2016 Skate America Ladies SP

[yuki]

I am truly disgusted by these nasty and rude comments about Ashley's programs. If it's not to your taste, feel free to say so. However, to compare her to a stripper, table-dancer, etc., is not only false, but your attempts to insult and degrade a world-class skater by comparing her to these types of dancers under the assumption that these dancers are "cheap" and untalented is also offensive.

Agreed.

It's funny how it's ONLY people online who are bitter about Ashley getting higher scores than their faves are the ones who dislike Ashley's programs when audiences all over the world give her standing ovations when she skates clean.

Does it count if I disliked the program before her scores were announced? (and I really like Ashley in general)

 

[yuki]

Agree. And even though that happens to be one of my favorite songs, this version got on my nerves. I felt like I was at a bad disco. I honestly hated this program. I loved her short last year-so unique and also fun.

Loved her short last year too, this feels like a not-nearly-as-good rehash. Maybe it will improve as the season goes on.

 

[qwertyskates]

Couldn't stay up all night to watch so here's my delayed impression:

I used to dislike Ashley's performances for the over-acting but this SP is just so strong and expressive without ANY facial acting but just her pronounced body movements in making the music's rhythm pop, plus really staccato precise technical elements, all coming together in a complete package...don't like the sexy distracting costume though, she would have done much better without baring so much skin for such a powerful, mature piece of music.

Btw, I am so omnivorous I'm open to any genre, even Disco, as long as it's not insulting to one's intelligence!

Mao is ALL-WOMAN now and I just wish the PCS would catch up with the impressive technical scores from the younger skaters these days so she and Patrick will get a stab at surpassing the Mais of this world.

Mai is sweet and truly ambitious for her age and such a strong debut but I find her just going through the paces without throwing herself into her program.

Gracie completely suits this Tango, she owns this genre, though there's just too much "floor action" in this piece. I really miss her Gershwin 3 Violins, and hope that she steps back into that when she goes for something else apart from the tangos.

Congrats to Daleman, still find her jump positions scarier than Kovtun's but she's a hard, dedicated worker and deserves her achievements.

 

[bartlebooth]

Ashley reminds me of what William Wyler said about Humphrey Bogart: "As an actor he obviously had limitations -- his range was not that great, but within his range he was the best around".
Subtlety is not her thing, but she capitalizes on her strengths AND she has come a long way in working on her technical shortcomings (two-footings for example). I admire her a lot.

 

[Yatagarasu]

It's funny how it's ONLY people online who are bitter about Ashley getting higher scores than their faves are the ones who dislike Ashley's programs when audiences all over the world give her standing ovations when she skates clean.

Yes, because those are the ONLY people who think she was over-scored

Audiences are the true measure of how good someone was in this sport. I agree. Absolutely. I mean don't you think it's time to get rid of those judges too then? And when they give a standing ovation to other skaters, as they do, we'll just roll the dice to break that tie.

 

[berry8]

I agree with @andromache: I am feeling disconsolate after having read these comments...
Wagner was the best yesterday night and nobody can call that into question...

Asada got the second highest PCS: she should be glad since she did not perform a 3-3 :thumbsup:

 

[piona]

your attempts to insult and degrade a world-class skater by comparing her to these types of dancers under the assumption that these dancers are "cheap" and untalented is also offensive.

The problem is, Äshley is not a world-class skater. She is just some overrated middle-class athlet who is hyped, because Murrica has no other who can take challange with Russia, Korea or Japan.

 

[solani]

Yes, because those are the ONLY people who think she was over-scored

Audiences are the true measure of how good someone was in this sport. I agree. Absolutely. I mean don't you think it's time to get rid of those judges too then? And when they give a standing ovation to other skaters, as they do, we'll just roll the dice to break that tie.

Judges are immensely influenced by the crowd's reaction in the arena, we shouldn't forget that. So the crowd's reaction does boost Ashley's score.

 

[berry8]

The problem is, Äshley is not a world-class skater. She is just some overrated middle-class athlet who is hyped, because Murrica has no other who can take challange with Russia, Korea or Japan.

Well, American field (ladies wise) is very weak.
That however doesn't mean Wagner is not a world-class skater.
:shocked: She performed at WC -> that alone makes Wagner a world-class skater.

 

[qwertyskates]

Agreed that Kanako's score was crushing, especially for PCS, but she looked nervous even before her performance and she didn't have enough "Carmen" in her, it looks like a POTO type of skating, and her technicals were nowhere as strong for this SP.

In a way, I'm glad that reputation counts for less now, and judging is more objective, but also sad that this means farewell for some of my favourites.

Much as I appreciate Ashley's SP, I still don't think it should beat a clean Mao if their Techs are equivalent in score.

 

[deneuved]

Yes, because those are the ONLY people who think she was over-scored

Audiences are the true measure of how good someone was in this sport. I agree. Absolutely. I mean don't you think it's time to get rid of those judges too then? And when they give a standing ovation to other skaters, as they do, we'll just roll the dice to break that tie.

Do I have to remind you that the judges come from different countries and cultures? They probably don't sit together before the competition and say "oh, let's give Ashley way more in PCS than she deserves". So they liked her programme - and gave her high marks according to THEIR professional expertise, and not one or two of them, but all (or most) of them. Are you a judge? I guess you aren't. You're absolutely free to give your own opinion, but other people, more qualified, decided about the outcome yesterday. I liked it. I don't always. Hell, I mostly don't. But to decide that someone does not deserve the points he/she gets, is not up to you.

