- Joined
- Oct 25, 2012
What on earth did I wake up to... couldn't watch Dai's interview, so heartbreaking to see him like that.
Japanese Nationals 2013-2014 - Men
- Thread starter NMURA
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- Joined
- Jan 25, 2013
Solid skates again by Hanyu. And Machida has definitely earned his spot.
Feel so bad for Dai. It'll be really unfair to name him to the team with 3 mistakes in the SP and 4 mistakes in the LP. Kozuka or Oda definitely deserve to go over him at this point.
However, I would love the JSF if they named Hanyu and Machida and then decided the 3rd spot with a skate off between Takahashi/Oda/Kozuka at 4CC. It's the perfect way to see if Takahashi has recovered for Sochi and give him a second chance. Same with Oda getting a second chance and Kozuka proving for certain he deserves the spot.
Damn this depth of men's skating in Japan!
Feel so bad for Dai. It'll be really unfair to name him to the team with 3 mistakes in the SP and 4 mistakes in the LP. Kozuka or Oda definitely deserve to go over him at this point.
However, I would love the JSF if they named Hanyu and Machida and then decided the 3rd spot with a skate off between Takahashi/Oda/Kozuka at 4CC. It's the perfect way to see if Takahashi has recovered for Sochi and give him a second chance. Same with Oda getting a second chance and Kozuka proving for certain he deserves the spot.
Damn this depth of men's skating in Japan!
I only want to see Dai at Olympics if he can fight for the podium, as in land on the podium or at least get the unlucky fourth place. Otherwise, I don't see any reason for him to be there. What for? To humiliate himself, being the last of the 3 japanese men and feeling angry on his body for letting him down exactly at the Olympics. And it is really crazy to think which one of the two injured men to send to the Olympics, Takahashi or Kozuka, both having a rough season until now, when you have a perfectly healthy man who had an outstanding performance with 4T-3T and won 3 medals in the grand prix circuit. But he doesn't have the right name. Oda. Let's make fun of him, he is Oda, how to send him? This makes me more angry than Takahashi not making the team. And as much as I like and respect Kozuka, I don't understand why they did such a big injustice by giving him that huge score for a flawed SP. He looked weak and out of shape for the last seasons, he was even left at home last year when Mura outscored him. And now when Oda shows so much consistency they decide to hold out Kozuka instead of him.
That's sort of how I feel too. Oda has scored 170+ in the FS in three out of four his events this season. He has reached 90+ in TES in two of those events.
I'm hoping Oda gets at least a Worlds berth. Oda's performance would be champion worthy in any other country including the U.S. (but not Canada, obviously....though he would have easily received silver there!)
I feel as though Dai somewhat shot himself in the foot today, unfortunately. In the short, he UR'd the Triple Toe at the end of the combination that he's been doing all week in practice fine, maybe due to the nerves and pressure. That's acceptable. However, the fumble on the Combination Spin in the Short cost him about 3-4 points (including GOE). Furthermore, had he replaced his Second Quad with a Triple Lutz given how his inconsistency, he could've salvaged another 6-7 points. Including the 10 points he gave up, he could've wound up ahead of Oda easily. Factor in the fact that he rotated the Triple Toe for another 3-4 points and he just might've gotten the spot over Kozuka. That being said, they held up Kozuka A LOT in the Short (his previous PB being 85-86 with a CLEAN Short). I truly feel that Dai should be sent over Kozuka, simply because he does stand more of a chance internationally, imo.
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2012
- Joined
- May 4, 2013
OK, I'm up to speed now... Hope everybody hasn't left the house (... to mourn / lick their wounds 
)
- As expected, a dramatic shootout.
- As expected, Hanyu is untouchable. Great Skate, even with the 1 fall.
- Machida skated his heart out. Like many have stated here, he isn't my favorite and he doesn't "touch" me like Daisuke or Takahiko do. Even Nobunari, who as mentioned by someone in an earlier post still has a little "junior vibe" going on, gets to my heartstrings much more. No doubt Machida was 2nd best here, and will get chosen to go to the Olympics. What I'm not really comfortable with is that he got higher Interpretation marks than Takahiko and Nobunari, since we all seem to agree on the fact he's not really charismatic.
