2014 Worlds - Short Dance

[DaveT]

You didn't answer the question:

All the top teams got higher PCS than Sochi, like W/P and especially C/L. Did you think C/L's marks or W/P's weren't deserved? They were higher than in Sochi. What are your reasons for W/P and C/L getting higher PCS than in Sochi?

Because they performed better here, it's not rocket science.

 

[hyperinflation]

See, you just said it yourself! According to you, C/L skated the cleanest they ever had, so their huge PCS boost was deserved.

Yet, I/K skated the best they ever had up until the twizzles (better than Sochi), so their PCS should surely receive a huge boost like C/L if they nailed the twizzles. (ie. by 1-2 points). They messed up the twizzles, and therefore they didn't get the PCS boost that they would have if they had done the twizzles perfectly. So whereas the judges were going to give them a 38-38.5 for a clean performance, they lowered a few points back to around 36.

talking to you is giving me angina

someone post andrew poje pictures to calm me down

 

[Matt K]

For one, they all improved and didn't have a major, glaring error (C/B maybe not but nothing grievous).

Because they performed better here, it's not rocket science.

EXACTLY!!! That's what I'm saying.


I/K skated the best they ever had up until the twizzles (better than Sochi), so their PCS should surely receive a huge boost like C/L if they nailed the twizzles. (ie. by 1-2 points). They messed up the twizzles, and therefore they didn't get the PCS boost that they would have if they had done the twizzles perfectly. So whereas the judges were going to give them a 38-38.5 for a clean performance, they lowered a few points back to around 36.

 

[Snow63]

Oh, stop it already. Results are in the protocols and nothing's gonna change them.

You do not know how much their PCS would be with clean skate, so you do not know how much points they have lost. Let's just leave it at that

 

[nowkissplease]

See, you just said it yourself! According to you, C/L skated the cleanest they ever had, so their huge PCS boost was deserved.

Yet, I/K skated the best they ever had up until the twizzles (better than Sochi), so their PCS should surely receive a huge boost like C/L if they nailed the twizzles. (ie. by 1-2 points). They messed up the twizzles, and therefore they didn't get the PCS boost that they would have if they had done the twizzles perfectly. So whereas the judges were going to give them a 38-38.5 for a clean performance, they lowered a few points back to around 36.

That...makes no sense. Clean skates get a boost in PCS, because a clean skate makes a much better impression. I/K didn't have a clean skate. They had a "oh this is great...wait *** just happened" skate.

 

[hyperinflation]

videos: http://fsnews.ru/forums-m-posts-q-1000-d-30.html

 

[Matt K]

That...makes no sense. Clean skates get a boost in PCS, because a clean skate makes a much better impression. I/K didn't have a clean skate. They had a "oh this is great...wait *** just happened" skate.

Judges judge the whole program (all elements), not only one element.

 

[elif]

Why Sinitsina wants to skate with Katsalapov?

 

[gmyers]

Just end your haterade presence here already. They have an Olympic gold and bronze. What the hell do you have?

My "haterade presence"? is that a joke? The point was about I/k not being consistent enough to ever warrant expectation of routine success.

 

[gmyers]

Judges judge the whole program (all elements), not only one element.

This is so true!! PCS is not a bonus for good tes! Pcs is not a clean tech program bonus!

 

[TMC]

Feast yourselves on the Andrew Poje behind: http://www.theprovince.com/sports/cms/binary/9377246.jpg?size=620x400s

Mrs. P you're like the nanny or mother figure in this forum who always knows exactly what to post to calm your unruly kids (teenagers?) down

 

[nowkissplease]

Judges judge the whole program (all elements), not only one element.

And big mistakes affect the impression of the whole program. Whatever, this is pointless, I'm glad your team did well clearly they are very important to you good luck in the FD

 

[gmyers]

That...makes no sense. Clean skates get a boost in PCS, because a clean skate makes a much better impression. I/K didn't have a clean skate. They had a "oh this is great...wait *** just happened" skate.

So did the judes violate the rules? what should their pcs had been? All 5.00?

 

[Mrs. P]

Mrs. P you're like the nanny or mother figure in this forum who always knows exactly what to post to calm your unruly kids (teenagers?) down

Aw, thanks. Let's hope I actually know what I'm doing when I actually get around to having an actual child! (Cats don't count. )

Here's something fun: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Med2XipHJJM

 

[Kutien]

