2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Jontor]

Sasha was jumping much better 3Lz-3Lo last year. You can compare it with that or with Alina's 3Lz-3Lo at JO, and you will see they didn't perform them as good in those competitions this season. 3Lo combo is a very tricky element and it is often UR on a judging review, so the point is to jump it silky and smooth in real time that judges don't push the review button on it

Yes, and Alina is an expert at having them smooth. In replay they are always borderline UR though.
I think in Anna's case, her problem is that they are backloaded. You can see in warmup she can do the combo with a nice running edge. In her programs she is probably a bit fatigued when the combo comes...

 

[el henry]

They made those claims publicly (anybody can read them) and their posts were anything but polite (and I chose the softer and funny ones, but those were not isolated comments but part of the whole view of those users). Behind somebody's back would be if I would spread that via PM and similarly intending to cause harm to particular user without giving him a chance to advocate it. When you make strong prediction you have to count on being wrong and being told of being wrong.

The first one attracted my attention simply due to the fact that it was interresting to compare the prediction and the reality we saw just the last weekend. And the last one is quite actual when we can see that there was no "cutthroat" that was predicted but the exact opposite. It's the sign that users tend to get carried away by their point of view, by their feelings towards skaters and teams. Which is anybody's right but this is a sign how low value those predictions have.

I disagree about someone just happening to see a random post. If I have a difference with a poster, I try to quote them and allow them the courtesy of responding. I would never assume that anyone is going to read every single one of my posts

And a wrong prediction is just that, a wrong prediction. We all make them, you, me, and every other poster on this Board. It will be interesting to see which ones pan out, and do not pan out, by 2020 Worlds.

 

[*~RussianBleux~*]

Yes lack of speed and running edge on the landing is a flag for review because UR slows the running edge.

They didn’t slow the replay enough but I thought the call was fair on the 3L+3Lo in the short and Euler combination in the free. I would have had her right inside 90 on the 3L+3Lo in the free. That call was the most suspect to me.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Yes, and Alina is an expert at having them smooth. In replay they are always borderline UR though.
I think in Anna's case, her problem is that they are backloaded. You can see in warmup she can do the combo with a nice running edge. In her programs she is probably a bit fatigued when the combo comes...

Yeah, actually many jumps are not fully rotated on the landing! Now, the judging system is calling UR jumps only those not rotated after some defined degree, and only those spoted during/immidiately after the skating :dev3: (Because tech rules are not quite 'righteous' as it maybe seems, they changed requirements from this season, so even the jump is called as UR in the system, it can be judged with not necessarily bad quality by the pannel of judges if it looked fine in real time. Or they even raised the BV of UR jumps. I can't recall everything i read about it accurately tho ).

 

[Jontor]

I disagree about someone just happening to see a random post. If I have a difference with a poster, I try to quote them and allow them the courtesy of responding. I would never assume that anyone is going to read every single one of my posts

And a wrong prediction is just that, a wrong prediction. We all make them, you, me, and every other poster on this Board. It will be interesting to see which ones pan out, and do not pan out, by 2020 Worlds.

I don't understand. Is it wrong to quote someone from a year ago?

 

[Vandevska]

I don't understand. Is it wrong to quote someone from a year ago?

Yes. Apparently someone has free time.

 

[flanker]

I disagree about someone just happening to see a random post. If I have a difference with a poster, I try to quote them and allow them the courtesy of responding. I would never assume that anyone is going to read every single one of my posts

Be assured that I don't

BTW it was you who just yesterday asked about providing "cites and or quotes" in another case. And what I was posting were direct quotes so what should be a problem here.

And a wrong prediction is just that, a wrong prediction. We all make them, you, me, and every other poster on this Board. It will be interesting to see which ones pan out, and do not pan out, by 2020 Worlds.

I definitely don't make predictions of this kind, about cutthroats, about leaving teams, about staying in juniors. After all, those types of comments have nothing to do with real predicting, but with how the user thinks about skater, coach or both and how he wishes this comes to an end. Any of the claims I've quoted has anything to do with nonbiased attempt to predict further development. It just seems that particular types of "predicting" (somehow always assuming the worst for a particular team), are allowed and advocated, while pointing their divergence from reality could be somehow wrong?

 

[Jontor]

Ooops! Just posted practicing videos of Medvedeva and Trusova here and it was deleated. It's not allowed. Sorry I forgot.

 

[flanker]

Ooops! Just posted practicing videos of Medvedeva and Trusova here and it was deleated. It's not allowed. Sorry I forgot.

Don't take it to the heart. It happened to me last week as well. Now we are smarter and we won't repeat our mistakes

 

[el henry]

Be assured that I don't

BTW it was you who just yesterday asked about providing "cites and or quotes" in another case. And what I was posting were direct quotes so what should be a problem here.



I definitely don't make predictions of this kind, about cutthroats, about leaving teams, about staying in juniors. After all, those types of comments have nothing to do with real predicting, but with how the user thinks about skater, coach or both and how he wishes this comes to an end. Any of the claims I've quoted has anything to do with nonbiased attempt to predict further development. It just seems that particular types of "predicting" (somehow always assuming the worst for a particular team), are allowed and advocated, while pointing their divergence from reality could be somehow wrong?

