Plushy's Choreography

[Vash01]

Mozart, Bach and Beethoven are timeless masterpieces. The Godfather's "been done" in full character before, I believe by Candelero. I would rather see Plushenko skate to a piece not used by another skater. Really see him stretch himself as far music and choreography go - like Kurt Browning does.

How does skating to the same music as someone else keep him from stretching?His interpretation is completely different from Candeloro's. So, if G&G to B&S skated to a music that was used by the Protopopovs in the 1960's, in your opinion these two pairs did not really stretch themselves?

It makes no difference who skated to a particular music and how.

Vash

 

[Matt]

Choreography=conscious effort

IMO, if Plushy or any other skater with superior jumping ability and strong footwork wants to do a programme that is going to highlight their abilities while still showing choreography that relates to and makes sense with the music, they have to make an effort to actually come up with effective choreography, theme, etc. and then fit in the jumps and footwork and other highlights

Granted, I have not yet seen Plushy's new programme, but the comment made earlier about the music being chosen to fit the jumps doesn't surprise me. Plushy seems to bank on the fact that he can do 4toe/3toe/2whatever at the beginning, follow it up with another quad combo, and then the rest doesn't really matter or isn't really important b/c he's already put away all the other skaters. Maybe b/c it not as easy to do that under CoP anymore, it'll force Plushy to look at and work the other aspects of his skating to make him a complete skater: spins (I actually liked Plushy's Biellmann; I'll kinda miss it), MITF, etc.

 

[dlkksk8fan]

I just watched his program today again and counted 5 times that he stops on the ice before moving again. I want to see a program that has flow and continues to move. Also there is nothing but crossovers into his jumps. His footwork is wonderful, now if only he would put some footwork leading into his jumps in his program that would be great.

 

[soogar]

Can I say that I'm totally not feeling the Godfather program? (and I LOVE Plush).

I don't know, Plush is so much better than that ( I loved Nijinski)... But man did he sell that program. I don't really care about the standing and posing b/c Plush's hands and eyes are very espressive but in this program I noticed the standing a lot more than I did in his previous programs. I think it made the program very disjointed. Another thing I don't like having seen the GP final is that Plush is resorting to the Alexei Yagudin/ Brian Joubert cheering of the jumps (lots of fist pumping). I picked on BJ last year for doing that and I'm not sparing Plushy. Please save the cheerleading until after the performance as it really detracts from the program.

I think that King Plush stands and poses so his subjects can see him better.

 

[Vash01]

Granted, I have not yet seen Plushy's new programme, but the comment made earlier about the music being chosen to fit the jumps doesn't surprise me. Plushy seems to bank on the fact that he can do 4toe/3toe/2whatever at the beginning, follow it up with another quad combo, and then the rest doesn't really matter or isn't really important b/c he's already put away all the other skaters. Maybe b/c it not as easy to do that under CoP anymore, it'll force Plushy to look at and work the other aspects of his skating to make him a complete skater: spins (I actually liked Plushy's Biellmann; I'll kinda miss it), MITF, etc.

Most skaters do the jumps in a certain order in the program. Michelle always does the 3loop, then the 3lutz-2toe combo, and so on. Yagudin always did his jumping passes in a certain order. I don't see anything wrong with it. Just because Plushenko is consistently delivering and winning there is all the criticism of his skating. He is not perfect by any means, and he will certainly develop, but what he is doing is not that different from other successful skaters.

 

[Vash01]

I just watched his program today again and counted 5 times that he stops on the ice before moving again. I want to see a program that has flow and continues to move. Also there is nothing but crossovers into his jumps. His footwork is wonderful, now if only he would put some footwork leading into his jumps in his program that would be great.

He does stop more than I like to see in a skating program. Very few skaters, however, are able to skate continuously. B&S were an exception. Kulik
s Rhapsody in blue was an exception. EP does difficult jump combinations. If he needs breathing time, so be it. I disagree that there is nothing but crossovers into his jumps. Watch the programs again.

I liked Nijinski and St.Petersburg 300 very much. I am not sure I like The Godfather equally, but it has some interesting things. His spins have gotten better,and I love the power he delivers it with.

Vash

 

[dlkksk8fan]

Very few skaters, however, are able to skate continuously.

I'm going to have to pay attention to the other skaters to see if they stop in their programs. If they do it is not as noticeable as in Plushy's skating routine because he stops numerous times. Once or twice is ok but more- not good.

 

[PrincessLeppard]

While there are certainly things in the program that can be fixed, he totally sells the program. There are some transitions, but there could be more. In defense of the stops, he does skate faster than every other skater out there, and after the stops, he picks up speed SO fast, it's incredible. That also shows good skating skills. He doesn't need 17 crossovers to build up speed; he can explode from a dead stop. I would, however, like to see fewer of them.

I didn't notice the fist pumps, or the gun-shooting? I will have to watch again. Except that my VCR didn't record. AAARRRRGGGG.

Laura

 

[libra 1]

Can I say that I'm totally not feeling the Godfather program? (and I LOVE Plush).

I
I think that King Plush stands and poses so his subjects can see him better.

Absolutely. One of his greatest Russian fans commented on the beginning of Plushy's LP at the GPF like that: "Zhenia mentally shook his crown in place so it wouldn't be askew and started his programme... - And the Chinese called him "Ice Prince".. and not only Chinese..

Libra - from Rusia, with love

 

[Vash01]

From my point of view, Plush has great flow over the ice and super jumping ability. I don't see much else about his skating. (I don't want to read anything about the contortionist bielman spin.) To have music arranged to show off his jumps and flow is exactly what he should do. He's looking better now despite the knee. Maybe some day he will learn how to grab the audience with his spins.

