Article: Michelle Kwan: The Kwaniacs Attack!

[R.D.]

Yes there are over the top Kwan fans, but the other side is doing their utmost to proclaim that ANY compliment to Kwan is uberfandom and psychotic rambling.

Very true as well. I personally have experienced the exact opposite, but there are those who are quick to lump people in with Kwan worshippers. I wonder how Kwan herself feels about all this? (Yes, I know people are gonna say she's not losing any sleep over it, but it's just a little question, OK?)

Being a Michelle Kwan fan practically makes you as famouse as Michelle Kwan! But seriously, the fact is simply Michelle is the most popular skater in the country. I'll go even farther, she's one of the most popular atheletes in the country. And the longer she's around, the more fans she seems to make. With so many people in her corner, they're not all gonna be upstanding, mature citizens that enjoy a lively but respectful debate about they're favorite athelete. Then again, you're not gonna find that with a single person, place or thing that has a more than two fans in this world. It's not about what you're a fan of, it's the kind of person you are. And about some people being provked by others behavior, just put things in perspective. Excuse my language, but who the h$!! cares if some people call you stupid for voicing your opinon. You just have to take a deep breath and realize it comes with the territory (trust me, I KNOW it's hard but it's just ice skating). As a sports writer, I find it hard to beileve that they've never had a barage of complaints and criticisims about something they wrote. Jeez, I babble too much about absolutely nothing

No, this is a good point actually. On the flip side, though, the response must have been SO big to prompt this writer to comment about it. Has he ever commented about OTHER fans' followings? This says alot, really. Blogs are more popular than a lot of people think (or want to think).

 

[flowjo35]

I was wondering when this was going to find its way here. Anyway all skaters have fans that can get out of hand, the thing is you can not let a couple of bad apples spoil the whole cart. Rgirl, unfortunately I think you are right about this thread being pages long, but hopefully it will not become a bashfest. It's funny, even though Michelle has not competed yet this season, I anticipate this having one of the longest threads so far this season.

 

[R.D.]

Rgirl, unfortunately I think you are right that this thread will be a lot of attention, but hopefully it will not become a bash fest about certain skaters fan.

No doubt about it. This thread is already two pages and I only posted this about an hour ago! (Although a lot of the same posters are in this.)

I did expect a swift response though, given the state of skating forums right now.

 

[Mathman]

I did expect a swift response though, given the state of skating forums right now.

Well, Red Dog, you woke me up anyway. I was about ready to go into hibernation, what with Joe already mad at me (sorry, Joe), Michelle injured (pretty much killing any interest I might have had in the Grand Prix this year) and Alissa Czysny getting only fifth place at Campbell's.

But still -- on the evil scale I cannot equate a super gusher who says, "Michelle is my goddess, she can do no wrong," with over-the-top haters who say, "I hope you die, b**ch."

MM

 

[Mathman]

!

Mandy Kane rocks! And today is Stupid Friday!

MM

 

[R.D.]

This comment by a MKF member really gets to the source of the craziness IMO:

I am a frequent poster at MKF. After reading all this I will concede that there are some over the top fans at the Forum. They have even attacked me on occasion. I'm not putting them down but please understand that they are very frightened about the new season. Some of them will never get over the change to CoP and view it as a direct slap in the face to our Michelle. They are very sensitive right now. It will take time, maybe lots of time for them to adjust.

I'll throw in that I don't think this is limited only to MKF, but to certain uber-Kwan fans everywhere.

 

[Mathman]

Nonsense. Nobody cares about the CoP.

 

[R.D.]

Nonsense. Nobody cares about the CoP.

I wasn't the one to make the comment, but the poster did say SOME people. Meaning that this is likely to be only a small minority who takes this to heart.

The Olympics is certainly making all of us crazy, to a certain extent. :scratch: I don't even want to imagine what the state of things will be like come January or February. Do I even want to be around?

 

[millie]

Well, Red Dog, you woke me up anyway. I was about ready to go into hibernation, what with Joe already mad at me (sorry, Joe), Michelle injured (pretty much killing any interest I might have had in the Grand Prix this year) and Alissa Czysny getting only fifth place at Campbell's.

But still -- on the evil scale I cannot equate a super gusher who says, "Michelle is my goddess, she can do no wrong," with over-the-top haters who say, "I hope you die, b**ch."

