ISU figure skating streams might be switched to pay-per-view platform

[pearly]

All, the comments at this link are interesting as it includes comments from people who have used recast for awhile to watch curling, etc. BTW, recast will use your data for marketing/data mining....I never give out my real birthday to sights like this.

You know they want your data as soon as they offer free credit if you complete a profile.

Anyway - the event is now over and there haven't been any more major glitches after that black screen during one ice resurfacing. I had it on on both Chrome and Safari and at one point Chrome did start having issues (warning me it wouldn't work in this browser and to swith to Safari), but then it continued normally. I shut it down at that point and only left Safari on.

I was still only able to rewind five minutes, no more.

I tried to restart the whole thing now and I'm getting this amazing message:

"Oh no!​

The live event has finished, or the video has been removed by the publisher. Check out The Ice Skating Channel's channel to see what else they have on Recast"

However, the event has just finished so maybe they'll upload it in a while.

 

[Kris135]

edit/new idea: Can figure skating file for divorce from the ISU?

The divorce is long overdue. I mean as long as speed skating is main focus of the ISU nothing will change. Look at Peacock coverage as evidence of this. Speed skating has replays of events all the way back to 2021 which I think was the Olympic trials. Figure skating on the other hand has had very limited to no replays for the entire season. I am getting tired of all the hassle just to watch a sport I enjoy. I do not know if having separate federations will solve all the problems but I might be nice to have some who care only for figure skating and worries our future for a change.

 

[skatedreamer]

Just give me an all I can watch on my own schedule option at a reasonable price and I’ll sign up for it already. Sigh. My number of streaming packages is already out of control.

I’m actually currently also watching Tirreno-Adriadco on Global Cycling+, which costs me $50/year for pretty much every race I’d want to watch except for the handful of races that NBC has rights to. Given the short season for figure skating, give me a $25 option that includes archived competitions I can watch at my leisure instead of getting up at 3:30am local and I’d be all ‘here’s my credit card; take my money already’.

Aaaaayyyyyyyy-men!

 

[skatedreamer]

The divorce is long overdue. I mean as long as speed skating is main focus of the ISU nothing will change. Look at Peacock coverage as evidence of this. Speed skating has replays of events all the way back to 2021 which I think was the Olympic trials. Figure skating on the other hand has had very limited to no replays for the entire season. I am getting tired of all the hassle just to watch a sport I enjoy. I do not know if having separate federations will solve all the problems but I might be nice to have some who care only for figure skating and worries our future for a change.

You'd think things would have changed at least a little bit after Cinquanta left in 2016, but noooooooooo.....

It's like figure skating is the Cinderella of the ISU. I don't know much about the history so need to ask some dumb questions: has the USFSA or any other federation tried to push back in any significant way? And does the ISU actually get any revenue from speed skating?

 

[TallyT]

I probably shouldn't say this, but I can't resist... the ISU in its present format seem to have an absolute genius for working out exactly what the paying public do not want, jumping straight into it, and then wondering where said public and their money has got to. They've done it with the unfair judging and the unbalanced score system, they did it with the political favouritism, they did it with those idiot awards, they did it with ridiculous pricing, they are doing it now.

Going for paid livestreams in itself is not a bad idea (hell, Yuzuru is doing it and fans/the public are stumping up more than willingly) but only if and when you are in a position to offer something that enough people are going to want to pay for, and in the case of an international sport, that new people will be able to find and buy into. Maybe once it gets really up and running - like when the seniors go behind the paywall - they will offer clips of the best on youtube to attract interest.

 

[alexocfp]

To me, it sounds like a version of a chain letter...or maybe even a Ponzi scheme? Regardless of the analogy, I think it all comes down to a con game that won't win any new friends for figure skating, much less the ISU.

edit/new idea: Can figure skating file for divorce from the ISU?

I never understood why speed skating, short track speed skating and figure skating are under the same umbrella.

Speed/Short Track and Figure skating are 2 different sports entirely that need different sets of judges and have different rules.

Ice hockey is run by different folks than curling obviously.

There is nothing in either speed skating discipline that translates into figure skating.

 

[skatedreamer]

yikes. I just answered my own question from earlier about whether the USFSA had ever tried to push back or break away from the ISU. They didn't.