Joe

Remember that Plushy belongs to the 6.0 generation. The system rewarded jumps and speed, and to some extent audience connection, and that's what he developed in. Those are also his natural strengths. Unless someone starts challenging him by doing all those things and something more (as Weir will, if he gets good at the quads), Plush is not likely work on other things. He has been injured for a couple of seasons, which has reduced his training time. It makes sense for him to play it safe and use his strengths, instead of trying to develop other things, unless he needs those to win. If he gets healthy again (I do hope so, for the sake of FS!) he may want to work on other things. Right now he is going to do what is needed to get the 2005 world title and the 2006 OGM. That makes perfect sense to me.

Vash

 

[Vash01]

I'm going to have to pay attention to the other skaters to see if they stop in their programs. If they do it is not as noticeable as in Plushy's skating routine because he stops numerous times. Once or twice is ok but more- not good.

Plushenko has a theatrical approach to his skating, and he uses the stops to add more drama. Of course I would like to see fewer stops and more skating. May be some day he will do it. I liked Kulik's Rhapsody in blue LP for fewer stops. Plushenko's stops are just a bit longer than I would like to see because they keep him on two feet too long. Other skaters may have fewer stops but they may have more falls/flaws which takes away from the programs. Plushenko does accelerate quicker than most skaters, which adds to the drama, and of course it shows a certain skating skill.

 

[Matt]

I actually have to take back a lot of what I said after actually seeing Plushy's programme. I actually really like it. Granted, he's coming into the season at Cup of Russia, so he hasn't had as much time to test the programme in competition to see what works and what doesn't. But boy, does it have energy! A lot of his wild hand gesticulations actually do have something to do with the music and the theme of "The Godfather". He does stop quite a bit, but no more than in any of his other programmes

I do agree he could incorporate a little more of that wonderful footwork into his jump entrances. And, I'm sorry, something is missing from his spins. They're faster, yes, but they need an extra position of interest. I still miss the Plushy Biellmann...lol

 

[libra 1]

I actually have to take back a lot of what I said after actually seeing Plushy's programme. I actually really like it. Granted, he's coming into the season at Cup of Russia, so he hasn't had as much time to test the programme in competition to see what works and what doesn't. But boy, does it have energy! A lot of his wild hand gesticulations actually do have something to do with the music and the theme of "The Godfather". He does stop quite a bit, but no more than in any of his other programmes

I do agree he could incorporate a little more of that wonderful footwork into his jump entrances. And, I'm sorry, something is missing from his spins. They're faster, yes, but they need an extra position of interest. I still miss the Plushy Biellmann...lol

Matt, re: his poses. I think they are carefully calculated so as to add more drama to the "Godfather" - Plushy himself said it is both very sporting and very theatrical programme . He also took much pains working together with Marton to dramatize the music. Some of the musical highlights were invented by Plushy himself. - f,e, in one place there is a violin section with a small bell-like sound- Plushy said he needed it to bring out the " nerve" of the programme. BTW I can't remember another case of the music being personilized arranged on a skater's request..
Besides, many movements were added by Plushy himself - it was a joint creative activity so may be that's why he likes the programme immensely.
re: his spins. May be you don't know that his knee problem before the COR was such that there were rumours he won't participate. This explains his present state of spins and almost total absence of Biellman - though he did do it once at GPF...I only hope it i gets better with time..
Libra - surprized by the thread itself b/c last season no one admitted Plushy had any choreography at all...

 

[shdotz]

Plushenko's skating - reply

For me, he did a great - better than breat - skate.

Sooooooooooooooooooooooo good to see gooooooooooood skating for a change!!!

It's like most skaters do their thing and hope they make it through their routine.

Plushenko knows his stuff and shows it off. He's got great talent! He's a great act!

I hope he stays healthy and takes the gold at the next olympics. For Sure!!

shdotz

 

[hockeyfan228]

I like his Moonlight Sonata SP more than The Godfather. I think it has more flow and shows a more lyrical side of him.

 

[shdotz]

Plushenko

I don't think I've ever seen him do "Moonlight Sonata"; I know the piece quite well and played it on piano when I was 12.

Interesting. I would like to see that skate. Do you think he'll skate it again?

Soon?

shdotz

 

[PrincessLeppard]

I don't think I've ever seen him do "Moonlight Sonata"; I know the piece quite well and played it on piano when I was 12.

Interesting. I would like to see that skate. Do you think he'll skate it again?

Soon?

shdotz

It's his short program. I haven't seen it, either, but I can't wait!

 

[hockeyfan228]

It's his short program. I haven't seen it, either, but I can't wait!

It's really lovely. It was broadcast on CBC and Chinese television, so I suspect it's on Rinkside. Also, I'm certain that the web version (either Real Media or Windows Media Player) is floating around. You may be able to download it still at:

http://s17.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=04X0419J126BE04DN0SSPH13QA

(There is only a limited number of downloads per upload, and if the limit has been reached, it will be messaged.)

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

He also did a nice lyrical SP at the last Bofrost. In fact, that was the first time I appreciated him. But his trademark is stop and pose and sell it to the audience and well, that's his style. For me, there is a difference between Sport and Show. I honestly can not see him as a special skater without the quads.

Joe

 

[MasterB]

Good Skate

The great thing about this guy is that he skates without fear and sort of has a reckless abandonment which pulls the audience in like no one else. He doesn't necessarily strike positions like John Curry did. However if you take a look at his camel spin, the line he creates in that move is first rate.