All I can say is some of the people in here would never survive in the fandoms of motorsports, cricket, football...
Yes, Plushenko was second to Kovtun at Nationals. Clearly to CSG this is proof positive as to Kovtun's greatness, because certainly there's little else in his first two senior seasons to work with - this despite heavy backing from Tarasova and the most powerful federation in the sport. Never mind that Kovtun beat a 31 year old who had been through multiple surgeries and was a couple of months away from yet another spinal surgery. Nope, it's exactly the same as beating Plushenko in his prime!
"The first skater to land two SP quads in one season" is such a random achievement that I'm not sure why it's even worth discussing. If skaters were allowed two SP quads in Plushenko's heyday, Goebel would have been the first anyway.
Plushenko isn't randomly bashing young skaters, he's saying that he is not impressed with Kovtun. He's certainly been impressed with other skaters, most notably Hanyu. But then, Yuzuru has been impressive so far in his career.
Plushenko is so blunt he even stupidly shot himself in the foot by self-admitting "I have no transitions" instead of "I'm looking to build upon the content I currently have" or something smarter like that.
But obviously, since Reynolds never beat Plushenko, Plushenko isn't jealous of him Even though Kevin has landed multiple quads in his programs several times (and was the first to do so in an SP).Kevin Reynolds is the first and currently the only skater to have landed five quadruple jumps in one competition—at the 2013 Four Continents, he landed two quads in the short program and three in the free skate. I guess we should compare Kovtun to Kevin, not to Plushy you know.
Winning the JGPF is such an impressive senior level achievement.
Really? This was Kovtun's debut season? I don't think so. He made his senior debut in 2012, and he skated in two ISU Championships in 2013. And if you want to be fair, you should compare them age-wise. Hanyu moved up to senior at 15 and did so against a crowded field of Japanese men, including the reigning world champion and that season's Worlds silver medalist. In addition, scores were lower for much of that season. Han Yan might be a more relevant comparison, except Yan is younger and doesn't have a powerful federation looking out for him. Nonetheless, he does have an ISU Championship medal, a GP win, and won Junior Worlds, all before turning 18.One more thing: if you want to compare him to Hanyu, to be fair you have to take Kovtun's 2013-2014 season as his "first season", as 2010-2011 was Hanyu's "first season".
Uh yeah... let's not compare skaters please...
Except for the fact 2010-2011 was not Hanyu's first full senior debut. He still competed in junior field in the same season. And you say Hanyu was not thrown into the senior field? He was just a kid competed in senior field, like Kovtun. Hanyu was just 16 when he was placed 2nd in 4CC that season. 2011-2012 is his first official FULL season as a senior in which he won bronze at worlds with a long program that many people think he deserved to win the free. On the other hand, Kovtun was 18 already in his first full senior season, and no one think his free was that impressive, if you wanna make a comparison.One more thing: if you want to compare him to Hanyu, to be fair you have to take Kovtun's 2013-2014 season as his "first season", as 2010-2011 was Hanyu's "first season", not consider Kovtun as a Junior being thrown into Worlds as his senior debut (or even more laughable WTT as his senior debut). You take the first grand prix season. That is the first full season as a senior.
Would he just STFU about Kovtun already. Isn't he embarrassed? I guess not since he's so hubristic and arrogant. I wonder what Kovtun did to him in a past life. I think it's just nasty that Plush and his wife think it's OK to talk about Kovtun negatively when they're the ones who screwed Kovtun.
Kovtun @ WC 2014: SP - three L4 spins; FS - three L4 spins -- 6/6 spins level 4
Total BV for spins: 9.4 (SP) + 9.4 (FS) = 18.6 points
Total points for spins: 11.32 (SP) + 11.47 (FS) = 22.79 points
Plushenko @ Sochi 2014, team event: SP - one L4 spin, one L3 spin, one L2 spin; FS - one L4 spin, two L3 spins -- 2/6 spins level 4
Total BV for spins: 8.3 (SP) + 8.8 (FS) = 17.1 points
Total points for spins: 10.51 (SP) + 10.59 (FS) = 21.10 points
You were saying?
Really? This was Kovtun's debut season? I don't think so. And if you want to be fair, you should compare them age-wise. Hanyu moved up to senior at at 15 and did so against a crowded field of Japanese men. In addition, scores were lower for much of that season. Han Yan might be a more relevant comparison, except Yan is younger and doesn't have a powerful federation looking out for him. Nonetheless, he does have an ISU Championship medal, a GP win, and won Junior Worlds, all before turning 18.
CSG, seriously, you've convinced exactly nobody. Is there any point to this?
The issue is the use of FUSPs instead of more complicated spins -not levels
kovtun being the Russian national champion does not mean he can't be criticized by a retired veteran! I don't even think being called good average is a criticism. He gets questioned on all skaters. That's why people have posts of him commenting on so many others. He is asked questions by reporters and gives answers that aren't "wish him luck" "everyone makes mistakes" "everyone has strong points" non specific non constructive nonsense. He does have problems and he is good average compared to Chan hanyu and ten and Fernandez. He doesn't work as hard on spins as plushenko always did. Giving up point potential with FUSPs.
Except for the fact 2010-2011 was not Hanyu's first full senior debut. He still competed in junior field in the same season. And you say Hanyu was not thrown into the senior field? He was just a kid competed in senior field, like Kovtun. Hanyu was just 16 when he was placed 2nd in 4CC that season. 2011-2012 is his first official FULL season as a senior in which he won bronze at worlds with a long program that many people think he deserved to win the free. On the other hand, Kovtun was 18 already in his first full senior season, and no one think his free was that impressive, if you wanna make a comparison.