2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[macy]

But it's very weird that she kicked out literally her last senior lady basically because she wasn't in shape after injury and couldn't show good results quickly. Her group is not that overcrowded, I can't recall any other good students besides Voronov and Danelian. But from this interview I also understood that Nastya was a bit homesick and wanted to reunite with her family in St. Petersburg. Despite that, Buyanova's behavior is still questionable.

I agree this is very strange and almost uncharacteristic for a high level, seasoned coach. most ANY coach with common sense knows its physically impossible to come back quickly from an injury and be in shape. that's extremely unreasonable and makes me question her coaching ability.

 

[silverfoxes]

I never liked Buyanova at all, but I'm not sure how she did anything worse than what Eteri has done multiple times to multiple skaters, or what Plushenko said about Tarakanova. None of them care about throwing former students under the bus.

Perhaps there is more to the story. Everyone gives Gubanova the benefit of the doubt (fair enough), but nobody can really say what went on in training. I mean, she left 2 weeks ago and nobody knew until yesterday...so how can you possibly know what their day to day dynamic was like? There must be some reason why Buyanova is willing to let so many skaters go...I thought I read somewhere that she did not like to have a large team, it wasn't important to her. So I'm not sure why she took on so many last season. Maybe it was an experiment to see if she could approximate Eteri's results, and she decided it's not for her. Doesn't seem like a good way to run a school, but it's her prerogative. Lots of skaters have gotten kicked out and moved on. Besides, I didn't think anyone like Buyanova as a coach before this, so maybe Gubanova is better off without her.

 

[Georgya]

I never liked Buyanova at all, but I'm not sure how she did anything worse than what Eteri has done multiple times to multiple skaters, or what Plushenko said about Tarakanova. None of them care about throwing former students under the bus.

Perhaps there is more to the story. Everyone gives Gubanova the benefit of the doubt (fair enough), but nobody can really say what went on in training. I mean, she left 2 weeks ago and nobody knew until yesterday...so how can you possibly know what their day to day dynamic was like? There must be some reason why Buyanova is willing to let so many skaters go...I thought I read somewhere that she did not like to have a large team, it wasn't important to her. So I'm not sure why she took on so many last season. Maybe it was an experiment to see if she could approximate Eteri's results, and she decided it's not for her. Doesn't seem like a good way to run a school, but it's her prerogative. Lots of skaters have gotten kicked out and moved on. Besides, I didn't think anyone like Buyanova as a coach before this, so maybe Gubanova is better off without her.

The mental gymnastics is I don't know if it is intentional or not with the last bit... Buyanova messing up with 4 highly promising skaters is still Eteri's fault. Insert Old Man Yells at Cloud Meme

 

[JazzUp]

Buyanova messing up with 4 highly promising skaters is still Eteri's fault. Insert Old Man Yells at Cloud Meme

Ha, don't you know by now that anything bad happening to any skater in the whole wide world is Eteri's fault?!? :noshake:

 

[Lunalovesskating]

Thankfully Gubanova already has a new coach. I am relieved

 

[el henry]

The mental gymnastics is I don't know if it is intentional or not with the last bit... Buyanova messing up with 4 highly promising skaters is still Eteri's fault. Insert Old Man Yells at Cloud Meme

I don’t see where Silverfoxes at all implied that that was Eteri’s fault?

But of course the corrollary to everything is Eteri’s fault is that Eteri is perfect and does absolutely nothing wrong at all, unlike any other coach in creation neither of which are true.

Now is where I think it is appropriate to insert Old Man Yells at Cloud Meme

 

[Scott512]

I called this a year ago, when every skater was planning to move to CSKA for some reason, leaving in my opinion far better coaching teams probably for money, i said Buyanova would have found no success and then she would have gone out for shopping again finding new skaters.

You can go back and rewatch the Test Skates, you have all your answers there on why CSKA can't produce successful ladies, they don't train enough, not as efficiently and as of result you have:
- level 2 or 3 spins and steps sequences (points left to table)
- underrotated / inconsistent jumps.

Yes, the work on edges, posture,... is noticeable but it's all pointless if you lose that much on the technical elements.

I don't understand why RusFed supports this behaviour, this is literally destroying the depth of your team.

Inna Goncharenko was the coach who was bringing the results at CSKA, now in my opinion they should either invest more on Davydov or find new talented coaches, or completely rework the training schedule, skaters need to be more prepared in September.

SPOILER ALERT: they won't and 1-2 years from now they will try to convince one of the Eteri skaters to switch (my guess is Kostornaya) so they can have a skater at the Olympics, and pretend CSKA has produced a competitive senior lady.

Also hot take on Gubanova -> she should have never left Turenko. She was a bit more consistent with her, she would have probably got a GP spot by now. Her best hope now is to join Chebotareva, but i don't know if she can accept her this late in the season.

