Johnny and Tara

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I like Johnny and Tara as well. And I loved Scott Hamilton. Couldn't stand 'Dick and Catty Peggy'-will never forget Dick saying that Tiffany Chin was 'pretty good for an Oriental'. (Cringe). (Tiffany Chin was actually a great jumper back in the day, but Dick and Peggy were not fond of 'jumping beans'). I think Johnny has also done everything he can to sound the alarm on US skaters falling behind in tech content.

I wouldn't say the US men have fallen behind in content. Of course, Jason has a longstanding disadvantage, and Pulkinen needs to up his quad game. But you have skaters like Chen and Zhou with consistent quads, Hiwatashi has a solid 4T, Paniot can land several types of quads, and you have up and coming juniors who can do 4S/4T.

 

[anonymoose_au]

Genuine question because I don't know answer, did Johnny start wearing the Russian jacket before or after the US Fed decided he was a person non-grata. Because if it was after screw them.

In that position I probably wouldn't have worn another country's jacket, but be damned I'd wear one with US Figure Skating Association on it either. Why should they get any benefit if I do well?

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Genuine question because I don't know answer, did Johnny start wearing the Russian jacket before or after the US Fed decided he was a person non-grata. Because if it was after screw them.

In that position I probably wouldn't have worn another country's jacket, but be damned I'd wear one with US Figure Skating Association on it either. Why should they get any benefit if I do well?

He did it at the height of his competitive career, when he was one of the top men's skaters in the US at the time.

 

[karne]

Genuine question because I don't know answer, did Johnny start wearing the Russian jacket before or after the US Fed decided he was a person non-grata. Because if it was after screw them.

In that position I probably wouldn't have worn another country's jacket, but be damned I'd wear one with US Figure Skating Association on it either. Why should they get any benefit if I do well?

The issue with Weir vs USFS is that it's not one-sided. I have no doubt there was some homophobia from USFS. But Weir wasn't exactly little Mr Innocent in it all either - we're talking about the skater who has admitted to faking injury and illness on more than one occasion when he didn't get his way, who defied a USFS suggestion not to skate in a particular show, got sick, underperformed at Nationals, and then was shocked and surprised when he didn't get a medical bye to Worlds. We're talking about a guy who made defying the USFS his literal motto and then always made the shocked Pikachu face when they were upset with him.

 

[moonvine]

It just seems that way. They have the best of the lady skaters by quite a lot and if those are the ones you are covering big events then you are going to laud them.

Or do you find him biased for the Russians in men's and dance too?

He’s biased towards anything Russian and has been since he was skating. Russian ladies, men, pairs, ice dance, choreographers, coaches, probably dogs, who knows. Wearing the Russia jacket was beyond the pale.

If I had ever been good enough at anything - tiddlywinks would have been fine - to be honored with a USA team jacket, I might never take it off.

 

[flanker]

He’s biased towards anything Russian and has been since he was skating. Russian ladies, men, pairs, ice dance, choreographers, coaches, probably dogs, who knows. Wearing the Russia jacket was beyond the pale.

If I had ever been good enough at anything - tiddlywinks would have been fine - to be honored with a USA team jacket, I might never take it off.

Really? Well, in that case it is a welcome change after all those commentators who are biased against anything russian. Nature likes balance, I guess

 

[Seven Sisters]

He’s biased towards anything Russian and has been since he was skating. Russian ladies, men, pairs, ice dance, choreographers, coaches, probably dogs, who knows. Wearing the Russia jacket was beyond the pale.

If I had ever been good enough at anything - tiddlywinks would have been fine - to be honored with a USA team jacket, I might never take it off.

Motion to award Moonvine a USA team jacket for her most excellent devotion to the skaters of Team USA!
Most especially Ms Gracie Gold, but also, Hawayek & Baker, Alexa Knierim, and many others

Do I have a second?

 

[museksk8r]

I always enjoyed Susie Wynne’s commentary during the mid to late 90s and early years of Code of Points. She was never a chatterbox and always knew the right moments during programs to comment. She would explain technical errors that would cause an element to go awry, such as a rushed takeoff or a pitched forward landing. She never made the broadcast about herself and she always had a pleasant tone and attitude, which set a respectable mood. Her commentary partner was Peter Carruthers and the two of them never promoted themselves, argued on air or engaged in a contest to prove one is right over the other. How times have changed!

 

[Olympic]

I always laugh when Johnny is critical of the US skaters falling behind in tech content, or men not landing quads. Ummmm.....

Yeah. Actually I find it very interesting:

If you think about JW's competitive career, it took off after SLC where Yagudin and Plushenko included quads,Tim Goebel was the 'Quad King', Michael Weiss centered his programs around quads, Stojko was hobbled but still attempting quads, and even Todd Eldredge in his comeback tried hard to include them.

With the implementation of the new IJS between SLC and Torino, JW took US men's skating down a different path: He eschewed the quad and went after points on everything else, and succeeded in winning a lot. IMO, I think he influenced US men to follow that path with mixed results. I think there was a time after Vancouver where the US men could not compete due to the lower tech content. I personally contribute that to de-emphasizing the quad when its value went back up after Lysacek's quadless win in Vancouver. Lysacek was a winner due to really focused training and error-free programs, but the skating world wasn't going to stay that way. US skater like Miner, Dornbush, and Rippon with talent hadn't emphasized quads (Adam had trouble landing a 3A for a while). On the other side, Abbott was sticking around but was essentially a hopeless headcase and Mroz ONLY emphasized the quads.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Yeah. Actually I find it very interesting:

If you think about JW's competitive career, it took off after SLC where Yagudin and Plushenko included quads,Tim Goebel was the 'Quad King', Michael Weiss centered his programs around quads, Stojko was hobbled but still attempting quads, and even Todd Eldredge in his comeback tried hard to include them.

