News, views & results from Skate Detroit 2007

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I dunno, she went into her 3Lz + 3T with barely any speed at all as well.

I dunno either. She may be just a overly cautious gal at this tender age.

 

[Mysticchic]

Go Chloe! I loved her and her partner in pairs at Nats last year. Does anyone know if she's still skating pairs too?

She did skate pairs. And It's early in the season for Tommy and Megan.

 

[mskater93]

I dunno either. She may be just a overly cautious gal at this tender age.

the 3Lo is supposed to be 3Lo/3Lo (she did it at Skate Milwaukee and got credit).

 

[blackrose050]

I think I'm more impressed with Angela Maxwell than Dee Dee Leng at this point. Her jumps in that FS clip look awesome.

 

[ks777]

I think I'm more impressed with Angela Maxwell than Dee Dee Leng at this point. Her jumps in that FS clip look awesome.

I was thinking the same thing, I am not that impressed with Dee Dee right now but am really impressed with Angela Maxwell. Her 3toe/3toe looks so easy.

 

[childfreegirl]

I was thinking the same thing, I am not that impressed with Dee Dee right now but am really impressed with Angela Maxwell. Her 3toe/3toe looks so easy.

I was really impressed with her at Mids last year. I met her and got her autograph and talked with her a little bit. She's as nice in person as her skating is.

 

[Mysticchic]

Here are a few more videos
Osadolo Irowa Jr Mens fs. He landed a wonderful 3a in warm up
http://youtube.com/watch?v=tAFZq_JsUpU
Rohene Ward SP Sr Men's
http://youtube.com/watch?v=-pUEei6Vw_0

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Here are a few more videos
Osadolo Irowa Jr Mens fs. He landed a wonderful 3a in warm up
http://youtube.com/watch?v=tAFZq_JsUpU
Rohene Ward SP Sr Men's
http://youtube.com/watch?v=-pUEei6Vw_0

After watching Ward's SP (forget the booboos) I can only say, if you have no idea what I mean by body language, you have no idea what originality and musicality is all about, and totally blind to artistry, imo. However, I do understand your desire to see four rotations in the air by a World Champion with a stone face, and landing on one foot as being the only thing that matters, well..... so be it.

Joe

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Just took a look at Osadola Irowa (that's his name, I didn't make it up)

He has perfect body for ballet, figure skating and Bourne movies. The version of Malaguena he used was, imo, dreadful. His choreography was ok. His booboos were tiremsome

There is talent there and I would suggest he get himself to Frank Carroll soon.

Joe

 

[oleada]

I think I'm more impressed with Angela Maxwell than Dee Dee Leng at this point. Her jumps in that FS clip look awesome.

I would have to agree. Her jumps are gorgeous - her double axel is absolutely great. She seems to have more speed as well.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

How old is Angela Maxwell?

 

[Mathman]

I would have to agree. Her jumps are gorgeous - her double axel is absolutely great. She seems to have more speed as well.

But in terms of potential, we have to consider their ages. Leng is 13 and Maxwell is 15. In fact, Angela's 15th birthday was yesterday. :birthday: So Leng has plenty of time to catch up.

ETA: Oops -- I just saw Joes question. Angela was 15 yesterday and Deedee turned 13 this past January.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

But in terms of potential, we have to consider their ages. Leng is 13 and Maxwell is 15. In fact, Angela's 15th birthday was yesterday. :birthday: So Leng has plenty of time to catch up.

ETA: Oops -- I just saw Joes question. Angela was 15 yesterday and Deedee turned 13 this past January.

Thanks MM and that does explain a lot. Regardless of what we say about sports, age plays a big role.

Joe

 

[GoldMedalist]

There is talent there and I would suggest he get himself to Frank Carroll soon.

If only we all had the money.

 

[Mysticchic]

I'm a huge Rohene fan. I even got to meet him yesterday. He even gave me permission to post his skate. As did all the skaters that I taped and am posting. Dee Dee and Angela are both sweethearts.
Osadola has a great future. He landed everything in the warm ups. Huge 3A in both.
William Brewster, 2nd in Jr Men FS, 2nd overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JZor8NzICuM

William Nottingham, 3rd in Jr Men FS, 5th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=U3l-uDMaNCc

Osadolo Irowa, 4th in Jr Men FS, 4th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=tAFZq_JsUpU


Christopher Darling, 5th in Jr Men FS, 3rd overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_V0GuyRR2ec

Dane Carter, 6th in Jr Men FS, 6th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ceBPmXr58HY

Severin Kiefer (AUT), 11th in Jr Men FS, 10th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Uq4AGbbPjMQ

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I'm a huge Rohene fan. I even got to meet him yesterday. He even gave me permission to post his skate. As did all the skaters that I taped and am posting. Dee Dee and Angela are both sweethearts.
Osadola has a great future. He landed everything in the warm ups. Huge 3A in both.
William Brewster, 2nd in Jr Men FS, 2nd overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JZor8NzICuM

William Nottingham, 3rd in Jr Men FS, 5th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=U3l-uDMaNCc

Osadolo Irowa, 4th in Jr Men FS, 4th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=tAFZq_JsUpU


Christopher Darling, 5th in Jr Men FS, 3rd overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_V0GuyRR2ec

Dane Carter, 6th in Jr Men FS, 6th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ceBPmXr58HY

Severin Kiefer (AUT), 11th in Jr Men FS, 10th overall:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Uq4AGbbPjMQ

Thanks very much Mysticchic. These tapes made my Sunday afternoon.

