2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

[Yuna Luna]

Interpretation of those generic classical pieces? Whatever do you mean? You mean... the choreography and concepts to those generic pieces was... interesting?

No. The concepts themselves were generic. Danse Macabre, for example, is always the same (or a similar) concept - an evil dance. Roxanne is always the same concept - a lustful tango. Yet Yuna performed them to a whole different level than anyone else. You can give almost anyone Yuna's exact choreography, and they probably wouldn't be able to pull it off. Likewise, if almost anyone else tried to perform Alena's programs, there's a good chance they would suck because the programs themselves aren't that great.

Yes, unfortunately. Otherwise more here would be seeing that Kosto's program isn't that great.

No. I think her free program is awful, and even her short program is weird in some respects, but most people don't notice that when they watch her. What everyone loves is the way she performs those programs. Sasha doesn't quite have that effect, given the amount of people who have complained about her PCS (check any youtube comments section). Again, I'm not saying that she's bad and I know that she will definitely improve, I'm saying that Sasha placing 3 points behind Alena - who skated flawlessly today - in PCS is not right.

Concept < Performance OF that concept.

 

[SkateSkates]

I really hope Alena doesn’t get discouraged from this result. For some reason some of her GOEs were lower than senior nats/GPF when all elements except for the 3Lo were much better. I just don’t understand.

 

[Yuna Luna]

No. I'm saying my eyes provide my evidence, instead of preconceived notions.

Ok, then it's an opinion.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Hopefully they start letting Ladies do quads in the SP soon. That way Sasha can just go even harder


On the real....that 4t-3t was a thing of beauty!!!! She puts on show for certain.

 

[Resa]

Did anyone else notice that Alyona's Technique on her toe pick jumps really improved? She didn't use full blade assist on them. Is this new or am I just late to the party?

 

[chopinskate]

But your argument could be reduced to interesting concept = choreography and interpretation which isn‘t correct either

Not sure you got what I was saying at all. Concepts are a part of CO and IN. You've completely misunderstood the argument. Either that, or you're seeing some great extent of choreography and interpretation in Kostornaya's, that moves beyond her generic concept and overtakes Trusova's own program, that I plainly can't. I wasn't reducing those components to just the concept, but it does seem some like to reduce those components to refinement.

so there‘s that.

So there isn't that.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I really hope Alena doesn’t get discouraged from this result. For some reason some of her GOEs were lower than senior nats/GPF when all elements except for the 3Lo were much better. I just don’t understand.

Might have been different judges and just being in a different landscape of competitors. I think she followed Sasha this time. That’s pretty common. I don’t see anything to be discouraged about here. She has done very well for herself this season with plenty to be proud of. She’s a real standout in a very hard girls to stand out in.

 

[Alex65]

I dont think the 3 pts difference between Alena and Alexandra reflected the difference in artistry between them. I never felt Trusova was truly engaged in the music ever throughout the program whereas Alena even if the choreography is kinda bland compared to her sp still kept up the interpretation to her best.

Of course, this is not correct. The difference should be much larger. In favor of Sasha. If it is based on technical skill.

 

[sx98423]

No. The concepts themselves were generic. Danse Macabre, for example, is always the same (or a similar) concept - an evil dance. Roxanne is always the same concept - a lustful tango. Yet Yuna performed them to a whole different level than anyone else. You can give almost anyone else Yuna's exact choreography, and they probably wouldn't be able to pull it off. Likewise, if almost anyone else tried to perform Alena's programs, there's a good chance they would suck because the programs themselves aren't that great.



No. I think her free program is awful, and even her short program is weird in some respects, but most people don't notice that when they watch her. What everyone loves is the way she performs those programs. Sasha doesn't quite have that effect, given the amount of people who have complained about her PCS (check any youtube comments section). Again, I'm not saying that she's bad and I know that she will definitely improve, I'm saying that Sasha placing 3 points behind Alena - who skated flawlessly today - in PCS is not right.

Concept < Performance OF that concept.

i actually think the exact opposite. i can't imagine alena pulling off any of sasha's programs she just seems so soft. however i've seen moments in sasha's programs where she does have that floaty, soft feel so i could actually see her doing alena's programs

 

[Resa]

Another thing to note:
Senior Nationals - Tarakanova's PCS 58
Junior Nationals: PCS 66.
I found her Senior Nationals Performance flawless, how can there be an 8(!!) Point difference?!?

 

[Giltedge]

Ok, then it's an opinion.

Well, I certainly hope so!

 

[koatcue]

Sasha said she wants to learn 3a for her short next year. Such a boss And Alyona mentioned Japanese and their axels and quads too, confirming her desire to work on axel and include it too in her programs

 

[Spirals for Miles]

I'm happy with these results.
I think Alena and Anna both have a basis for more PCS, but at the same time, Sasha landed quads. They did not. That's where the difference came from.

Alena's score is lower than at senior nationals because there's no choreo sequence. Not because of some sort of conspiracy to give Sasha the win.