- Kozuka won the bronze with 2 strong performances. I strongly disagree with those who say he got too high marks in his SP. He had a great SP with 2 technical errors that got the appropriate deductions: -2 for his 4T and -2 for the turn in the combo. Everything else was perfect, and he's known for his great skating skills. I think his SP is a great music and choreo for him, and the subtlety with which he delivers this performance warrants high marks. If Hanyu had done those exact same mistakes, he'd still have gotten nearly 100 points.
- I'm sad for Oda, there's just something so likeable with this guy - the junior smile he has adds to that! But noone should say he's not on the podium because Kozuka was favored. He's not on the podium because he ended up with 2 very weak jumps in the SP instead of 2 minor deductions for a high class SP like Kozuka. Also, don't forget that his 2nd 4T in the LP which turned into a 3T meant that the 2 jumps he repeated were the 3Axel and the 3T, where Kozuka had the 3Axel and the 3Lutz. So even if Kozuka fell on the Lutz, the much higher base value eats up a lot of the fall.
- Takahashi. Like the entire world, I love Daisuke. I'm so sad for him. The decision hasn't been made yet, so we'll have to see what happens... Like any athlete, if he gets chosen to go, I can't imagine he would "decline". Noone should ask that of him. It's his dream to compete at the Olympics. Just as it is Takahiko's. So whoever gets chosen, I sincerely hope they won't get bombarded by people discussing that "it should have been the other one" and telling him "you should give your spot away".
--WHAT I HOPE WILL HAPPEN
They send Kozuka. They all competed for 3 spots with a huge amount of pressure, and he earned his 3rd place today.
--WHAT I THINK WOULD BE FAIR
They organize a shootout between Kozuka and Takahashi at a later date: 4CC or just the 2 of them, factoring in their performances of the entire practice sessions to figure out who's fitter.
--WHAT I FEAR WILL HAPPEN
They send Takahashi, basta.
--MY PSYCHADELIC NIGHTMARE OF WHAT HAPPENS
They announce that they will only send 2 men to the Olympics and give away the last spot, with the message that "WE DO WHATEVER WE WANT! THIS IS NOT A DEMOCRACY!" Of course, this results in the JFSF being overthrown in a bloodbath. The Japanese Government gets overthrown as well, kind of as a casualty. Vive la révolution!
)- As expected, a dramatic shootout.
- As expected, Hanyu is untouchable. Great Skate, even with the 1 fall.
- Machida skated his heart out. Like many have stated here, he isn't my favorite and he doesn't "touch" me like Daisuke or Takahiko do. Even Nobunari, who as mentioned by someone in an earlier post still has a little "junior vibe" going on, gets to my heartstrings much more. No doubt Machida was 2nd best here, and will get chosen to go to the Olympics. What I'm not really comfortable with is that he got higher Interpretation marks than Takahiko and Nobunari, since we all seem to agree on the fact he's not really charismatic.
- Kozuka won the bronze with 2 strong performances. I strongly disagree with those who say he got too high marks in his SP. He had a great SP with 2 technical errors that got the appropriate deductions: -2 for his 4T and -2 for the turn in the combo. Everything else was perfect, and he's known for his great skating skills. I think his SP is a great music and choreo for him, and the subtlety with which he delivers this performance warrants high marks. If Hanyu had done those exact same mistakes, he'd still have gotten nearly 100 points.
- I'm sad for Oda, there's just something so likeable with this guy - the junior smile he has adds to that! But noone should say he's not on the podium because Kozuka was favored. He's not on the podium because he ended up with 2 very weak jumps in the SP instead of 2 minor deductions for a high class SP like Kozuka. Also, don't forget that his 2nd 4T in the LP which turned into a 3T meant that the 2 jumps he repeated were the 3Axel and the 3T, where Kozuka had the 3Axel and the 3Lutz. So even if Kozuka fell on the Lutz, the much higher base value eats up a lot of the fall.
- Takahashi. Like the entire world, I love Daisuke. I'm so sad for him. The decision hasn't been made yet, so we'll have to see what happens... Like any athlete, if he gets chosen to go, I can't imagine he would "decline". Noone should ask that of him. It's his dream to compete at the Olympics. Just as it is Takahiko's. So whoever gets chosen, I sincerely hope they won't get bombarded by people discussing that "it should have been the other one" and telling him "you should give your spot away".
--WHAT I HOPE WILL HAPPEN
They send Kozuka. They all competed for 3 spots with a huge amount of pressure, and he earned his 3rd place today.