MM

Here are some more comments that were made

QUOTE:"Beware the wrath of Kwan"
"That womans not going to know what hit here"
"I can't wait to make a KwanNation banner for Nationals"
and calling Michelle, their girl.

These are some of the comments made to that woman Ann. It didn't take Ann very long to respond to them. Some of these fans are maniacs. i wonder if some of the things that she reported about are true. If they all go to Nationals, the non-fans are going to need PitBulls for bodyguards.

 

[R.D.]

I think it's fine for a community to refer to its purpose (whomever brought them together) as "theirs". I don't have a problem with that. But it's their behavior that I take issue with. I will admit that it's tough to find out which "reported" incidents are actually true or not, but I really do think there are some crazed fans out there (who make up a small minority, mind you) that we do need to worry about.

ETA: Your last comment- priceless. If I get the reactions I'm getting right now on an internet forum, I'm not even sure I want to go face-to-face with them.

 

[attyfan]

I sometimes wonder how much of this is "real" vs. how much is exaggerated. I don't know if it would necessarily apply to this post, but on FSU there was a report from someone who saw the cleaning crew take down a Sasha poster at 2004 Nats, but somehow it got turned into Kwan fans tearing it down -- and I'm sure that somewhere there was a Kwan poster taken down, with Sasha fans taking the blame.

 

[Mathman]

Here are some more comments that were made

"I can't wait to make a KwanNation banner for Nationals"
and calling Michelle, their girl.

If they all go to Nationals, the non-fans are going to need PitBulls for bodyguards.

Making a banner?

Saying, "Michelle's my girl?"

Are these your examples of outrageous behavior that requires bodyguards?

Horrors! What if someone gave Michelle a teddy bear! Call the cops!

MM

 

[Mathman]

Red Dog, you have to distinguish between the behavior of Kwan fans qua Kwan fans and the behavior of boorish idiots who happen also to be Kwan fans.

If you are mugged on the street by an Albanian, hate muggers, not Albanians.

MM

 

[emma]

Making a banner?

Saying, "Michelle's my girl?"

Are these your examples of outrageous behavior that requires bodyguards?

Horrors! What if someone gave Michelle a teddy bear! Call the cops!

MM

MM, hilarious as usual!!! About the Grand Prixs...I'm with you, it's not nearly as exciting/tension filled for me as it would be if Michelle were skating (here's hoping there is still a CoC chance), Plushy (he's only doing one, right?), and of course, Shen/Zhao...there's so much to see and hope and route for this season, but it has started on a kind of sour note for me. And the endless threads not about actual skating is just adding to this for me (imho).

 

[millie]

Making a banner?

Saying, "Michelle's my girl?"

Are these your examples of outrageous behavior that requires bodyguards?

Horrors! What if someone gave Michelle a teddy bear! Call the cops!

MM

No but, when the bring out their banners with THE KWANATICS ATTACK, thats when they will need the PitBulls.

By the way, the uber Sasha fans-the very young based on their post and the Sycho adults are getting the blame for all the blogs about Michelle fans.

 

[Rgirl]

Mathman,
I feel as if I understand where Red Dog is coming from when he says that excessive worship or love of a skater may play a role in the hate that is aimed at nonfans of Michelle. After all, it's not the first time love and hate have been connected. I'm going to use an extreme metaphor first just to make my point, but please read on because it's only a means to an end.

To me, extreme or twisted love, worship, etc. of Michelle might be compared to the abusive spouse who says, "But honey, I only beat the s*** out of that guy because he looked at you funny and I LOVE you so much, I just couldn't stand it." Hence, extreme or twisted love leads to hateful behaviior.

With Michelle, let's say somebody makes a joke about her recent losses at Worlds, something that some might perceive as lowbrow humor and others might perceive as terribly insensitive. Example off the top of my head (remember, it's supposed to be bad humor, but not intended as mean): "If Michelle keeps losing at Worlds we're going to have to call her Michelle Kwashed."

A few, some, many, who knows, people who love Michelle from heartfelt to religiously might find this joke so offensive that they take their frustration at Kwan's Worlds record over the past four years out on the poster of the joke. Instead of posting something like, "Ugh. Not funny," or even, "Hey, let's not kick a skater when she's down," some may post, "Typical Kwan basher. How long until you start calling her Hitler or maybe you already do?" which is very similar to comments I've received when a certain Kwan fan apparently decided whatever I'd said deserved such a response.

