Skaters' nicknames

seniorita · Nov 17, 2011

^ Arent Macedonians Greeks also? Dont worry I know that the whole universe but us say it, but if you are from Greece it is still funny to read it, it is like saying an American and a Texan

The "modern" term would be 小姐 (Mandarin xiao jie). Be careful though if you say it. In mainland China, it adopts the sense of "prostitute".

skatinginbc said:
The archaic term for Seniorita in Chinese would be 娘 (Middle Chinese /ṇaŋ/ "girl", Mandarin niang "mother, madam"). It is pretty much out of use now.

Thank you thank you, I already made my own phrase :biggrin:

:

娘 ❤ 羽生, はにゅう

Violet Bliss · Nov 17, 2011

seniorita said:
娘 ❤ 羽生, はにゅう

Translation: Mommy loves Hanyu.

姑娘 is more appropriate for "seniorita". And you may want to say 結弦(Yuzuru) instead of his surname 羽生.

skatinginbc · Nov 17, 2011

seniorita said:
娘 ❤ 羽生, はにゅう

That is so cute :laugh:

Mommy loves Hanyu :biggrin:

skatinginbc · Nov 17, 2011

Olympia said:
Might some of them be descended from Greeks and Macedonians who followed Alexander the Great through Asia to the Indus River, or am I in the wrong part of the continent for that?

Very good guess, but red-haired white people did not have to come from Europe. You would be amazed to learned of the red-haired mummies dug out from present-day Xinjiang, China and what Pliny the Elder (23 AD–79 AD) reported to Emperor Claudius regarding the people living in Serica "where silk is derived" (today's Northwestern China): "These people, they said, exceeded the ordinary human height, had flaxen hair, and blue eyes." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarim_mummies#Historical_records_and_associated_texts

Those Chinese mummies dressed in Tartan tunic like a Scot and spoke an extinct language (i.e., Tocharian 月氏語) strikingly similar to those of the Western Europe. It is the easternmost language of the Indo-European family yet belongs to the western branch (e.g, Celtic, Germanic). Were they originally from Europe? Unlikely. Black Sea area maybe. Anyway, as far as history could be traced, their homeland was in today's China.

Olympia · Nov 17, 2011

seniorita said:
^ Arent Macedonians Greeks also? Dont worry I know that the whole universe but us say it, but if you are from Greece it is still funny to read it, it is like saying an American and a Texan

Thank you thank you, I already made my own phrase :

娘 ❤ 羽生, はにゅう

Sorry, Seniorita! I was thinking not of ethnic or cultural relationships but of the political scene of 338 B.C., where there were all the different rulers, and Alexander and his father Philip took over what had been ruled by Athenians. Kind of like the time when Texas was a separate country in 1836 or so, though a large proportion of the inhabitants there (called Texians at the time) were from the United States. No offense meant.

Thanks, BC, for everything you're sharing with us! I had learned about Tocharian but didn't know anything about its possible speakers.

While we're on the subject of Indo-European languages, I'm fascinated by how the sheer number of its related languages. Is there anywhere else in the world where so many major languages are related? Maybe the Chinese language family? The Indo-European family includes Sanskrit, Greek, Albanian, the Romance languages, the Slavic languages, the Baltic languages, the Germanic languages, Iranian Farsi, and other groups I may have left out. When I first learned this as a college student, I assumed the whole world was set up that way, but for example there are several different language groups used on the Indian subcontinent alone, and bunches of unrelated languages spoken on the African continent (though there are some major groups--Bantu and Hausa, I think). Do I sound stupid about this? Except for what I learned about Indo-European languages in college as a medievalist, I'm largely self-taught. And willing to learn more!

Threads like this make me extra-glad that skating is so international. I only wish it were possible for other countries to participate, but it's so dependent on climate and electrical power for indoor ice facilities.

let`s talk · Nov 17, 2011

skatinginbc said:
Well, it is in fact a Japanese slang Iro otoko (色男) meaning "a ladies’ man" or a handsome man

Hmm.. I wouldn't put it like that. A "handsome man" would be either a pro-English version ハンサム, or a much more common Japanese word 男前 (otoko mae: man+front, i.e. face or look in this case). The iro otoko 色男 is more about the feeling than about the appearance, which in case of Dai is quite nice but his face is rather usual-looking by Japanese standards. I think the girl who had that iro otoko stuff wanted to express her admiration of his tenderness, gentle attitude, politeness, good spirit coming from him to people, his nice talks, etc. The iro otoko is not necessary about handsomeness or sexuality, especially in their western senses.

