What Constitutes a "Meltdown"?

[R.D.]

So what's the difference between a "bad skate" and a "meltdown" (also known as "bombing")? Two falls? Three? Being slower than usual?

I think there's some confusion on this topic and I just want to get other people's opinions on this topic. To me, it's a combination of factors...I think MK's QR skate last year at worlds was a bad skate; but Carolina's (was it TB or COR 05?) skate was a true meltdown. She basically fell apart during that performance. I'm not even sure myself what the difference might be.

So let the discussion begin...

 

[heyang]

To me, a bad skate is when you miss an element or two, but don't let it totally ruin the remainder of your program. A meltdown is when you let those mistakes get to you. With a meltdown, the skater begins to skate tentatively or give up the fight and/or start looking scared.

For me, Sasha's Oly LP was a bad skate because she shook off the falls and did all the other elements well. I would call Irina's a meltdown because after her mistakes, she really let the rest of the elements go - didn't spin as fast, didn't do as many rotations, etc.

Other meltdowns. Nancy's LP at 93 World's and Naomi Nari Nam's Nationals in 2001 where she just seemed so desparate for each element that she was messing everything up. Michelle's 97 LP at Nationals - she looked like a deer caught in the headlights.

 

[R.D.]

I would call Irina's a meltdown because after her mistakes, she really let the rest of the elements go - didn't spin as fast, didn't do as many rotations, etc.

Really? I don't think it was...to me a meltdown is when you just fall apart...not just let the mistake get to you but to let it completely ruin your performance. There is a difference in that IMO. And that didn't happen with Irina, at least in my opinion.

 

[JonnyCoop]

Really? I don't think it was...to me a meltdown is when you just fall apart...not just let the mistake get to you but to let it completely ruin your performance. There is a difference in that IMO. And that didn't happen with Irina, at least in my opinion.

I agree. She got up pretty fast and she may have slowed down a bit, but she didn't go to pieces.

I agree that "meltdown" kicks in later after a couple of mistakes. To me, you can usually tell by the overall demeanor. For example, Sokolova skated like crap in the Torino SP, but kept smiling anyway; that was a "bad skate", IMO. Sasha's LP, to me, was more of a "rough outing" because once she got the first minute out of the way, she was fine. I'm not sure what to classify Kostner's programs in Torino as; she looked like a deer in headlights from the second she went out there and it was obvious to me on both nights that she had WAY too much adrenaline going, which was understandable. But I'm not sure I would consider either program a "meltdown" because she was, IMO, pretty much a mess from the second she took her starting position.

I think a good example of "meltdown" would be a lot of Angela Nikidonov's long programs, I'm sorry to say, because I absolutely love Angela. But man, if she leaves out a jump revolution, or falls, you can bet that she's pretty much going to under-rotate or fall on at least 90% of the rest of the jumps she'll attempt from that point on.

 

[heyang]

JMHO on Irina's LP. I just felt that after the falls, she seemed to give up. She lost excitement and didn't seem to be fighting. The overall quality on all of her elements after the fall were lower than in her SP. She gave in to her disappointment. Sasha didn't throw away the rest of her program after her mistakes. So, perhaps Irina wasn't a complete meltdown, but she wasn't fighting to stay in it either.

 

[Ogre Mage]

I would consider 3 major mistakes on elements (jumps, spins, footwork, spirals) or 4+ mistakes (major or minor) which then starts to effect the overall quality of the performance (other elements technically clean but not performed well) to be a meltdown.

Carolina Kostner's 2004 Worlds LP is a good example of a meltdown. She had two falls, one popped (singled) jump and very mediocre execution of several elements.

I'm not sure what I would consider a non-meltdown "bad skate." It might have only 1 mistake or it might have as many as 3, depending on how bad the mistakes were and how well skated the overall performance was.

I would consider Slutskaya's Turin LP to be a bad skate. She had one major mistake (a fall) and one minor one (a doubled jump). If she had been strong on all her other elements, I actually might have considered it to be a so-so/average skate. But the overall performance was off -- her spins started to get sloppy and even her vaunted speed disappeared. With that factored in, I would consider it to be a bad skate but not a meltdown.