--WHAT I THINK WOULD BE FAIR
They organize a shootout between Kozuka and Takahashi at a later date: 4CC or just the 2 of them, factoring in their performances of the entire practice sessions to figure out who's fitter.
--WHAT I FEAR WILL HAPPEN
They send Takahashi, basta.
--MY PSYCHADELIC NIGHTMARE OF WHAT HAPPENS
They announce that they will only send 2 men to the Olympics and give away the last spot, with the message that "WE DO WHATEVER WE WANT! THIS IS NOT A DEMOCRACY!" Of course, this results in the JFSF being overthrown in a bloodbath. The Japanese Government gets overthrown as well, kind of as a casualty. Vive la révolution!
I feel really sorry for Oda being already counted out. He's had the best season in years, he did better than Kozuka at the GP series and he didn't lose to him by a huge margin here. I'd give the 3rd spot to him. Although I like CanadianSkaterGuy's idea the best.
I think that would be the most fair solution.
I think that would be the most fair solution.
- Joined
- May 4, 2013
well, thanks! But you quoted me, not ilek!
I sure did! Sorry-- don't know what happened there!
The Japanese federation set out very clear guidelines for how they were going to select the Oly team, they could have easily included 4CC in the selection criteria, but chose not to. To change the rules now seems the most unfair of all the possible outcomes.
It's a hard choice between Dai and Kozuka. I think if they feel Dai will be healthy, they will choose him, because of better overall results in the past year. I love Kozuka's skating and would love to see him go, but I'm OK either way.
BTW I wish USFSA used a selection process like this for their world and Oly teams
It's a hard choice between Dai and Kozuka. I think if they feel Dai will be healthy, they will choose him, because of better overall results in the past year. I love Kozuka's skating and would love to see him go, but I'm OK either way.
BTW I wish USFSA used a selection process like this for their world and Oly teams
I think Takahashi will be sent over Kozuka. Kozuka really hasn't had a stellar season, failing to make the GPF and his scores internationally has been quite mediocre. At the Japanese Nationals, Kozuka finished 3rd with several errors in both SP and LP. Like it or not, Takahashi draws big crowd and attention/publicity. JSF will likely cite some injuries consideration in selecting him while naming Kozuka as the 1st substitute.
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2010
Another competition (4CC) would be wearing for someone going to Sochi and it might just present new dilemma as well. It's time for the selected to settle down mentally and focus on their preparation for the Olympics.
They still can decide to us 4CC is they wanted to. The criteria only states who should be considered for the spots, it does not say how they can choose from that pool.
That said I don't think that will happen. They will likely name somebody.
ETA: And yes, 4CC isn't ideal from a peaking standpoint...we have seen skaters implode at Worlds after having to fight for a spot at 4CC.
This would be the best solution, but I am afraid JSF will never consider it.
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- Jul 26, 2003
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Having just watched Oda's & Kozuka's SP's & LPs, I've got to say that I would be really ripped if Kozuka were sent. About the only really good thing in either of Kozuka's programs was the stellar footwork at the end of the SP-Oda popped his quad in the SP, and had to double the second half of his combination to avoid zayaking-he kept the energy throughout both programs. In fact, Oda has had a great season with the exception of the JN SP-Kozuka has had a crap season and has he even landed a decent quad all season, let alone only earning a bronze in China and not qualifying for the GPF. I'd be fine with Dai going, if he can recover his health prior to Sochi. Dai is the most talented of the 3, and if healthy, can definitely medal.
I hope Oda doesn't retire - this season is the best skating I've seen from him in forever!
I hope Oda doesn't retire - this season is the best skating I've seen from him in forever!
:agree: :yes:
I think he has already stated that this is his final year. That said, a man can change his mind!
That said, I really hope somehow he gets to go to Worlds...
Highest placed skaters at Nationals and/or 4CC go to Worlds/Olympics = clear criteria
Highest average TES/total score from competition X, Y and Z qualifies skaters to 4CC/Worlds/Olympics = clear criteria
The guidelines Japanese Federation set out = muddled and an excuse to do whatever they want
I totally agree on all counts.
As wallylutz said, I think that Kozuka getting the spot is very unlikely. He hasn't had a good season and his past international results aren't anywhere near as impressive as Takahashi's. Let's remember that Takahashi is a big star in Japan. He's popular and he draws in the crowds. Even though I don't think it's fair, I think the third spot will go to him.
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