Have no idea what these kanji mean in Chinese porn. And care even less.

skatinginbc · Nov 17, 2011

Yup, I agree "handsome man" wasn't quite good of a translation.
色 means (1) color, (2) sensuality / lust
色男 = lust man or ladies' man (hot guy, lover boy....)
男色 = man lust or homosexuality.

Was that Japanese fan's sign written in the correct order?

Just kidding, playing with words.

Ilvskating · Nov 18, 2011

[QUOmE=skatinginbc;592693]Shizuka means "quiet" or "calm". I don't know if it has something to do with "cool".[/QUOTE]

The Chinese characters for Shizuka means quiet fragrance, or serene fragrance. It fits her well in my opinion

She quietely ooz enchanting fragrance when she skates.

Ilvskating · Nov 18, 2011

Olympia said:
Yup! We're related to German, Scandinavian languages, Dutch and the Dutch-based Afrikaans, and I think Flemish. But we're way out there in terms of all sorts of vocabulary and structural features because we had that infusion of Romance languages when the Normans (French-speaking) took over and revamped English to their needs. The difference between Old English, or Anglo-Saxon (in which Beowulf was created) and Middle English (in which Chaucer wrote) is huge.

This is OT, but one interesting thing about English after the Normans changed it is that it lost most gender markers. Except for obvious nouns like boy or grandmother, most nouns aren't feminine or masculine gender. You don't have to make the article or the adjective agree with the noun. To my knowledge, English is the only major language without gender markers. Anyone here know of any other genderless languages?

I think the people of Iceland are among the few remaining Western people who use real patronymics as their last names: their surnames come from their fathers (sometimes their mothers), so each generation has a different surname. People in Sweden, Norway, and Denmark often have names ending in -sen or -son, but those names come down from more distant ancestors, and they don't change in each generation. I don't know how they deal with genealogy there--interesting question.

How nifty about Michelle's last name! I had forgotten that bit from Jerry McGuire.

Chinese does not have gender, if you are talking about languages in general, not just western languages. It was a great challenge for me to learn French as it does not make any sense to me why a table is masculine and a chair has to be feminine.

let`s talk · Nov 22, 2011

skatinginbc said:
Yup, I agree "handsome man" wasn't quite good of a translation.
色 means (1) color, (2) sensuality / lust
色男 = lust man or ladies' man (hot guy, lover boy....)

In some contexts "iro otoko" can be used in the meaning of "playboy" or some sort of not a serious guy. But I doubt that it was the case with that fan logo in Sapporo. Lust? Or no. Just "sexy man" would be more than enough. Still not exactly in the same sense as it is used in the westen culture, where "sexy" is often about appearance, while "iro otoko" is more about feeling and attitude.

男色 = man lust or homosexuality.

Was that Japanese fan's sign written in the correct order? Just kidding, playing with words.

Oh, dear.. what thoughts are your having... must be your lust speaking... Just kidding, playing with words. :laugh:

No, I am sure Dai is straight. If the man doesn't advertise a bunch of his female lovers, like American celebrities often do, it doesn't mean that he is what you are implying. The mentality and the culture are different. We didn't know much about Oda's future wife until he married her. Also, Dai is from Okayama, a provincial place. This background could play some role too. And, don't forget that he is just a nice guy to mess around!

Btw, Tatyana Volosozhar has a beautiful last name. In the old Russian it means the Pleiades.

sorcerer · Nov 22, 2011

Ilvskating said:
It was a great challenge for me to learn French as it does not make any sense to me why a table is masculine and a chair has to be feminine.

Well, table is feminine and it is tableau that is masculine, but ITA that it doesn't make any sense giving gender to things.

Olympia · Nov 22, 2011

Ilvskating said:
Chinese does not have gender, if you are talking about languages in general, not just western languages. It was a great challenge for me to learn French as it does not make any sense to me why a table is masculine and a chair has to be feminine.