Many of you probably know this but for those who don't (or like me, had forgotten) there was sort of a figure skating mutiny against the ISU in the wake of the judging mess at the 2002 Olympics. The result was the short-lived World Skating Federation and involved several former ISU officials. Among other things, they proposed to continue using the 6.0 system instead of the ISU's.

The USFSA never really got behind the WSF, nor did any other federation. Anyone who did got a royal smackdown from the ISU. Here's a bit more history:

World Skating Federation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Dick Button was very much in favor of the WSF. Typically, he didn't hold back about his frustration with the ISU. From a WSF presser in 2003:

- YouTube

Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.

www.youtube.com

Dang, I miss that guy. And I pinky promise not go any further on this thread!

 

[yesterday]

Phew, suddenly things like the SkateAustria platform look really nice, reasonable and convenient

 

[moonvine]

For a person who is already a fan, it should be doable in most cases, but like someone said, I'm afraid new fans will be even more scarce as the options to encounter and fall in love with FS will become much more limited than currently. Looks like no more randomly suggested videos on YT because many would be paywalled...

This. Pure gold.

I'm doomed then. My country's TV has bought rights for GP, EC and WC in the last couple of years, and they believe it's a-okay to show some stuff through their livestream only, which doesn't get archived anywhere.

Uh, no? At least definitely not all countries in Europe. Mine has never bought TV rights for JWC. IDK about Eurosport but I've never seen it there, either, and JWC has always been non-geoblocked for me on ISU channel, which means noone has been buying the rights for junior events in my country for years.

The US has never, ever covered JWC

 

[beachmouse]

I never understood why speed skating, short track speed skating and figure skating are under the same umbrella.

Speed/Short Track and Figure skating are 2 different sports entirely that need different sets of judges and have different rules.

Individual sports that got lumped together for shared facilities reasons way back in the day. It’s not quite as bad as FINA, where one governing body covers water polo (whose most infamous match is known as ‘blood in the water’), artistic/synchronized swimming, pool diving, pool swimming, open water swimming and high/cliff diving because all of those operate in liquid water of some sort. On the other hand, FINA is generally good at keeping disciplines within their own lanes and doesn’t let the water polo committee write scoring rules for synchro.

As for curling, I think it’s the lack of skates that kept the ISU from trying to absorb it as it grew in global sporting prominence.

 

[alexocfp]

yikes. I just answered my own question from earlier about whether the USFSA had ever tried to push back or break away from the ISU. They didn't.

Many of you probably know this but for those who don't (or like me, had forgotten) there was sort of a figure skating mutiny against the ISU in the wake of the judging mess at the 2002 Olympics. The result was the short-lived World Skating Federation and involved several former ISU officials. Among other things, they proposed to continue using the 6.0 system instead of the ISU's.

The USFSA never really got behind the WSF, nor did any other federation. Anyone who did got a royal smackdown from the ISU. Here's a bit more history:

World Skating Federation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Dick Button was very much in favor of the WSF. Typically, he didn't hold back about his frustration with the ISU. From a WSF presser in 2003:

- YouTube

Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.

www.youtube.com

Dang, I miss that guy. And I pinky promise not go any further on this thread!

It looks like it got nowhere because it didn‘t have a lot of support in terms of major allies.

It also didn’t help that this sounded too unfocused, and there wasn’t any concrete evidence it would make the skaters lives better. You go with the devil you know.

Most importantly, it didn‘t have the financial muscle behind it. You get everyone’s attention with cold hard cash. CREAM. 200,000 dollars to fight the establishment is bringing a water gun to the battlefield.

One way their demise had a positive impact is that the new judging system came into being. The 6.0 system, no matter the nostalgia or propaganda, was garbage and was an albatross around the sport.

The new scoring system brought forth more on ice innovation in a decade than there were the previous 100 years combined.

I’m glad the days of someone winning a competition by leisurely skating around the rink for a minute because there were less requirements is gone. You have to be good and quick and athletic all 4 minutes to win in this era.