In the SP, which is even less forgiving, I would say that just making one major error constitutes a bad skate. Two errors is a meltdown, though I might only consider it a bad skate if the overall performance is strong (Jeff Buttle's Turin SP would be a good example).

 

[Bruin714]

For me, I meltdown is when I just feel plain sorry for the skater. Bobek, Nikodinov, and Ando comes to mind as having numerous meltdowns.

 

[Mafke]

We obviously need a taxonomy of ways that programs can go wrong. Some suggestions:

I think there a few critical features for a true meltdown which have to co-occur. True meltdowns are (thankfully) pretty rare.
- There has to be a high stakes prize (before the start the skater has a chance to medal or win),
- Mistakes start compounding and building on each other,
- At some point, the skater seems to give up,
- The skater starts to look like they'd rather be getting a root canal with no anesthesia (on a healthy tooth) rather than be skating.
- It's really painful to watch.

Kerrigan's 93 worlds LP is a classic example down to her wish-I-was-dead comment in the K&C.

There's also (suggested)

skating flat : getting the job done, but the magic isn't happening cause of something missing, kind of lacklustre (Slute's Torino LP after the fall seemed pretty flat),
skating tight : getting the job done, but the skater seems like a ball of nerves ready to fall or explode (Kwan in SLC before the fall and Slute in SLC almost the entire LP).
bad skate : some costly bad mistakes but not a meltdown (Thomas Calgary LP was on the borderline between bad and meltdown)
rough skate : no (or very few) major mistakes, but lots of little ones and sloppy technique (for that skater) Weir's Torino LP.

also (maybe) skating out of one's depth, most likely to happen now when there's no QR, a mid-level (or lower) skater does unusually well in the SP and gets into the final group for the LP and they can't keep up and it gets painful (Hubert at Albertville, some Swedish guy a couple of years ago at Euros)

 

[Mathman]

Any post that features the word "taxonomy" has got my vote, LOL. :agree:

 

[sk8rmom97]

A meltdown is what Emanuel Sandhu does when he doesn't skate brilliantly.

 

[VINLUVSKWAN]

A meltdown is what Emanuel Sandhu does when he doesn't skate brilliantly.

Oh come on, give Eman a break this time He more than redeemed himself considering all the flak he got after a disappointing Olympics.
On topic, the ultimate meltdown has to have been Nancy's 93 Worlds LP. Honorable mentions...Kurt Browning's 94 Lillehammer SP, Michelle's (sorry) 97 Nationals LP, ANY Nicole Bobek INTERNATIONAL program after her brilliant 95 Worlds SP, Brian's 05 Worlds and 06 Olympics FS.

 

[hockeyfan228]

What doesn't constitute a meltdown is when a skater is sick or injured and has a bad program, usually getting worse as it goes on.

 

[JonnyCoop]

JMHO on Irina's LP. I just felt that after the falls, she seemed to give up. She lost excitement and didn't seem to be fighting.

That may be true (I'd have to look at the replay), but I wouldn't consider that "meltdown". That would fall under the category of "bad attitude". (See also Thomas, Debi, 88 Olympic long program; at least Irina waited till she was almost done to give up.)

 

[SusanBeth]

You know one when you see it! To this day, I remember Hubert's 92 Oly Lp, Bobek's Oly programs and think only about how unremittingly horror-filled they were. You couldn't even hope to find anything good to say about them. Not even the kindest person or the biggest fan could pretend they were anything but painful to watch .

A bad skate can have many positive elements. The spins, footwork, and/or choreography might be solid, but there were major mistakes.

 

[76olympics]

SusanBeth, I think the Olympic 1998 skate by Nicole Bobek was so heartbreaking that I really couldn't watch it. I had my eyes covered and was peeking out to see if she might miraculously come back. No joy at all there- when I hear "meltdown" , that is what comes to mind for me.