I'm sure the attack came out of the attacker's love for Michelle, but it led to hateful behavior. That's what I think Red Dog is talking about, although I don't mean to speak for him or anyone else. That's just my take on it.

Like most things, not all love equals good, just as all hate does not equal bad. I hate genocidal regimes. I should hate them. If I love someone or something so much that I hurt innocent bystanders, that's not good. Even love and hate, IMO, have gray areas.

Rgirl

 

[Piel]

:"Beware the wrath of Kwan"
"That womans not going to know what hit here"
"I can't wait to make a KwanNation banner for Nationals"
and calling Michelle, their girl.

Call me Kwanfused but the above comments don't seem to be threatening at all. I haven't seen them in context but from what Millie has posted I just don't get the problem.
"Beware the wrath of Kwan" to me is a reference to how MK seems to skate better when she is the underdog.

"That woman's not going to know what hit here" ....what woman? Again to me it is along the line of "you ain't seen nothing yet" (until you've seen Kwan put down one of her really great skates).

"I can't wait to make a KwanNation banner for Nationals"...SO??? Is this any different than "Sasha Rocks", or football fans painting their faces?

"Their girl"....again, SO??? MK is their favorite, their girl.

Being a Kwanfan it has always puzzled me as to what people find to dislike about her. She doesn't come across as having very strong personality traits or bad habits like a lot of skaters that would turn folks one way or the other. Bobek had bad training habits, Kerrigan dissed Mickey, Oksana had a DUI, Tonya smoked among others things, Tara and Sasha both come across as "look at me", Irina has whined over the judging. Kwan has done none of that and maybe that where some of the "she's so boring" comes from? Yea, maybe she is boring personality wise but is that enough for her to be so disliked? I don't mean so as numbers of nonKwans but so as in degree of dislike by those who voice very negative comments about her.

When I talk to someone about skating if they are not a Kwan fan they are generally a Tara/Sasha fan (I'm talking about people I know or meet personally not message board fans). When I ask them why they prefer Tara/Sasha a lot reply "Tara/Sasha is just so tiny and cute. This response is usually from younger fans who even though they are not that much younger than MK seem to relate toTara/Sasha as one of them. With older fans here in Redneck U.S.A. the most common response is "I just like the American girls better" :sheesh: : These same folks tend not to have been Kristi or Debi fans either.

My conclusion is that some people dislike her because she doesn't look like Peggy or Dorothy who they seem to consider the all American ice princesses. As for folks from other countries I think it's becase she has won so many World championships.Just my observations,

 

[Mathman]

Rgirl, just when I'm working myself up into a good ol' soul-satisfying, self-righteous mad, here you come, the voice of reason as usual.

I hate that Kwan fans have hounded you and continue to do so.

I hate that Kwan fans have deliberately, in my opinion, distorted some of Red Dog's posts.

I would hate it if these things had been done by Kevin van der Perren fans, too.

But the fact is, they weren't.

 

[marcijack]

Piel

My thoughts exactly. I lurk on Sashafans (just like I do here LOL) and a lot of comments that I feel are racist are made about her. Some people are just down right mean and immature. And notice how most of the nasty responses posted on the blog were anonymous. If I were Heather, GinnySmith et al, I would be filing a lawsuit against Mercury for libel. A moderator should have taken those posts down yesterday.

RedDog - there a lot of board bullies on the internet. They would not have the nerve to say the things they post/email to your face. And, most people on message boards are childish/immature because they're young and have lots of free time. I'm a single female and work full time. The last thing on my mind after working and running errands is harrassing someone who doesn't like my favorite skater (Michelle).

 

[R.D.]

Rgirl- I hate to say this, but I think you slightly misunderstood my point. However, I do agree with what you said. This is stuff that's almost never discussed at these internet forums, and I was hoping that the thread would lean this way. This issue really needs to be thrown out there, and you are really getting to the heart of what this is all about. So keep the analysis coming-

My original point (for clarification) was that I think that there is a link between the hate spewed at Kwan and her fans of Kwan's "haters" or "non-fans", and the undying love of her fans. To put that into English, lol, the extreme "love-fans" behavior, either indirectly or directly, leads to some of the intense hatred of her non-fans/haters.