Yes, I was talking about languages in general. Thanks for the information! I think that all major Western languages do have gender, except for English. And I agree with you; it doesn't seem logical for inanimate objects to have gender, but it seems to be nearly universal, with the exceptions we've noted. I'm always hoping I'll figure out why someday. Might it, for example, have something to do with the ancient belief that everything was sacred and had some kind of living essence? I'm just speculating here.

Let's Talk, that is so lovely about Volosozhar's last name meaning the Pleiades. This is what's so wonderful about names: they can be little treasure boxes of history or poetic description.

Bluebonnet · Nov 22, 2011

Do you know what's the meaning of Patrick Chan's Chinese name 陈伟群? 陈 is his surname. If I'm not mistaken on the word been used in his Chinese name, 伟群, which is his given name, means "great and outstanding above the crowd".

skatinginbc · Nov 23, 2011

let`s talk said:
Tatyana Volosozhar has a beautiful last name. In the old Russian it means the Pleiades.

Ha, she is a Subaru (Japanese name for the Pleiades, after which an automobile company is named).

Volosozhar = Volos (hair) + o (of) + zhar (heat)

昴 (Chinese name for the Pleiades) = hairy head

I guess there must be a common Central Asian source from which the ancient Chinese and Russians borrowed the "hair" connotation for the constellation.

Olympia · Nov 23, 2011

skatinginbc said:
Ha, she is a Subaru (Japanese name for the Pleiades, after which an automobile company is named).

Volosozhar = Volos (hair) + o (of) + zhar (heat)

昴 (Chinese name for the Pleiades) = hairy head

I guess there must be a common Central Asian source from which the ancient Chinese and Russians borrowed the "hair" connotation for the constellation.

What an amazing connection! I'm envisioning some long-ago observatory somewhere along the Silk Route....of course, the Arabs from their Golden Age were master astronomers; in fact, though most constellations have Greek or Roman names in the West, many stars (Deneb, Aldebaran, Algol) have Arabic names even in Europe and by extension North America. And didn't their empire stretch across South Asia, to places like Samarkand and Tashkent? Anyone know any Arabic? I have a book of star names at home; I'll see if there's any information that I can find there.

Subaru, huh? >chuckle< Never would have guessed that origin for a car name. I suppose why not? The Pontiac was named after a fabled Native American (or maybe from the city of Pontiac, which was named after this chief).

Ilvskating · Nov 24, 2011

sorcerer said:
Well, table is feminine and it is tableau that is masculine, but ITA that it doesn't make any sense giving gender to things.

You're right. When I said table, I was thinking bureau as the corresponding french word, on retrospect, I should have said "desk". In Chinese， we can use 桌子 for both table and desk, when thinking about more, desk means more like the ones for study and office work? Then we have more specific words for those, like 书桌，办公桌，and more recently, 老板台，the big fancy desks for the bosses:）

silverpond · Nov 24, 2011

I like to think of the great skaters who are known by their first names, not nicknames -- Peggy, Dorothy, Michelle, Elvis, Kurt, etc.

Nadine · Nov 25, 2011

Haven't read the thread, but wanted to add the nicknames of two of my all-times favorites:

Sonja Henie ~ "Pavlova On Ice"

Oksana Baiul ~ "The Swan"

ps: Toller Cranston did a painting years and years and years ago which depicted his view of how he saw some of the greatest skaters on ice ~ A-W-E-S-O-M-E ~ nothing like it! For those that have never seen it, I highly suggest you do so, it's in one of those old skating books about figure skating from the mid-90's I think.

skatinginbc · Nov 25, 2011

Indeed, I haven't seen any skater that could portray the swan better than Oksana did.

skatinginbc · Nov 26, 2011

Michelle Kwan (關穎珊 Cantonese: Kwan, Wingshan; Middle Chinese: Kwạn, Wéngshan; Mandarin: Guan Yingshan)

Wingshan 穎珊 is her Cantonese name, literally "sharp coral" or figuratively "the clever, precious one".

Her name illustrates that Cantonese preserves archaic Middle Chinese pronunciations in places where Mandarin has undergone a sound change.

Skaters' nicknames

seniorita

Violet Bliss

skatinginbc

skatinginbc

Olympia

let`s talk

Match Penalty

skatinginbc

Ilvskating

Ilvskating

let`s talk

Match Penalty

sorcerer

Olympia

Bluebonnet

skatinginbc

Olympia

Ilvskating

silverpond

Nadine

skatinginbc

skatinginbc

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