I think, on the basis of both programs, Sasha was the best. Alena was cleaner, but when Sasha is doing 2 quads, it's not enough to overtake her. And that's fair to me. If Anna had landed her quad, she probably would've won, and that's fair to me too. But she didn't win. And so Sasha did.

And what does it all matter when they're all likely going to JWC, have secured GP spots for next year, and have the top level of funding for next year due to senior nationals results?

 

[Edwin]

And what does it all matter when they're all likely going to JWC, have secured GP spots for next year, and have the top level of funding for next year due to senior nationals results?

Funding is always a touchy subject. There is no direct correlation between amount of money spent and results. Khrustalniy is probably well funded already, and staffed with people that have proven to bring the best out of their skaters and delivering the results to match their ambitions.
No doubt the trainers would probably like to drive a bigger car or to satisfy whatever material need, but in the end, it is their attention, dedication and wisdom that matter, and those commodities have neither price nor value that could be expressed in money.

The talent these trainers have under their tutelage is priceless.

 

[Fluture]

Not sure you got what I was saying at all. Concepts are a part of CO and IN. You've completely misunderstood the argument. Either that, or you're seeing some great extent of choreography and interpretation in Kostornaya's, that moves beyond her generic concept and overtakes Trusova's own program, that I plainly can't. I wasn't reducing those components to just the concept, but it does seem some like to reduce those components to refinement.




So there isn't that.

I got what you were saying, just didn‘t think it made much sense.

For me, it‘s clear Alena‘s FS > Sasha‘s even though both aren‘t exactly masterpieces. I‘m not even much of a fan of Alena‘s FS in general, I think it‘s - concept wise - pretty bland. Her SP is a lot better. Actually, in my eyes, all of the 3A have better SPs than freeskates his season. Still, I just enjoy how Alena interprets Romeo and Juliet and makes the choreography work despite it not being he most original program. Sasha‘s FS has a unique quality in the beginning but after the first jump it just begins to feel like a jumping fest because the interesting choreography was traded for jump after jump. She can‘t really show emotions or interpret it. Her SP is much better in that aspect and I think her performance there has continued to improve. Her FS... not so much. In the SP the difficult jumps are a highlight but they’re not the only interesting thing about the program. Sasha is a fairly good performer if still a bit juniorish. But I just don‘t feel like her FS let‘s her show any of that because it‘s just a plain bad program. Alena‘s musicality could have been showcased better with a different FS as well. Both programs aren‘t exactly great but overall, I feel like Alena does a better job at interpreting hers than Sasha and I feel like overall, Alena‘s FS is also better. Sasha has a nice concept going for it but it just wasn‘t realised that well. I think we‘ll have to agree to disagree on that.

 

[flanker]

Just looked there to see another "mice vs. frogs wars" about tech content dominating over impression. I came, I saw, I can sleep well now

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

As happy as I am for 3A (and I’m really happy), I can’t help but feel bad for Tarakanova...

 

[Fluture]

As happy as I am for 3A (and I’m really happy), I can’t help but feel bad for Tarakanova...

Yeah... that fall in the FS cost her a lot... maybe now that Anna is going to Worlds, she will be able to do European Youth Olympic Festival? I just hope her season hasn‘t ended yet...

 

[j00mla]

I think Trusova has some pretty difficult transitions. A few moves need work, and her spins could be better, but her skating skills (a more masculine style to be sure) are better than people think or give her credit for.

that's it :thumbsup:
I like this one from twizzles to spin https://youtu.be/3O8v2lFfHK0?t=140
and the spin is very good
and next...
and next...

 

[Alex65]

I got what you were saying, just didn‘t think it made much sense.

For me, it‘s clear Alena‘s FS > Sasha‘s even though both aren‘t exactly masterpieces. I‘m not even much of a fan of Alena‘s FS in general, I think it‘s - concept wise - pretty bland. Her SP is a lot better. Actually, in my eyes, all of the 3A have better SPs than freeskates his season. Still, I just enjoy how Alena interprets Romeo and Juliet and makes the choreography work despite it not being he most original program. Sasha‘s FS has a unique quality in the beginning but after the first jump it just begins to feel like a jumping fest because the interesting choreography was traded for jump after jump. She can‘t really show emotions or interpret it. Her SP is much better in that aspect and I think her performance there has continued to improve. Her FS... not so much. In the SP the difficult jumps are a highlight but they’re not the only interesting thing about the program. Sasha is a fairly good performer if still a bit juniorish. But I just don‘t feel like her FS let‘s her show any of that because it‘s just a plain bad program. Alena‘s musicality could have been showcased better with a different FS as well. Both programs aren‘t exactly great but overall, I feel like Alena does a better job at interpreting hers than Sasha and I feel like overall, Alena‘s FS is also better. Sasha has a nice concept going for it but it just wasn‘t realised that well. I think we‘ll have to agree to disagree on that.

I want to argue. All FS Sasha built on the plot of the film. From the first movement to the final. All her movements in the program and even the first jump organically correspond to the plot and spirit of the film. Every time she skates in this program, I kind of re-watch the two-hour film compressed in 2 minutes. I would not call it a bad interpretation.