Child prodigy vs late bloomer

[yume]

I mean by child prodigy a skater who end frequently on podiums, especially big ones since juniors, win every big medal but retires before 20yo for ladies and before 25yo for men.

By late bloomer i mean someone who become successful in their 20s. I mean winning gpf, 4cc/euros, worlds medals. Not a gp medal there and there.

It seems like most of people value "long careers" more than "short careers", even if those short careers are more successful. But many of the skaters who have long careers are late bloomers. Meaning they started to win big medals at an advanced age. Before that they weren't in conversation for podiums (eg: Butyrskaya, Wagner, Osmond, Akiko Suzuki, Fernandez, Kolyada, Tatsuki Machida).

If you were a skater, would you prefer to be a baby jumper who has Medvedeva's 3 first senior seasons and retire at 18-19yo or someone like Butyrskaya who become really successful in late 20s but skated long?

 

[Skatesocs]

I'd rather have whoever skates better.

 

[yume]

I'd rather have whoever skates better.

Not bad. But those who skate better don't necessarily win things.

 

[macy]

that's a hard question, but for me i would choose to have a longer career. even if you are a late bloomer, you can still win GP, GPF, world, olympic medals. i also think having the amount of success someone like Medvedeva had those first 2-3 seasons created a lot of pressure that would not have been there otherwise, especially in the olympic season as well as the amount of criticism she experienced after the olympics. i would rather have more experiences to look back on and cherish, and maybe a few medals thrown in vs golds at every competition when i was too young to really understand. things change a lot when you enter your 20s, your understanding and outlook on life and your experiences become a lot different. if i had a career that resembled Wagner's, i'd be so happy to have so many years at the top level of my sport to look back on and also be a world medalist, even if it was only once.

 

[MalAssada]

Well, if I were a skater, I don't think I'd be cut out for coaching, so for me I'd rather a Medvedeva-like career and follow it up by dedicating myself fully to university and later on, jobs. I also think child-wonders get more opportunity for sponsorships than late bloomers, but that's just a guess, really.

If I breathed figure skating, however, and hoped to later become a coach/judge/wathever, then I suppose being a late bloomer might inspire more trust. Show that, if a skater's jumps begin failing them after puberty, or maybe someone who hopes to be a late bloomer themselves, that there's still a chance of success.

 

[Skatesocs]

Not bad. But those who skate better don't necessarily win things.

Eh that's okay, in my books. Unfortunate, but okay.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I think the days of long careers and late bloomers are over. Even recent skaters who had periods of dominance like Yuna could win without a 3Lo, 3A, or quads, and you just can't accrue enough points with a 6 triple LP to beat what we're seeing from the Russian women now. Then the question becomes, will the women who are doing quads keep them past the age 18? We've had one skater achieve that at Worlds, but most of the women who have landed the jump are still pretty young. I suspect that, between growth spurts and the increased likelihood of injury training more difficult jumps, we won't see most of the skaters doing quads into their 20s.

 

[mrrice]

I think there's something to be said for skaters that do well late into their careers. Most said that Maria was way past her prime and thought that 1998 would be her final season. She continued and won the Championship in 99 and I believe she is still the oldest Ladies Champion in history.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I don't hold it against a skater for having a short career or a long career, nor do they owe it to us. But there are several skaters who could have had shorter careers due to early success but showed growth artistically, and sometimes even technically, by choosing to stay on.

Some skaters also stay on due to love of the sport and simply won't retire at the "top of their game" so to speak, and that's truly commendable.

If a skater burns out early in their career in the pursuit of success while their bodies can manage it (because who knows what injury/growth spurt/etc. is lurking around the corner), they might as well go for it. There's no guarantee that if you bide your time and don't burn out you'll still be top of the heap - especially for countries like Russia where a string of accolades can get cut short by the next best thing showing up. Put your best skate forward, as they say.

 

[Jeanie19]

I'm not sure Evgenia is a good example as a child prodigy. She has not retired and we don't know if she will skate for years to come. Plus 7 seasons on the international stage is very good.

 

[yume]

I'm not sure Evgenia is a good example as a child prodigy. She has not retired and we don't know if she will skate for years to come. Plus 7 seasons on the international stage is very good.

I don't use Medvedeva as example, i use her 3 first seniors seasons. She still is competing and her career isn't short (at least for a Russian lady). Not really long either, maybe intermediate? She's 20 soon 21 with 5 (6?) senior seasons. She isn't Kostner but this isn't bad.

 

[yume]

I think there's something to be said for skaters that do well late into their careers. Most said that Maria was way past her prime and thought that 1998 would be her final season. She continued and won the Championship 99 and I believe she is still the oldest Ladies Champion in history.

And it's impressive.