You were right about all these girls going to Buyanova. Too bad you dont work for the Russian Federation. You could have saved these girls a year of their career.

Nastya never should have left Turenko.

Late in the season? Not too late. Bad timing by Buyanova for sure.

 

[Tolstoj]

I never liked Buyanova at all, but I'm not sure how she did anything worse than what Eteri has done multiple times to multiple skaters, or what Plushenko said about Tarakanova. None of them care about throwing former students under the bus.

Perhaps there is more to the story. Everyone gives Gubanova the benefit of the doubt (fair enough), but nobody can really say what went on in training. I mean, she left 2 weeks ago and nobody knew until yesterday...so how can you possibly know what their day to day dynamic was like? There must be some reason why Buyanova is willing to let so many skaters go...I thought I read somewhere that she did not like to have a large team, it wasn't important to her. So I'm not sure why she took on so many last season. Maybe it was an experiment to see if she could approximate Eteri's results, and she decided it's not for her. Doesn't seem like a good way to run a school, but it's her prerogative. Lots of skaters have gotten kicked out and moved on. Besides, I didn't think anyone like Buyanova as a coach before this, so maybe Gubanova is better off without her.

In this case Gubanova's goal was to get a GP spot and she didn't get it so for Buyanova this is mission failed, onto the next one.

The other reason could be that Buyanova gave up entirely with ladies to focus on the men, but i don't believe it.

I noticed a lack of long term planning on that group, except when they raise the skater from novice level like Adelina Sotnikova, Denis Ten, Artur Danielian,... that's when you see the commitment.

Such a contrast to for example Rafael Arutyunyan who has always said "give me 2 years and you'll see the results".

It's a shame cause Elena Vodorezova was coached by Stanislav Zhuk, who was one of the best coaches in the world, you'd think she learnt a lot from him, and she also has Tarasova there who is also incredibly knowledgeable and incredibly successful as coach.

 

[zounger]

Then why did you say “let’s not make fun” if you knew that is what she meant?

I am confused.

I think you are getting confused too easily. I knew she/he made a typo.

 

[Tavi...]

The mental gymnastics is I don't know if it is intentional or not with the last bit... Buyanova messing up with 4 highly promising skaters is still Eteri's fault. Insert Old Man Yells at Cloud Meme

silverfoxes didn’t blame Eteri for anything or engage in any mental gymnastics. She drew a parallel between Eteri’s behavior and Buyanova’s behavior, and then made a joke about Buyanova.

 

[Jontor]

In this case Gubanova's goal was to get a GP spot and she didn't get it so for Buyanova this is mission failed, onto the next one.

The other reason could be that Buyanova gave up entirely with ladies to focus on the men, but i don't believe it.

I noticed a lack of long term planning on that group, except when they raise the skater from novice level like Adelina Sotnikova, Denis Ten, Artur Danielian,... that's when you see the commitment.

Such a contrast to for example Rafael Arutyunyan who has always said "give me 2 years and you'll see the results".

It's a shame cause Elena Vodorezova was coached by Stanislav Zhuk, who was one of the best coaches in the world, you'd think she learnt a lot from him, and she also has Tarasova there who is also incredibly knowledgeable and incredibly successful as coach.

I'm beginning to think it is Buyanova's fault that Tsurskaya retired...

 

[Amei]

I would buy stock in Nastya if I had the money. I hope someone in Russia does the same it's about time some of these young ladies in Russia leave to train abroad if they get the financial backing to do so. What Nastya needs is what you said a Russian millionaire willing to financially support her training anywhere in the world and still representing Russia. Tennis players do it hockey players do it swimmers do it why not figure skaters too? I don't expect this will happen with Nastya but it is an option. I still expect her to find a new coach soon and continue to skate for Russia.

Outside of a personal connection to her or any other skater, why would a Russian millionaire invest with little return for a skater to train outside of Russia? Last check Russia is oozing with talented ladies, fact is the 4 ladies that went to Worlds and Europeans for Russia last year could skate flawlessly and still be watching those competitions as spectators this coming season. Perhaps trying to poach a Russian coach that works out of the country to come home and train skaters to get a wider base of where their skaters come from, but it makes zero sense for someone to risk the negative publicity by paying for a skater to train outside of Russia (see Evgenia Med. as an example)

 

[Amei]

I really don't think RusFed cared so much about Tursynbayeva's silver while taking home Gold and Bronze. People bringing her into discussion on country switch must remember that Tursynbayeva made NO international appearances for Russia.

Is amazing that she had a plan from the start and she has my respect for the fact that she didn't try to "cut corners" by seaking political influence and switching to compete for Russia. Her parents managed really well her career.