All the boys are not quite Senior calibre but they do have some excellent moves within their routines.

Brewster was technically impressive and he had good choreography but it looked like his arms were dictated by the choreographer.

Nottingham (had two tapes). The first had music that overwhelmed him but the second, if it was him, he was extremely musical'

I enjoyed them all. There is a good competitive spirit among these fellows and it looks promising when they hit Seniors.

Joe

 

[ElFuego]

Can you imagine a skater taking off on a slight forward inside edge, rotating 3 times in the air and landing on the opposite foot in a back outside edge. That would not even be scored as an attempted axel as a flutz would. Only the flutz gets the ok.

Joe

I can't imagine it because it wouldn't happen. If a skater took off on a FORWARD inside edge, rotated 3 times in the air, then they would land on a FORWARD edge.

If a skater took off from a forward inside edge and rotated 3.5 times to land on a back outside edge, then someone ought to give them bonus points because that would be an "Inside Axel," (and it is a legal jump) and it would be extremely difficult (I don't think anyone has even ever done a double inside axel, let alone a triple).

 

[Sylvia]

Nottingham (had two tapes). The first had music that overwhelmed him but the second, if it was him, he was extremely musical'

The second skater after Nottingham's FS ( http://youtube.com/watch?v=U3l-uDMaNCc ) is the "missing" FS of the event's winner, Grant Hochstein, who scored 107.70 points and landed 6 triples and two 2axels (he's been working hard to develop the musical side of his skating for the past few seasons).

Hochstein and Brewster both competed in the junior men's event at 2007 U.S. Nationals, placing 12th and 13th, respectively. Dane Carter was the 2007 U.S. Intermediate Men's silver medalist (looks like he is considering bypassing the Novice level to move up to Junior?). Austria's Severin Kiefer competed on the JGP last season.

 

[gkelly]

If a skater took off from a forward inside edge and rotated 3.5 times to land on a back outside edge, then someone ought to give them bonus points because that would be an "Inside Axel," (and it is a legal jump) and it would be extremely difficult (I don't think anyone has even ever done a double inside axel, let alone a triple).

It's not a listed jump (one-foot axel is, i.e., landing a regular axel on the takeoff foot instead of the opposite foot, but inside axel, taking off forward from the usual landing foot, is not). I think it should be, with point value higher than a regular axel of comparable revolutions, but that's just me. Same for double walleys.

I have seen a few rare double inside axels, but not good ones. I think Julie-Lynn Holmes did one in her freeskate ca. 1969 or 1970. And Elvis Stojko did one (with a two-footed takeoff) at 1993 Worlds -- should be fairly easy to find a video of that although it's not on youtube.

However, I suspect that what Joe was referring to was a CCW jumper changing edge on the LFO takeoff of a regular axel to take off from the LFI edge. It wouldn't happen, especially with a triple, because it would cause the jump to rotate against the takeoff edge, thus making it much harder instead of easier to generate rotation.

A better analogy might be a (triple) axel that skids around so much on the takeoff that the skater has essentially skidded through a three turn before leaving the ice and takes off from a back inside edge (and rotates three times and lands on the back outside of the other foot). At what point do you stop considering it a bad triple axel and call it a (bad) triple salchow instead?

A few years ago I could have given you a good example of how to turn a single axel into a single salchow by rotating in the skid.

The whole point of a lutz is that it takes off from an edge that travels counter to the direction of rotation, which is what makes it difficult, and difficult to do correctly.

There really aren't any other jumps commonly performed with multiple revolutions that have that feature -- toe walley does, but it's officially considered the same as a toe loop both for points and for counting repeated jumps. If they were considered different, with different point values, then I'm sure we'd see similar debates over intended toe walleys that ended up taking off from back outside instead of back inside edge.

Or suppose that double walleys (no toe assist) were given a point value (considerably more than double loop, I would hope -- maybe more than double axel) and started to be used in programs, and even triple walleys became thinkable. If a skater set up for a double walley with the usual edge change and free foot behind but then changed edge again and actually took off from the back outside edge, that would make the jump a double loop after all, albeit with a difficult approach and air position. At a certain point that mistake would probably have to be called as a loop, but if the blade rocked over while the skater was already in the process of leaving the ice so there was no weight on it, it would probably just be considered a lower quality walley.

 

[Mathman]

A better analogy might be a (triple) axel that skids around so much on the takeoff that the skater has essentially skidded through a three turn before leaving the ice and takes off from a back inside edge (and rotates three times and lands on the back outside of the other foot). At what point do you stop considering it a bad triple axel and call it a (bad) triple salchow instead?

Would Lysacek's triple Axel be an example of this?

Great post as usual. :yes: