Tanith Belbin = America's Sweetheart

[janetfan]

Enough so that 4 years ago, Tanith was voted the hottest female athlete in an ESPN poll.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/features/hottestWomen

They credit her with a million dollar smile. Who knew wisdom teeth were that expensive

ITA that the media better crank up some Meryl Davis/Charlie White footage. It was incredibly lame that we have the first ever GPF ice dance champions for the US and all NBC can show is a 30 second clip of them.

Even lamer that they showed about 10 seconds of Shen & Zhao's performance. Meanwhile they showed all 6 of the ladies and 5 of the men.

Good points Doris and Tanith is better known than all of the USA Lady singles skaters. Part of it is that she has been around for a while and is entering her second Olympics. She and Ben have won medals and as you mentioned there is the smile...,

Some newer fans might be surprised but Olympic coverage and American fans don't always live and die with the Ladies.

In 1988 it was the Men and they won the ratings by a wide margin.
Brian Boitano was very popular and even Orser was known and respected by USA fans.

In 1980 it was the Pairs and the defending USA and World champions were Randy and Tai. They were much more popular than any skater or team we have entering this season's Olympics and they were more popular than our singles skaters.

In 1984 Scott was the story in skating for American fans. Roz lost a close decision to Kati but it was not the story.
Scott was more popular than any of the younger fans can imagine and the rating for the men's LP was much higher than the Ladies that year. And Roz was a co-favorite, not an underdog - but Scott was just much more popular.

I think the 94 Harding/Kerrigan incident followed by a decade of Michelle's reign has not left US Skating in the best shape. The fact that Sasha was there when Michelle left kept interest in the Ladies high in Torino.

.But there are skaters with charisma and I don't think it matters as much on it being a "princess" as some of you think. It is all many of you have known - but believe me, if....and I say if a great American Pairs team were to emerge you would be surprised how popular they might be.

Scott and Brian B were very popular and not sure why Johnny and Evan are not........(maybe I am not surprised and I am being nice )

I think the battle at Natls for the Dance title will get some good ratings and if both teams are in medal contention in Vancouver it would really help make Ice Dancing more popular in the USA.

 

[Wicked]

Bob - this ad that I saw didn't have Ben shown anywhere on it... so in a sense, no it's not a joke.

I saw an ad today that showed a few Olympic contenders. It had a shot of Tanith crying. No Ben in sight and the only way you could tell what sport she did was by the costume. It didn't show her actually skating.

 

[Tonichelle]

Scott and Brian were not and are not the norm even in their day. since AT LEAST Peggy Fleming in the US we like our ladies. It's an unargued fact within media circles. The Battle of the Brians was as big as Katarina Witt, certainly, but it's a flash in the pan in the long run - unfortunately

top it off with teh long reign of Kwan and there you have it... we're still all about the ladies... *snore*

Ice Dance has never been taken seriously by the US media/average joe viewers... there are exceptions to every rule, but face it, until 2006 we weren't even on the radar for glory (yes I know we had some great teams in the 80s there I go showing off my ignorant youth again by making generalizations no matter if they're correct or not...) American audiences loved Torvill and Dean... and we rallied behind Shae Lynn and Victor... but it's never been one to bring down the house every four years

Tanith and Ben - and their hope for gold, and eventual silver - changed that somewhat... but old habits die hard and after teh olympic fanfare died down the sponsorship went down and it was back to ladies and begrudgingly men by NBC... you can only market that which you can sell... Scott Hamilton and Brian Boitano made men's skating markettable in the US... still behind ladies, but that's not their fault... old habits/feelings die hard.

 

[janetfan]

Scott and Brian were not and are not the norm even in their day. since AT LEAST Peggy Fleming in the US we like our ladies. It's an unargued fact within media circles. The Battle of the Brians was as big as Katarina Witt, certainly, but it's a flash in the pan in the long run - unfortunately

top it off with teh long reign of Kwan and there you have it... we're still all about the ladies... *snore*

Ice Dance has never been taken seriously by the US media/average joe viewers... there are exceptions to every rule, but face it, until 2006 we weren't even on the radar for glory (yes I know we had some great teams in the 80s there I go showing off my ignorant youth again by making generalizations no matter if they're correct or not...) American audiences loved Torvill and Dean... and we rallied behind Shae Lynn and Victor... but it's never been one to bring down the house every four years

Tanith and Ben - and their hope for gold, and eventual silver - changed that somewhat... but old habits die hard and after teh olympic fanfare died down the sponsorship went down and it was back to ladies and begrudgingly men by NBC... you can only market that which you can sell... Scott Hamilton and Brian Boitano made men's skating markettable in the US... still behind ladies, but that's not their fault... old habits/feelings die hard.

Look it up toni - the TV ratings for Brian and Scott crushed the Ladies finals in '84 and '88.

Peggy and Dorothy were Ladies but also very telegenic and charismatic. Evan and Johhny could win the OGM and they would never be close to Scott or Brian B.

Charisma does matter. Randy and Tai had amazing charisma, much more than Tanith and Ben

Michelle had it and so did Sasha. It makes a difference, especially the way the way certain skaters jump off the tube at viewers. Joubert, Yagudin and Plushy have it. Lamabiel too but not so much Tomas.

It is not about winning per se. Janet had it and so did Toller Cranston. They were not Olympic champions but the public loved them and not just skating fans..

 

[Tonichelle]

actually I've studied this quite a bit in media classes, it's what I was majoring in until recently.

ratings, yes, are great, but sponsorship is what dictates what's put on the program. Ice Dance and Pairs don't get the big bucks, mens and ladies do and always have. Ladies skating is easier to market than Men's even with Brian and Scott's victories over 20 years ago. Before Scott the thought with ice shows was that Male Skaters don't sell tickets, that's why Ice Capades wouldn't renew Scott's contract. That's why SOI was born.

That thought process from a marketting standpoint hasn't changed much. Look at Blades of Glory - it's a satire, certainly, but that's how the media looks at male skating. At least we have a few guys that could possibly make the podium. If the media would have toned down the Lysacek-Weir catfight four years ago, I think they'd have been the ones calling the shots as far as getting NBC's attention, but it was a big joke. These two little boys were kicking sand at each other.

 

[Olympia]

I think one thing that might help favor coverage of Tanith/Ben and Meryl/Charlie is--don't laugh--the popularity of Dancing with the Stars. A lot more people have been turned on to ballroom dancing in the past few years, and which skating discipline is closest to ballroom dancing? Aha! Ice dancing. So the fact that there's a kind of "Dancing with the Stars on Ice" in the Olympics could be exploited successfully by a really savvy promotion campaign.

Now all we have to do is hope there is a really savvy promotion campaign being mounted by the USFSA, the ISU, the IOC, or NBC. (And of course Dancing with the Stars is on ABC. Rats!)

Frankly, I think someone ought to do a photo spread of the guys of the Olympic Team in some magazine or other. Evan Lysacek...Charlie White...my ideas of America's Sweethearts right there!

And, to the poster who mentioned the paltry ten seconds NBC showed of Shen and Zhao on the Grand Prix Final broadcast...I hear you! I was gnashing my teeth.

 

[janetfan]

I think one thing that might help favor coverage of Tanith/Ben and Meryl/Charlie is--don't laugh--the popularity of Dancing with the Stars. A lot more people have been turned on to ballroom dancing in the past few years, and which skating discipline is closest to ballroom dancing? Aha! Ice dancing. So the fact that there's a kind of "Dancing with the Stars on Ice" in the Olympics could be exploited successfully by a really savvy promotion campaign.

Now all we have to do is hope there is a really savvy promotion campaign being mounted by the USFSA, the ISU, the IOC, or NBC. (And of course Dancing with the Stars is on ABC. Rats!)

Frankly, I think someone ought to do a photo spread of the guys of the Olympic Team in some magazine or other. Evan Lysacek...Charlie White...my ideas of America's Sweethearts right there!

And, to the poster who mentioned the paltry ten seconds NBC showed of Shen and Zhao on the Grand Prix Final broadcast...I hear you! I was gnashing my teeth.

I thought about the "Dancing With The Stars" angle and think NBC should get Kristi to do a promo piece about her experience with Ballroom and then relate it to Ice Dancing.
Don't forget "So You Think You Can Dance" too. Both shows have had good ratings.

 

[Tonichelle]

yes, they do, but NBC's dancing shows have flopped... I think the biggest problem we have is NBC is calling the shots, and they have no idea what will work best...

 

[i love to skate]

That thought process from a marketting standpoint hasn't changed much. Look at Blades of Glory - it's a satire, certainly, but that's how the media looks at male skating.

I wonder why the States has this image of the men though? Our Canadian male skaters are some of the most popular athletes here in Canada - Kurt won the Lou Marsh award and was also given the Order of Canada. Elvis' performances are widely regarded as some of the greatest clutch performances of all time -not to mention the fact that many believe he was robbed in 1994 (but let's not get into that). Brian Orser is a household name, everyone knew when Jeff won Worlds, and Patrick Chan is widely recognized as well. Lloyd Eisler, Paul Martini, David Pelletier, Victor Kraatz were know for being great partners.

I also find it curious that the female partners are not widely publicized.The female ice dancers - and especially pair skaters - are a marketers dream as they are dimunitive, fearless, and tough as nails. Ex. Jamie Sale, Tuffy, Shae, Marie-France, etc. We have a commercial running right now on Jessica Dube's courage.

Our female skaters have not had the success that the US has so maybe that's why the female partners receive more attention. However, even now with Joannie Rochette in the medal hunt there is publicity being spread across all four disciplines.

Interesting difference between the two countries

 

[Tonichelle]

it is interesting considering the US's success in the men's field is about as deep as the ladies... for whatever reason it's just not something the public/sponsors buy into. the only reason my prof could come up with is - it's not a blood sport... our country apparently wants men in bloodlust sports... I argue that golf is not a blood lust sport... but it's considered a "gentleman's sport" so it's different...

skating started out that way, then they went from tuxes to frog suits... so I don't know, maybe that's the reason never have been a fan of the one pieces the men wore in the 70s & 80s

 

[i love to skate]

it is interesting considering the US's success in the men's field is about as deep as the ladies... for whatever reason it's just not something the public/sponsors buy into. the only reason my prof could come up with is - it's not a blood sport... our country apparently wants men in bloodlust sports... I argue that golf is not a blood lust sport... but it's considered a "gentleman's sport" so it's different...

On the other hand though, Canadians LOVE hockey, toughness, grit and everything that goes along with those characteristics. However, there is a lot of respect directed towards the male figure skaters (even more now due to Battle of the Blades). Maybe it's just because we love any sport that takes place on ice

 

[Tonichelle]

that could well be it

interestingly enough skating is not a popular sport in Alaska... (then again hockey is just now starting to be really big)... so I have no answers for ya lol

 

[nubka]

They may sense that Sasha Cohen might not be back after all. But the American sweetheart is having teeth problem.

Well, as long as there's no fungus on them...:agree:

 

[Tonichelle]

she had her wisdom teeth out, what, two weeks ago? you don't see the wisdom teeth anyway or where they were pulled when one smiles.. shouldn't effect her marketability at all

 

[jennylovskt]

she had her wisdom teeth out, what, two weeks ago? you don't see the wisdom teeth anyway or where they were pulled when one smiles.. shouldn't effect her marketability at all

I mean there is a chance that they might not be on the Olympics podium. I agree that they should promote Davis as well.

 

[Mathman]

I saw an ad today that showed a few Olympic contenders. It had a shot of Tanith crying. No Ben in sight and the only way you could tell what sport she did was by the costume. It didn't show her actually skating.

Maybe they expected us to guess the sport by the fact that she was crying. Bobsledders and biathletes don't cry.

 

[Tonichelle]

skiiers and snowboarders do, though

 

[Olympia]

I wonder why the States has this image of the men though? Our Canadian male skaters are some of the most popular athletes here in Canada - Kurt won the Lou Marsh award and was also given the Order of Canada. Elvis' performances are widely regarded as some of the greatest clutch performances of all time -not to mention the fact that many believe he was robbed in 1994 (but let's not get into that). Brian Orser is a household name, everyone knew when Jeff won Worlds, and Patrick Chan is widely recognized as well. Lloyd Eisler, Paul Martini, David Pelletier, Victor Kraatz were know for being great partners.
Interesting difference between the two countries

I have noticed that difference between the U.S. and Canada for years. I'm jealous! In the U.S., there seems to be the sense that male skaters are somehow not real athletes. Hah! I laugh when I think of all those pudgy ball players and try to imagine them even staying alive for an entire five-minute long program, let alone managing the jumps and spins. Canada has a much better understanding of what it takes to be a male figure skater. This may be why I often find myself rooting for Canadian skaters in an adoptive sort of way. These days being a figure skating fan in the U.S. is kind of a lonely pursuit!

 

[jcoates]

Ok...I've been working all weekend, so please forgive the REALLY long post, but this topic has evolved into something too good to pass up. Lots of fun.

Right now, the USFSA has a little problem. When the 200,000,000 once-every-four-years American skating fans come out of their caves and turn on their TVs, they will be wondering 2 things ....... Who are the best ladies, and how many of them will earn a medal?