With the implementation of the new IJS between SLC and Torino, JW took US men's skating down a different path: He eschewed the quad and went after points on everything else, and succeeded in winning a lot. IMO, I think he influenced US men to follow that path with mixed results. I think there was a time after Vancouver where the US men could not compete due to the lower tech content. I personally contribute that to de-emphasizing the quad when its value went back up after Lysacek's quadless win in Vancouver. Lysacek was a winner due to really focused training and error-free programs, but the skating world wasn't going to stay that way. US skater like Miner, Dornbush, and Rippon with talent hadn't emphasized quads (Adam had trouble landing a 3A for a while). On the other side, Abbott was sticking around but was essentially a hopeless headcase and Mroz ONLY emphasized the quads.

Sorry but Abbott had the accident at Sochi SP, but he was ANYTHING but a hopeless headcase.

 

[Spiralgraph]

Maybe I wouldn't say Abbott was a hopeless headcase but he mostly underperformed at international events, i.e worlds. With all that talent, and his expressiveness he should have had one at least one individual world medal. He did not have nerves of steel.

 

[Scott512]

He’s biased towards anything Russian and has been since he was skating. Russian ladies, men, pairs, ice dance, choreographers, coaches, probably dogs, who knows. Wearing the Russia jacket was beyond the pale.

If I had ever been good enough at anything - tiddlywinks would have been fine - to be honored with a USA team jacket, I might never take it off.

If Johnny was biased like you said don't you think NBC television would have sat it down and discussed the issue with Johnny years ago?

 

[Olympic]

Sorry but Abbott had the accident at Sochi SP, but he was ANYTHING but a hopeless headcase.

Matter of semantics - He wasn't hopeless, but he was a headcase

 

[el henry]

Really? Well, in that case it is a welcome change after all those commentators who are biased against anything russian. Nature likes balance, I guess

Well, you will need to point out the *official* commentators on broadcast networks who are biased against "anything" Russian, because in 50 years of listening to skating, I have yet to hear them.

Random Twitter accounts, podcasts and YouTube Channels don't count. I can find just as many biased toward Russians, Chinese, Americans, and the man in the moon as against.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Matter of semantics - He wasn't hopeless, but he was a headcase

If being a headcase means being a 4 time US Champ, the first US man to win the GPF title and many other accomplishments then I guess that's quite the compliment.

 

[Mathman]

If Johnny was biased like you said don't you think NBC television would have sat it down and discussed the issue with Johnny years ago?

Throughout his career Johnny has been an unabashed enthusiast for anything having to to with Russia, Russian history, Russian culture, arts, architecture, Russian skating style. He taught himself to speak Russian (I don't know how good he is at it -- he also taught himself some Japanese in admiration for Japanese skaters and culture). He is the only U.S. broadcaster who makes an effort to pronounce the names of Russian skaters as accurately as possible for a non-native speaker.

As far as i can tell, NBC television has never felt the need to discuss this with Johnny -- it's just part pf his natural if outspoken charm. He pretty much says what he thinks. As a figure skating analyst, I have never noticed any particular national bias. He does continually say, about leading U.S. skaters like Brady Tennell, Karen Chen, Mariah Bell, etc., that they have talent, but will have tp up their game if they have any hope of competing with the Russian ladies these days. This, however, is not a biased observation, just obvious fact.

 

[Skater91]

Throughout his career Johnny has been an unabashed enthusiast for anything having to to with Russia, Russian history, Russian culture, arts, architecture, Russian skating style. He taught himself to speak Russian (I don't know how good he is at it -- he also taught himself some Japanese in admiration for Japanese skaters and culture). He is the only U.S. broadcaster who makes an effort to pronounce the names of Russian skaters as accurately as possible for a non-native speaker.

As far as i can tell, NBC television has never felt the need to discuss this with Johnny -- it's just part pf his natural if outspoken charm. He pretty much says what he thinks. As a figure skating analyst, I have never noticed any particular national bias. He does continually say, about leading U.S. skaters like Brady Tennell, Karen Chen, Mariah Bell, etc., that they have talent, but will have tp up their game if they have any hope of competing with the Russian ladies these days. This, however, is not a biased observation, just obvious fact.

His flaunt in Russian
He said on one if insta stories he had chats with the some of the Russian pro's on dwts in Russian
He also speaks a bit of French which he says isn't the best

 

[Olympic]

If being a headcase means being a 4 time US Champ, the first US man to win the GPF title and many other accomplishments then I guess that's quite the compliment.

Well, it's a scale: Jeremy was otherworldly talented and set up several times to be a world medal threat from 2009 to 2014, and he always took himself out of the running. Always. It was never a matter of him laying it down at Worlds, and someone being just better. For me, succumbing to nerves on the big state literally every time is a head case. Congrats to him for winning the GPF.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Well, it's a scale: Jeremy was otherworldly talented and set up several times to be a world medal threat from 2009 to 2014, and he always took himself out of the running. Always. It was never a matter of him laying it down at Worlds, and someone being just better. For me, succumbing to nerves on the big state literally every time is a head case. Congrats to him for winning the GPF.

You obviously didn't watch worlds 2014 mens lp.

 

[Mathman]

Well, it's a scale: Jeremy was otherworldly talented and set up several times to be a world medal threat from 2009 to 2014, and he always took himself out of the running.

It's the word "headcase" that is not useful. Sometimes people get nervous and don't perform their best. And sometimes they are just unlucky about when their strongest performances occur.

The opposite, however, is worth it's weight in gold (medals). Once in a while a clutch player comes along who miraculously can channel all that nervous energy and adrenilin in a positive direction, performing feats seemingly beyond their normal capabilities.