One could easily make the argument that she 'cut corners'/took the easy road by switching to skate for Kazakhstan vs. Russia the country she was born in and from what I know has lived in her whole life outside of her sabbatical to Canada that was not by her choosing. Skating for Kazakhstan she is guaranteed a birth at all major competitions vs. Russia where she would have been fighting like crazy to get to competitions like Europeans/Worlds/Olympics.

 

[Ice Dance]

Naw. There is nothing cutting corners about landing the first quadruple jump in senior competition, regardless of the country she skates for. As always, there are pluses and minuses about skating for a particular country & federation. Elizabet has experienced both. (She reminds me very much of a young Shannon Miller. She holds herself to a high standard, and she wants it right, by golly; she isn't pleased with anything less).

 

[AsadaFanBoy]

Is there any chance Nastya went to Anna Tsareva? She did a great job at Sambo 70 with Pogorilaya. <3

 

[nussnacker]

One could easily make the argument that she 'cut corners'/took the easy road by switching to skate for Kazakhstan vs. Russia the country she was born in and from what I know has lived in her whole life outside of her sabbatical to Canada that was not by her choosing. Skating for Kazakhstan she is guaranteed a birth at all major competitions vs. Russia where she would have been fighting like crazy to get to competitions like Europeans/Worlds/Olympics.

I think at the point of her decision it wasn’t going that far.
The story goes like this: skating was just an activity for quite some time, she competed at domestic competitions, but it was nothing serious at that point.
Then she was included in Moscow team and was offered a funding, and at that point parents decided this is getting serious, so they rejected the funding and went on to compete for Kazakhstan (subsequently receiving funding there).
Needless to say, it’s easier to compete when there’s a system that is so well oiled, as it is in Russia (with funding and coaching), then to move out at 13 and train in Canada, which is quite a change at 13.

I think they might have cut some corners with that (getting into less competitive field that is), intentionally or not, it doesn’t look like it was the main purpose, but probably it came in somewhere when weighing pros and contras.
Her father is a big patriot, her mom maybe wanted less competition, it all came into place.
Growing up in Russia and competing for Kazakhstan as a Kazakh, is a bit like growing up in Germany as an Austrian and deciding to compete for Austria. There are similarities in the cultures, you’re not that out of touch with your nationality and culture.

 

[Scott512]

Outside of a personal connection to her or any other skater, why would a Russian millionaire invest with little return for a skater to train outside of Russia? Last check Russia is oozing with talented ladies, fact is the 4 ladies that went to Worlds and Europeans for Russia last year could skate flawlessly and still be watching those competitions as spectators this coming season. Perhaps trying to poach a Russian coach that works out of the country to come home and train skaters to get a wider base of where their skaters come from, but it makes zero sense for someone to risk the negative publicity by paying for a skater to train outside of Russia (see Evgenia Med. as an example)

I just think some of the girls should train outside Russia for convenience for being the number one girl in their own stable. Nastya could be that outside of Russia. I am two years Eteri may have twice as many great skaters as she does now. Where are they all going to go? Some will go elsewhere in or out of Russia and Evgenia has paved the way. I know money is an issue but most of these skaters and their families know people who are wealthy. If I had money and by that I mean Millions and I only have thousands like most people I would want to support or contribute to support of some talented kid and give them a chance to become the best they can be.

 

[nussnacker]

Outside of a personal connection to her or any other skater, why would a Russian millionaire invest with little return for a skater to train outside of Russia? Last check Russia is oozing with talented ladies, fact is the 4 ladies that went to Worlds and Europeans for Russia last year could skate flawlessly and still be watching those competitions as spectators this coming season. Perhaps trying to poach a Russian coach that works out of the country to come home and train skaters to get a wider base of where their skaters come from, but it makes zero sense for someone to risk the negative publicity by paying for a skater to train outside of Russia (see Evgenia Med. as an example)

Sometimes people want to help kids.
Tarakanova is actively looking for a sponsor herself, to pay for things not covered by fed money. It’s possible. But probably unlikely, given the money needed for overseas training.
I think it would be easier for her to train in Russia though, regardless of funding.

 

[vesperalvioletta]

Though she's not technically a Russian lady anymore, Ekaterina Kurakova got funding from a publicly unnamed donor to pay for her training at the Cricket Club, so I guess it's not out of the realm of possibility.

 

[Alex65]

Russian business sometimes invests large sums of money in sponsorship of athletes and clubs, but these are popular sports such as football or hockey. The popularity of FS in Russia has grown very much lately, but it is still insignificant compared to football. Only a few of the most well-known athletes of FS can count on serious sponsorship. For the rest, these are only family resources when it comes to studying abroad. Judging by the history of Nastya Gubanova, her family has a modest income.