 

[alexocfp]

Individual sports that got lumped together for shared facilities reasons way back in the day. It’s not quite as bad as FINA, where one governing body covers water polo (whose most infamous match is known as ‘blood in the water’), artistic/synchronized swimming, pool diving, pool swimming, open water swimming and high/cliff diving because all of those operate in liquid water of some sort. On the other hand, FINA is generally good at keeping disciplines within their own lanes and doesn’t let the water polo committee write scoring rules for synchro.

As for curling, I think it’s the lack of skates that kept the ISU from trying to absorb it as it grew in global sporting prominence.

I love water polo. And as an Olympiacos supporter, I have seen a lot of success and trophies! And I used to work with someone who was either on the Serbian junior team or close to being on the team. Don’t remembe.

FINA definitely has too much on its plate as well. But swimming and water polo don‘t have artistic element. Fastest to the line or most goals wins.

I don’t follow diving or synchronized swimming so I can’t comment on the competency of the scoring or judging system.

 

[TallyT]

One way their demise had a positive impact is that the new judging system came into being. The 6.0 system, no matter the nostalgia or propaganda, was garbage and was an albatross around the sport.

Errrr, though I don't enjoy it in the old clips and would probably rather watch blowfly racing than 99% of skaters doing figures... 6.0, no matter the nostalgia or propaganda, had spectators. A spectator sport with no spectators can innovate all it likes in someone's backyard shed in midwinter rather than empty, expensive rinks.

But this is an old argument, and really whether the old skaters or the current crop are better is not the point of this thread, which is why the ISU seems to want to hide their sport, good or bad, away from the vulgar gaze of the hoi polloi.

 

[DoubleBass]

That's because what they were proposing was, by design, just another copy of the ISU (albeit improved from their perspective) and was doomed to fail right from the start.

What figure skating really needs is an entirely different league, not a federation, not a world federation, but a commercial league, designed not as an alternative to the ISU per se and it will not even directly compete with the ISU in fact, this league can be an elite league and will eventually head to a different direction, where's only the best of the best compete with each other, not limited to any quotas per country and they will represent not their country or a federation, but their own names/skating clubs etc.

What the NHL did to international championships and the Olympics in hockey, this league will do the same to ISU's figure skating WC and the Olympics, because as a commercial organization, it will naturally get rid of all the stupid rules and "brilliant ideas" the ISU has been implementing over the years, it will split the judging panel in half (those who score components and those who score tech) they will likely eventually implement an AI tech panel, even if it doesn't really work, just for the sake of creating a reputation that's at least striving for an unbiased judging system. It will get rid of the likes of "Zagitova rule" that forces the majority of layouts to be exactly the same for most skaters, as an example, the bottom line is it will keep improving year over year with one agenda in mind, popularity, making the sport more of a spectacle rather than trying to make sure federations keep paying you and are still somewhat interested in developing a sport in their countries.
$20-30k for winning a world championship is a joke for any sport, and figure skating deserves better than that, but I'm not surprised, 95% of the content the ISU provides is boring af

Many of you probably know this but for those who don't (or like me, had forgotten) there was sort of a figure skating mutiny against the ISU in the wake of the judging mess at the 2002 Olympics. The result was the short-lived World Skating Federation and involved several former ISU officials. Among other things, they proposed to continue using the 6.0 system instead of the ISU's.

The USFSA never really got behind the WSF, nor did any other federation. Anyone who did got a royal smackdown from the ISU. Here's a bit more history:

World Skating Federation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Dick Button was very much in favor of the WSF. Typically, he didn't hold back about his frustration with the ISU. From a WSF presser in 2003:

- YouTube

Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.

www.youtube.com

Dang, I miss that guy. And I pinky promise not go any further on this thread!

 

[TallyT]

That's because what they were proposing was, by design, just another copy of the ISU (albeit improved from their perspective) and was doomed to fail right from the start.

What figure skating really needs is an entirely different league, not a federation, not a world federation, but a commercial league, designed not as an alternative to the ISU per se and it will not even directly compete with the ISU in fact, this league can be an elite league and will eventually head to a different direction, where's only the best of the best compete with each other, not limited to any quotas per country and they will represent not their country or a federation, but their own names/skating clubs etc.