I think the days of long careers and late bloomers are over. Even recent skaters who had periods of dominance like Yuna could win without a 3Lo, 3A, or quads, and you just can't accrue enough points with a 6 triple LP to beat what we're seeing from the Russian women now. Then the question becomes, will the women who are doing quads keep them past the age 18? We've had one skater achieve that at Worlds, but most of the women who have landed the jump are still pretty young. I suspect that, between growth spurts and the increased likelihood of injury training more difficult jumps, we won't see most of the skaters doing quads into their 20s.

Yes. Not everyone is Butyrskaya, Kostner or Suzuki who could up their game or maintain competitive layouts in late 20s. It was already difficult with triples, but with quads...

I don't know if i can really call her late bloomer but Bradie Tennell competed long in juniors, made her senior debut at 19yo, got in gpf and won her 4cc medal at 22yo. Judges score her well. She is training 3A. We will see.

 

[Mathman]

Irina Slutskaya is an example of a skater who started out just OK, then got stronger and stronger as her lengthy career unfolded.

 

[ladyjane]

Irina Slutskaya is an example of a skater who started out just OK, then got stronger and stronger as her lengthy career unfolded.

And she showed some really good jumping too, later on in her career. I'll never forget the triple lutz triple loop combo in 'wonderland' when she won her second WC in 2005. It's one of those programmes I love watching, again and again.

Kostner started early (she got her first world medal in 2005) and as a jumper. She got better and better, had to quit for a period, and then came back to still get 5th place at the Olympics and medals at Europeans. I'm a fan.

I like to follow skaters through the years. There's quite a few men who maintain quads through the years. Why can this not be so for women? Not yet, it's too early. Now, it's generally the 'child prodigies' among the girls, but when I see young women also going for it, women whose bodies have already matured, why wouldn't they be able to maintain them? And even among the men there are quadless skaters that are still worthwhile to watch. And sometimes they can even score high because a programme is clean and just beautiful and moving.

Guess I'm on the late bloomer side. My absolute favourites are Aljona Savchenko, Zoe Jones and Deanna Stellato. They compete(d) in another discipline but I so much respect these women!

 

[yume]

Kostner started early (she got her first world medal in 2005) and as a jumper. She got better and better, had to quit for a period, and then came back to still get 5th place at the Olympics and medals at Europeans. I'm a fan.

Kostner needs her own category. Because of her long and wildly inconsistent career.

 

[Mathman]

I guess Nathan Chen would qualify as a child prodigy who just kept on going. He was the youngest ever U.S. Novice champion at age ten. He also appeared as guest star in pro and touring shows as a young boy.

Nathan Chen 2010-2011 Long Program

Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2 by Franz Liszt choreo. by Evgenia Chernyshova From the 2011 US National Championships Part of a Ice Skating Routine Documentation Pr...

www.youtube.com

For comparison, here's Scott Hsmilton at 36.

Scott Hamilton - Hungrian Rhapsody 1994

Houston Symphony on Ice 1994 Music: Hungarian Rhapsody No.2 - Liszt

www.youtube.com

 

[SorrySkater]

I tend to prefer the skating of those who are “late bloomers.” For instance, I much preferred late career Ashley Wagner to early career Ashley Wagner. Mariah Bell is another skater who, to me, is so much more pleasing to watch than the young skaters with quads.

 

[SorrySkater]

I guess Nathan Chen would qualify as a child prodigy who just kept on going. He was the youngest ever U.S. Novice champion at age ten. He also appeared as guest star in pro and touring shows as a young boy.

Nathan Chen 2010-2011 Long Program

Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2 by Franz Liszt choreo. by Evgenia Chernyshova From the 2011 US National Championships Part of a Ice Skating Routine Documentation Pr...

www.youtube.com

For comparison, here's Scott Hsmilton at 36.

Scott Hamilton - Hungrian Rhapsody 1994

Houston Symphony on Ice 1994 Music: Hungarian Rhapsody No.2 - Liszt

www.youtube.com

I think Nathan Chen deserves his own category. He is just phenomenal.

 

[anonymoose_au]

As that ad says: Why not have both

Which is what Plushy kinda did. He burst onto the scene way back in 1997-98 and was awesome the whole time he competed basically which was for over 10 years (excluding breaks). He even stopped competing for long stretches and was still able to regain his technical content and challenge the new contenders.

However I'm not sure what I actually prefer? I tend to enjoy skaters for non-results reasons and just hope that I can watch them for a long time whether they reach the top or not.

 

[NAOTMAA]

No matter how long or short a carrer is I'll take whatever great skating I can get regardless of their ages. From 15 year old Yulia's Schindler to 27 year old Maria's Otoñal

My favorite skater is Michelle Kwan and while I love the maturity she displayed later on in her career the majority of my favorite Michelle programs come from her young teen years in the 90s early 2000s.