1 Anna CAPPELLINI / Luca LANOTTE ITA 69.70 1 video
2 Kaitlyn WEAVER / Andrew POJE CAN 69.20 2 video
3 Nathalie PECHALAT / Fabian BOURZAT FRA 68.20 3 video
4 Madison CHOCK / Evan BATES USA 67.71 4 video
5 Elena ILINYKH / Nikita KATSALAPOV RUS 65.67 5 video
6 Maia SHIBUTANI / Alex SHIBUTANI USA 63.55 6 video
7 Nelli ZHIGANSHINA / Alexander GAZSI GER 62.27 7 video
8 Victoria SINITSINA / Ruslan ZHIGANSHIN RUS 62.11 8 video
9 Penny COOMES / Nicholas BUCKLAND GBR 61.21 9 video
10 Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIER CAN 59.42 10 video
11 Alexandra PAUL / Mitchell ISLAM CAN 57.68 11 video
12 Julia ZLOBINA / Alexei SITNIKOV AZE 57.01 12 video
13 Isabella TOBIAS / Deividas STAGNIUNAS LTU 55.37 13 video
14 Cathy REED / Chris REED JPN 55.18 14 video
15 Gabriella PAPADAKIS / Guillaume CIZERON FRA 55.11 15
16 Sara HURTADO / Adria DIAZ ESP 55.06 16
17 Charlene GUIGNARD / Marco FABBRI ITA 53.98 17 video
18 Alexandra ALDRIDGE / Daniel EATON USA 53.34 18 video
19 Alisa AGAFONOVA / Alper UCAR TUR 53.07 19 video
20 Irina SHTORK / Taavi RAND EST 53.03 20 video
DNQ
21 Tanja KOLBE / Stefano CARUSO GER 52.08 21
22 Justyna PLUTOWSKA / Peter GERBER POL 51.99 22
23 Federica TESTA / Lukas CSOLLEY SVK 51.56 23
24 Danielle OBRIEN / Gregory MERRIMAN AUS 51.06 24 video
25 Ramona ELSENER / Florian ROOST SUI 50.64 25 video
26 Henna LINDHOLM / Ossi KANERVO FIN 50.61 26 video
27 Gabriela KUBOVA / Matej NOVAK CZE 50.43 27
28 Dora TUROCZI / Balazs MAJOR HUN 48.49 28
29 Laurence FOURNIER BEAUDRY / Nikolaj SORENSEN DEN 48.46 29 video
30 Allison REED / Vasili ROGOV ISR 46.05 30
31 Angelina TELEGINA / Otar JAPARIDZE GEO 42.85 31
32 Viktoria KAVALIOVA / Yurii BIELIAIEV BLR 41.08 32 video

 

[Matt K]

And big mistakes affect the impression of the whole program. Whatever, this is pointless, I'm glad your team did well clearly they are very important to you good luck in the FD

Judges don't judge one big mistake. They judge the entire program, and a program has several other required elements. They look at the whole program to gauge the impression of the whole program. Twizzles are one element out of several.

 

[Kittosuni]

Can i/k or the shibs overtake the top 3 if they skate clean?

 

[gmyers]

And big mistakes affect the impression of the whole program. Whatever, this is pointless, I'm glad your team did well clearly they are very important to you good luck in the FD

Pcs is not about Tes. It just isn't! There is no rule yet about reductions in pcs for mistakes in Tes!

 

[Snow63]

Can i/k or the shibs overtake the top 3 if they skate clean?

Too many factors, but yes I/K still have chances.

 

[sisinka]

I/K's twizzles did not score a single point. Zero. 0.

So if they had done it properly, it would be an additional 7-8 points in TES alone. Add to that a few points PCS they lost because of that error, and their score would be close to 75. So close to what they did in Sochi.

Before that twizzle happened, every single element was exquisite.

And how about element after it, a lift WAS affected by that mistake, but they got the same points like they did at the Olympics. And interuption in skating was obvious...but judges once again didn't take it into account at all in components.

I&K comparison:
Worlds SP:
Rotational lift - 3 3 1 2 2 2 2 2 2 5.07

Skating Skills: 9.50 9.50 8.25 9.25 9.25 9.00 9.00 9.50 9.00 9.21
Transitions: 9.25 9.50 8.25 9.25 8.75 8.50 8.75 9.50 8.75 8.96
Performance: 8.75 9.75 8.00 9.00 9.00 8.25 9.50 9.25 8.50 8.89
Choreography: 9.50 9.50 8.50 9.25 9.00 8.75 9.25 9.25 9.25 9.18
Interpretation/Timing: 9.50 9.50 8.50 9.50 9.25 8.50 9.50 9.50 9.00 9.25
Overall 36.45

Olympics SP:
Rotational lift - 2 2 2 3 2 2 2 2 3 5.07

Skating Skills: 9.00 9.25 9.50 9.25 9.00 9.25 9.25 9.25 9.00 9.18
Transitions: 9.00 8.50 9.25 9.50 8.50 9.00 9.00 9.00 8.50 8.89
Performance: 9.25 9.00 9.75 9.50 8.75 9.25 9.50 9.25 9.00 9.25
Choreography: 9.50 8.50 9.50 9.50 8.75 9.50 9.00 9.50 9.25 9.29
Interpretation/Timing: 9.00 9.00 9.50 9.50 9.00 9.50 9.25 9.25 9.00 9.21
Overall 36.68

Looking at marks judges think that component score was not affected at all by mistake in twizzles and loosing a connection to music after that mistake didn’t affect components as well. They think that I&K program was as succusfull like at the Olympics. Surprising.

P&B got exactly the same components like at the Olympics – 36.35.
C&L improved their components score from 34.73 to 35.93…mainly in Interpretation, Performance and also in Choreography.
W&P improved also from 35.00 to 35.70…small improvement in every component.
S&Z components improved from 27.58 to 29.18 being out of Russia… Skating Skills also behind Chock, Shibutanis, Coomes, Gilles…and we are talking about second or best couple (with I&K) in Skating Skills component…even Penny with her little jump during opening turn in first Finnstep section has better SS than S&Z in judge‘s opinion (Penny’s little jump was perfectly seen in slow motion).

From top 20 only Gilles & Poirier in twizzles, Aldredge & Eaton in lift, Agafonova & Ucar, Shtork & Rand, Kolbe & Caruso in Finnstep got minus GOE. I&K are the only team who made big mistake, they are the only team who missed whole element and judges still keeps them on the fifth place? Especially in SD with only 5 elements, so every element is extremely important looking at level and GOE.

Why to compete than…we have another Chan with three falls and Hanyu with two fall to win – in terms of Ice Dance? Why? Skating Skills and GOE on elements are the main weapons for this team, they have great Skating Skills. But other aspects in Ice Dance – Timing, Interpretation of the music, Transitions, close holds, difficulty in non elements, choreography connected with music – this couple is missing. And in moment when their main weapons fall down with one missed element – they still get extremely high score? Why?