 

[Yatagarasu]

Judges are immensely influenced by the crowd's reaction in the arena, we shouldn't forget that. So the crowd's reaction does boost Ashley's score.

In part, for sure but they are still judges. Or we can indeed dispense with them completely because what's the point?

What ticks me off in posts like the one before and the previous ones isn't in particular what happened. It does in the US, here or in Boston because overinflation for the home skater isn't new and it isn't limited just to Americans, far from it. What's annoying is that there are a million and one ways to justify when it happens in the US and when it happens somewhere else, it's the vile French or the evil Russians and it's all morally repugnant and followed by months of the same. Hypocrisy of the worst order.

And yes, Ashley was overscored here, you can all chant USA USA USA and wave those flags all you like, we're not all blind and in love with her, let's say quite particular type of performance. It's not as dazzling as you think it is that we forget to look at her feet.

But to decide that someone does not deserve the points he/she gets, is not up to you.

Actually this being a discussion forum, I am allowed to disagree. I know, I know. Shock, horror, how dare I say the American girl got overscored. They would never. Never! And when those qualified people were making those decisions in Sochi you all loved them there. Or some previous ones, that you didn't scream about ... etc etc etc Hypocrisy of the worst kind.

 

[andromache]

The problem is, Äshley is not a world-class skater. She is just some overrated middle-class athlet who is hyped, because Murrica has no other who can take challange with Russia, Korea or Japan.

Then why do international judges continue to support her?

If you don't have have insightful criticisms to make and you're just here to troll and spout off hate, you're probably better off not posting at all.

 

[ancientpeas]

At the risk of sounding rude I wish we would not refer to women as strippers and prostitutes because they are not afraid to be more sensual than balletic or pretty on the ice. It rings of **** shaming to me. I personally didn't find Ashley performance sexualized and I'm not sure what people saw that I didn't.

I have danced more provocatively than Ashley and I certainly didn't think I was behaving like a stripper mostly because I wasn't soliciting money for the purpose of eliciting a sexual response.

I think if you choose music that is sexual like Sweet Dreams then you perform with the music not around it. If she'd been pelvic thrusting to the Nutcracker Suite then that would seem odd but Sweet Dreams is about the nature and complexity of sexual relationships and getting what you need while giving someone else what they want as well.

It is like when someone does a really tame Tango. The Tango was banned for a reason. If it's not hot then you doing it wrong and should probably choose a different piece of music.

 

[andromache]

In part, for sure but they are still judges. Or we can indeed dispense with them completely because what's the point?

What ticks me off in posts like the one before and the previous ones isn't in particular what happened. It does in the US, here or in Boston because overinflation for the home skater isn't new and it isn't limited just to Americans, far from it. What's annoying is that there are a million and one ways to justify when it happens in the US and when it happens somewhere else, it's the vile French or the evil Russians and it's all morally repugnant and followed by months of the same. Hypocrisy of the worst order.

And yes, Ashley was overscored here, you can all chant USA USA USA and wave those flags all you like, we're not all blind and in love with her, let's say quite particular type of performance. It's not as dazzling as you think it is that we forget to look at her feet.

Really? All I see are people complaining about evil Americans. :confused2:

Overscoring happens in just about every venue. Part of skating is having the luck to skate well in front of a home crowd.

The level of discourse would much higher and far more enjoyable if people stopped complaining about overscoring, acknowledged that it happens to everyone, and moved on.

 

[piona]

:shocked: She performed at WC -> that alone makes Wagner a world-class skater.

_
Well,at the wc were skaters who were more swimming on ice than skating. So this argument is not valid.
see the list https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_World_Figure_Skating_Championships

 

[Barb]

At the risk of sounding rude I wish we would not refer to women as strippers and prostitutes because they are not afraid to be more sensual than balletic or pretty on the ice. It rings of **** shaming to me. I personally didn't find Ashley performance sexualized and I'm not sure what people saw that I didn't.

I have danced more provocatively than Ashley and I certainly didn't think I was behaving like a stripper mostly because I wasn't soliciting money for the purpose of eliciting a sexual response.

I think if you choose music that is sexual like Sweet Dreams then you perform with the music not around it. If she'd been pelvic thrusting to the Nutcracker Suite then that would seem odd but Sweet Dreams is about the nature and complexity of sexual relationships and getting what you need while giving someone else what they want as well.

It is like when someone does a really tame Tango. The Tango was banned for a reason. If it's not hot then you doing it wrong and should probably choose a different piece of music.

what do you mean?

 

[ancientpeas]

Wow. You really don't think Ashley is a world class skater. I do so I respectfully disagree with you but I would definitely put her in that upper tier. Her under-rotations are worrisome but other than I find her entertaining and a fun part of the ladies field. My favourite recent lady was Kim Yuna so I wouldn't say Ashley is my style of skater but I do think she has value.

 

[Yatagarasu]

Overscoring happens in just about every venue. Part of skating is having the luck to skate well in front of a home crowd.

So you are saying Ashley was overscored here? Just for the record?

 

[piona]

Then why do international judges continue to support her?

To make America great again, why else?