Somehow, the USFSA must gently break the news to all 200,000,000 of them that our ladies have only a slim chance of touching that podium. I am not sure how they will do that.

Amen...I've been saying this for the last four years. I have several friends who are casual skating fans (in their forties) who grew up under the US dominance/prominence in ladies skating. Over the last 10 years their interest has waned. Some of it is due to 2002, some to their old favorites fading away as pro skating has died out. Some are just attracted to other interests in our ever-more compartmentalized world. I keep telling them that US skating strengths have shifted, but the message has not yet sunk in. Meryl and Tanith are both beautiful and if that's what it takes to get fannies in seats to watch them compete, then please promote both of them (Tessa and Domnina as well). Skating needs the attention.

ITA that the media better crank up some Meryl Davis/Charlie White footage. It was incredibly lame that we have the first ever GPF ice dance champions for the US and all NBC can show is a 30 second clip of them.

The Olympic hopeful commercial running on Universal Sports is infuriating b/c the short version always includes B/A and runs about 10 to 1 versus the long version featuring D/W

I think the battle at Natls for the Dance title will get some good ratings and if both teams are in medal contention in Vancouver it would really help make Ice Dancing more popular in the USA.

Good point, sometimes it takes a couple of Olympics worth of success for casual fans' expectations to shift. That's part of why watching Wylie win silver in Albertville was so much fun. Even though he was a major longshot, it was a promoter's dream b/c US fans were half expecting a continuation of the winning streak. His story took care of the marketing on its own.

Also, it always helps to have an Olympics in our own hemisphere to drive interest. That's why 2002 was such a wasted opportunity b/c it should have set up the sport for the rest of the decade in the US. The combination of US and Canadian medal contenders was almost too good to be true. Rightly or wrongly, English speaking skaters or any nationality with pronounceable names (by American standards) have also been a key component in marketing.

Even though, the Lake Placid games was a relative disappointment for the US, there was tons of coverage (combined with a WC in the US the next year) and audience interest was sparked. I think that even if the US does not have a major medal haul, a moderate level of success to get views to tune in paired with good overall skating by the medalists (wherever they are from) and acceptable judging could bode well for widening interest. Especially if people need something to feel good about.

Regarding the debate over the popularity of US women versus men, there are valid points on both sides. What's interesting to note is that until the three OGMs in ten years the ladies won from Yamaguchi to Hughes, the men actually led the OGM count. My theory about why this was less apparent to average fans is that the ladies always linked up their OGMs with medals of other colors in intervening Olympics (except 64). That sort of consistency on top of the fact the 4 of the 6 OGM's US men won were before TV and the Olympics became joined at the hip while 5 of the 7 won by US women happened afterward leads to crazy high expectations. Sadly the men's two most dominant periods ( 48-60 and 81-88) were followed by periods of relative dry spells with definite gaps in the Olympic medal count. It's worth noting that if an American man wins in Vancouver, both genders will have the same # of OGMs (assuming a US lady does not win).

There is a similar phenomenon in US tennis both in terms of dominance streaks and popularity. American men really have to break out of the mold of expected behavior to garner attention, while the ladies tend to grab attention based on either success or looks, but it not necessary to fit both categories. This is of course not as true globally, which is why Federer is so much more popular outside the US.

Sadly, far too much of US perception of men in sports is tied to outmoded ideas of sexuality and masculinity.

As far as ratings go, Tonichelle has a point in that they really are a snapshop in time and not necessarily a predictor of marketing success down the road. If that were true, Kerrigan would still be skating's most bankable star.

 

[KKonas]

On the other hand though, Canadians LOVE hockey, toughness, grit and everything that goes along with those characteristics. However, there is a lot of respect directed towards the male figure skaters (even more now due to Battle of the Blades). Maybe it's just because we love any sport that takes place on ice

Unfortunately men control the tv networks in the US, and most of them know zero about hockey (unlike Canada), but they recognize it as a rough and tough sport and devote some air time to it. For skating, they think more like Phil Hersh - It's a woman's sport and manly men don't watch it. Golf, which most of tv execs play, is hardly rough and tough, but because they play it - it's on tv all the time. Most of the TV execs are still in the dark ages when it comes to skating, and they still think US women are really the only thing to watch in skating. Maybe someone should try to show clips of pairs and dance teams with their injuries - cuts, blood, broken noses (in pairs), etc. Totmianina got lots of coverage for her accident at Skate America several years ago. Perhaps that's the only way for these TV execs to understand how difficult/athletic these forms of skating actually are.
,