Yes, and I do appreciate the cites and the willingness to engage directly here. I’m clearly not making my point, so I will just drop it

Every coach has their fervent supporters and their detractors. If you are trying to say that Eteri or her skaters come in for more criticism, or more unwarranted criticism, than any other coach or skaters, I would definitely disagree with that. but reams have already been written, and I do not intend to write more

I am looking forward (we can say that) to seeing how Sasha and Zhenya do. I think it will only be the second time I’ve seen Sasha skate.

 

[LenaRadiFan]

Yuna Shiraiwa last season. There are other examples from the past. But for me, senior competition is a senior competition, no matter is it Grand Prix or Challenger. The problem is that Russia can't send all of their good skaters to GP, because there are no places for them. As they can't sent all of their good skater to Worlds. But some of them can be sent to Junior Worlds. It's for a sure a more worthy (ladies) competition than Europeans for example #sorrynotsorry

Didn't actually Elena R compete in her first senior season on the senior gp and then went to junior worlds(and won )

 

[fabienne1996]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4BEZXkIScx/?igshid=zfrkb6nzx5a3

 

[Lightstar]

Didn't actually Elena R compete in her first senior season on the senior gp and then went to junior worlds(and won )

But there she wasn‘t eligible for senior worlds! Until 2013 the age limits for the grand prix serie and worlds weren‘t the same. So while she could compete as a senior on the gp she couldn‘t at the olympics or worlds.
It was the same for lipnitskaia the year before.

 

[flanker]

Yes, and I do appreciate the cites and the willingness to engage directly here. I’m clearly not making my point, so I will just drop it

Every coach has their fervent supporters and their detractors. If you are trying to say that Eteri or her skaters come in for more criticism, or more unwarranted criticism, than any other coach or skaters, I would definitely disagree with that. but reams have already been written, and I do not intend to write more

I am looking forward (we can say that) to seeing how Sasha and Zhenya do. I think it will only be the second time I’ve seen Sasha skate.

My quotes had nothing to do with what you say, my quotes were about people's wishful thinking no matter the target, but if you expressed this than I say that it would be hypocritical from me to say that I don't think so. I do, actually. The fact that those quotes were "accidentally" about one particular team can be credited to the fact that such comments were found on nearly every page that I've randomly opened. I've quoted those that appeared to me as the most funny in comparison to reality just because it shows that predicting mostly on personal taste is rarely close to reality.

If I would really wanted to start talking about what you think I was trying to say, then I would have chosen different ones.

 

[Good Vibes Only]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4BEZXkIScx/?igshid=zfrkb6nzx5a3

I find it so cute how Sasha and Zhenya are still friends even though they are each other’s competition. They are goals

 

[Jontor]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4BEZXkIScx/?igshid=zfrkb6nzx5a3

Is Zhenya translating for Sasha? Is she saying that there is no quads allowed?

 

[Scott512]

Yes, and I do appreciate the cites and the willingness to engage directly here. I’m clearly not making my point, so I will just drop it

Every coach has their fervent supporters and their detractors. If you are trying to say that Eteri or her skaters come in for more criticism, or more unwarranted criticism, than any other coach or skaters, I would definitely disagree with that. but reams have already been written, and I do not intend to write more

I am looking forward (we can say that) to seeing how Sasha and Zhenya do. I think it will only be the second time I’ve seen Sasha skate.

Are you saying that you think Eteri is not criticized more than other coaches? The answer is pretty obvious.

 

[Scott512]

I find it so cute how Sasha and Zhenya are still friends even though they are each other’s competition. They are goals

So nice to see but no surprise. I think Evgenia is friends with all of 3A. And ironically enough to me Anna is like the new Zhenya in Eteri's group because she's been there the longest I believe 11 or 12 years at this point and Zhenya was there for 11 years. We have to remember that these figure skaters are fierce competitors on the ice but off the ice they're pretty normal and most of them are friends or friendly with each other.

 

[Decoder]

Wouldn't it be more polite to engage the poster directly, rather than talk about them behind their back?

Although I'm not sure what point is made to "call out" a wrong prediction. We all make them, and it doesn't say anything about a particular skaters' merits

To me it does not sound "talk about them behind their back". I smiled when I read those quoted comments (although I didn't see the posters' names - it is actually irrelevant) and saw people make various predictions again. This forum is an interesting place.

 

[el henry]

Are you saying that you think Eteri is not criticized more than other coaches? The answer is pretty obvious.

I am answering you, Scott, because you asked me a direct question.

Yes, I am saying that.

The answer is obvious: she is not.

But I do not care to debate, only because no one’s mind will be changed. As far as I know, there is no new evidence on the subject. If one were to go only by Goldenskate, and that is all I care to go by, there are far more posters praising Eteri than critiquing her. And every single one, praise or criticism, is entitled to their opinion :yes:

I’ve already posted again more than I said I would, but in this instance I thought it was polite to do so. Now I really shall leave the subject