) and Kimmie Meissner (321.97) of whom are in the Finals!

I just don't see how one can justify equality of scoring points between different competitions. It's obvious it can not. I would add if the importance of world-records in so important, that this particular world-record find another way.

Joe

museksk8r · Dec 8, 2007

chuckm said:
the 2004-2005 season when she did a 3T+3T. I think she actually landed it cleanly just once; the other times she two-footed the second jump.

You're wrong. Joannie did the 3toe+3toe cleanly 3 times in the 2004-2005 season (2004 Cup of China LP, 2005 Nationals LP, and 2005 Worlds LP). She two-footed the last jump in the 2004 Grand Prix Final LP and she stepped out of the last jump in the 2004 Trophee Eric Bompard LP.

GoldMedalist · Dec 9, 2007

Joesitz said:
I'm with diarry1 on this. I believe the sole purpose of the points is to arrive at a winner in the said competition only. If the points were of such importance to select world records, why shouldn't Joannie be in the Finals to even higher her total?

That's exactly the point. Why shouldn't Joannie be in the Finals. She proved herself to be the 4th best female skater in the World at this point in time. One of the spots in the GPF should be hers.

Kostner is lucky.

Ladies' Grand Prix Final Points Breakdown

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty

chuckm

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty

fumie_fumie

ChrisH

mizu_iro

feraina

Wrlmy

GoldMedalist

Match Penalty

cassieandcheetah

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll

Bennett

kikakiks

zephyrskates

Joesitz (RIP)

museksk8r

GoldMedalist

Match Penalty

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