Well, I was talking about 3 jump combo not 2 jump combo, but 2A-3T should be fine just as 2A-3T-4Lo. It doesn't violate the rule of more revolution(s) per jump.
Loss of 20% seems a bit steep but without some deduction skaters can rack up points with easy sequences that do not look pretty. Yuzuru's 4T+3A+3A+3A above is pretty cool today, but imagine a lady doing 3T+2A+2A+2A+SEQ or something easier. Not sure how exciting that would look but it sure will collect points.
then why not giving a bonus (for ex. 10%) only for the second triple jump in a combo (or a triple following a quad)?
this way a 3Lz-3T gets a bonus on the 3T while a 2A-3T no... this should "force" skaters to train difficult combos
Lipinski was the famous one but I also hear that she just overtrained and it wasn't really just the 3-3 that killed her hip. Is there any other prominent skater who actually had a career-ending hip injury directly attributable to the 3-3Loop? Seeing Slutskaya, then Ando and Asada last this long while training their combinations makes me slightly doubtful.
For jump sequences (as opposed to true combinations), only the two highest-value jumps earn points, 80% of base value.
So there would be no value in putting more than two difficult jumps in a sequence. The other jumps are meant as connectors, usually half or single jumps.
Yes, it can look exciting and would be worth doing without the 80% penalty. Or keep the penalty but go back to allowing one turn (or step or edge change) between jumps, as long as the rhythm is maintained, so you could get things like 2A, falling leaf, inside three, 3T.
I definitely think one big problem with the new judging system is that there's little incentive to do hard combinations. It's kinda sad that Hanyu's doing solo quads (and splatting on the salchow) when he's capable of doing good combinations, because backloading gives him so many points (heck, he beat a clean Machida with an underrotated fall in the SP on the power of his LP base points). Under the new rules, there's no incentive (indeed, there's a punishment, since it's better to add those jumps to the second half) of pushing quad combos.
10% bonus for combo... then solo quad + 3-3-2 in the second half would still be worth more than 4-3-2 with solo triple. I'm conflicted about whether that's correct. (The 3-3-2 gets both the combo bonus /and/ the halfway bonus?) Maybe quad combos should have extra GOE or something.
I'd have less of a problem if Hanyu were regularly hitting both quads. I haven't worked out the points, but Hanyu evidently thinks it's fine to fall on one quad and have two triple axel combos rather than "wasting" one combo on a quad. Maybe this is a separate issue about falls not being punished harshly enough.
you're all thinking about this too complicated! Just get rid of sequence base value penalty and add 10% BV bonus to jumps done in combination. This 10% bonus makes a 3Lz-3T more worth it (more bonus points) than a 2A-3T.
10% bonus for combo... then solo quad + 3-3-2 in the second half would still be worth more than 4-3-2 with solo triple. I'm conflicted about whether that's correct. (The 3-3-2 gets both the combo bonus /and/ the halfway bonus?) Maybe quad combos should have extra GOE or something.
Well, of course, if there was more penalty on a rotated quad fall Hanyu probably would've gotten rid of the 4s after the 12-13 season when he first put it in competition and maybe saved trying the 4s again till after the Olympics - I know that Hanyu said that it was an obstacle that he wanted to overcome, but if there was such large of a difference in scoring, all skaters' layouts would be different and safer. Orser might have convinced him that it's not worth it to keep pushing at the 4s. The choreographed 4s fall strategy only worked because of the lack of penalty on falls. And, well, he was bound to get it sooner or later - thankfully he did at Worlds.Yeah, I heard about Orser. I have mixed feelings about Hanyu's insistence on the salchow. On one hand, this does point to one good thing about the judging system: since it forgives errors 6.0 does not, it gives more chances for people to push the sport forward. On the other hand, I really don't like it when the Olympic and world champion is opting for a strategy that's essentially "fall, it doesn't matter. I can handle the blow with my jacked-up base value." (Don't get me wrong, I like Hanyu). It confuses the hell out of normal people and doesn't do the sport a lot of good.
Can't there be a perfect system where I can have my 4-3-3 (and future 4-4?) and you can have your quad salchow (and future loop and flip), and everyone can win with their own unique abilities depending on who performed best that day? Haha, not happening, I know.
Well, I was talking about 3 jump combo not 2 jump combo, but 2A-3T should be fine just as 2A-3T-4Lo. It doesn't violate the rule of more revolution(s) per jump.
Initially I had the same feeling with you, I hated Hanyu's layout with "falling 4S strategy" and I though it was simply cheating the points, or what Japanese media reported as "designed to win". But when the season's finished, and I reviewed his results, I realized this "designed to win" layout only worked when the 4S is fully rotated, and must be back on track with the next 4T without hesitation, otherwise he would still get harshly punished. Of course we can still argue whether it makes sense that 10.5-GOE 3-deduction 1 = 6.5 still weighs more than a 3Lz. For me this 4pts punishment is almost enough. And if the single quad falls with UR and only gets 70% credit, he still can not avoid another -3 GOE then -1 deduction. So in retrospect, he's won GPF and OG with this cheating points layout, but it would not have worked if he had not fully rotated the 4S, and did 3A combination with difficult entries in 2nd half of program.
No I don't think so, I actually calculated it. If he does a 4T+3T combination then what jump does he have to do to replace the 4S? The next choice with highest BV will be 2A, not worthy at all.