What the NHL did to international championships and the Olympics in hockey, this league will do the same to ISU's figure skating WC and the Olympics, because as a commercial organization, it will naturally get rid of all the stupid rules and "brilliant ideas" the ISU has been implementing over the years, it will split the judging panel in half (those who score components and those who score tech) they will likely eventually implement an AI tech panel, even if it doesn't really work, just for the sake of creating a reputation that's at least striving for an unbiased judging system. It will get rid of the likes of "Zagitova rule" that forces the majority of layouts to be exactly the same for most skaters, as an example, the bottom line is it will keep improving year over year with one agenda in mind, popularity, making the sport more of a spectacle rather than trying to make sure federations keep paying you and are still somewhat interested in developing a sport in their countries.
$20-30k for winning a world championship is a joke for any sport, and figure skating deserves better than that, but I'm not surprised, 95% of the content the ISU provides is boring af

So are you offering to fund this?

 

[alexocfp]

Errrr, though I don't enjoy it in the old clips and would probably rather watch blowfly racing than 99% of skaters doing figures... 6.0, no matter the nostalgia or propaganda, had spectators. A spectator sport with no spectators can innovate all it likes in someone's backyard shed in midwinter rather than empty, expensive rinks.

But this is an old argument, and really whether the old skaters or the current crop are better is not the point of this thread, which is why the ISU seems to want to hide their sport, good or bad, away from the vulgar gaze of the hoi polloi.

Some of the old events were held in small halls too. And a lot of the attendances in the USA were inflated for a while because of Nancy an pd Tanya and not the actual on ice product.

There are places in the world that get good attendances, it’s just not in the US anymore.

And the reason attendances grow is because of rivalries. Yes, Tanya vs Nancy was an outlier and I’m not saying one skater‘s goons should be clubbing their competitor, but figure skating needs to accentuate rivalries. And the skaters need to help by not giving stock answers to interview questions.

There is room for on ice competition drama and off ice passive aggressiveness.

The Medvedeva - Zagitova rivalry still makes for great tv, even after all these years.

 

[alexocfp]

So are you offering to fund this?

If you give me the winning lottery numbers this weekend, I‘ll win half a billion dollars and I’ll fund it. Haha

 

[DoubleBass]

So are you offering to fund this?

Let me make a few hundred million $ first lol, but yeah funding is the issue here, someone who is a figure skating fan and with enough money has to get behind this idea.

 

[alexocfp]

That's because what they were proposing was, by design, just another copy of the ISU (albeit improved from their perspective) and was doomed to fail right from the start.

What figure skating really needs is an entirely different league, not a federation, not a world federation, but a commercial league, designed not as an alternative to the ISU per se and it will not even directly compete with the ISU in fact, this league can be an elite league and will eventually head to a different direction, where's only the best of the best compete with each other, not limited to any quotas per country and they will represent not their country or a federation, but their own names/skating clubs etc.

What the NHL did to international championships and the Olympics in hockey, this league will do the same to ISU's figure skating WC and the Olympics, because as a commercial organization, it will naturally get rid of all the stupid rules and "brilliant ideas" the ISU has been implementing over the years, it will split the judging panel in half (those who score components and those who score tech) they will likely eventually implement an AI tech panel, even if it doesn't really work, just for the sake of creating a reputation that's at least striving for an unbiased judging system. It will get rid of the likes of "Zagitova rule" that forces the majority of layouts to be exactly the same for most skaters, as an example, the bottom line is it will keep improving year over year with one agenda in mind, popularity, making the sport more of a spectacle rather than trying to make sure federations keep paying you and are still somewhat interested in developing a sport in their countries.
$20-30k for winning a world championship is a joke for any sport, and figure skating deserves better than that, but I'm not surprised, 95% of the content the ISU provides is boring af

All great ideas, have no good reason why there is a Zagitova rule or the Axel is mandatory. The free skate should be truly free as well.

The ISU is a pretty conservative and slow moving organization.
I mean, you don’t even need to know anything about their sports, just look at their website. Look at what their speed skating or short track speed skating world championship results pages looks like. It’s a disaster and a half.

 

[TallyT]

Of course you do realise that this imaginary rich philanthropist setting up these wonderful competitions may not agree with you - or me for that matter - as to what would bring in the punters? They might love the Zagitova rule and axels. And hate quadmeisters, or ice dance, or teenage artistic emoting, or whatever.