Polina Edmunds withdraws from 4CC | Page 5 | Golden Skate

Polina Edmunds withdraws from 4CC

MoonlightSkater

On the Ice
Joined
May 17, 2011
Skates are not exactly interchangeable all of the time. Each pair, even if made on the same lasts and with the same specifications, might be slightly different. For athletes who depend on the connection between their foot, boot, and blade, switching back and forth between boots can hinder training. So, even if they begin the break in process on a second pair of boots, that doesn't mean that they will be ready right away. Also, boots can take a few months between the time a custom order is placed and being ready. Then you heat mold, get new blades mounted, and try them out. Hopefully everything works. Sometimes it doesn't (see Karen Chen and her 14 pairs of boots at the beginning of the season). Add to this the fact that younger skaters like Polina are still growing, and that custom boots can cost upwards of $650 a pair (I use custom Reidells because I have unusual feet) and blades can cost upwards $550 a set, and that some skaters go through four pairs in a year (others only one), and the costs and variables can be significant. Ordering eight pairs of boots per year could cost more than $10,000.

For a young skater like Polina, especially, I can't see that it would make sense to have more than two pairs at a time, likely your recent pair and the one you are breaking in, because your feet are still growing. It is entirely possible Polina's feet grew this winter and she needed new skates.

Also, given that it can be very difficult to peak more than once per season, it makes sense to me that skaters want to focus on worlds. Peaking for a competition can involve a months-long plan of rest, conditioning, skill training, run-throughs, and tapering, in that order. Even doing a shorter peak schedule of a week of rest, a couple weeks of conditioning, a couple weeks of run-throughs, and a week of tapering takes at least a month and a half. I can see how skaters would find it hard to fit 4CCs into their schedule if the season isn't going perfectly. There are whole books written about peaking for figure skating. Most present a year-long plan to peak for one competition. Elite skaters who need to peak for nationals and worlds already have a tall order in that they need to be at their best twice in a year.
 

Moxiejan

Medalist
Joined
Jan 11, 2014
Country
United-States
One backup pair is one thing. (And in the case of Mirai at Nats, it was her backup pair that split. Her non-backup pair was on its last legs, so to speak.)

"Several next pairs" is another thing.

ETA:

If money were no object, your notion of "several next pairs" would make sense.
But money is an issue. Another wise adage is: "Every little bit counts."​

If money is that tight, it's especially important to not miss important competitions that might lead to better support/funding.
Make two pairs of competition-ready skates the No. 1 priority, even if it means borrowing dresses every season.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
If money is that tight, it's especially important to not miss important competitions that might lead to better support/funding.
Make two pairs of competition-ready skates the No. 1 priority, even if it means borrowing dresses every season.

LOL, happy that you have backtracked from your original grandiose notion of "several next pairs."

I never questioned the idea of one back-up pair.

ETA, regarding funding, in the case of Polina:

- She already has qualified for Tier 1 of Envelope B funding from USFS for next season.
- To qualify for Tier 2 of Envelope A funding, she must place in the top ten at Worlds -- or she needed to win Four Continents.
- To qualify for Tier 1 of Envelope A funding, she must place in the top five at Worlds.
http://www.usfigureskating.org/Athletes.asp?id=350

So from that standpoint, it is quite reasonable for her to concentrate on Worlds, given her boot issues.​
 
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sabinfire

Doing the needful
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 30, 2014
But not competing at Four Continents is not the same thing as "taking months off."

The non-injured skaters are using the extra time to concentrate on training. How is that "taking months off?"

"Funny" how no one (AFAIK) has accused Yuzuru of taking months off.

I'm not too worried about Yuzuru's competitive shape heading into Worlds.

He has more medals this season than total events that Polina or Ashley have attended so far... :disapp:
 

MK's Winter

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 9, 2009
But for the Russians they are a bit lucky this year cuz the three events you mention are all in Europe, they don't have to suffer from long-haul travel and severe jet-lag for a day or two like other skaters from Asia or North America.

True but there is still travel to be considered. They have their Nationals like a week and half after the GPF. I did note that it should be evenly spread (the 4CC location). Wasn't there a competition called the North American championships (with Canada, the US, and South America)? I wonder why they don't split it up like: North America, Canada and South America, The Asian continents, extending entries to 5 or 6. That way National competitors have another chance to compete and get a little more exposure. Thoughts?
 

Moxiejan

Medalist
Joined
Jan 11, 2014
Country
United-States
LOL, happy that you have backtracked from your original grandiose notion of "several next pairs."
I never questioned the idea of one back-up pair.
ETA


I said that several would be ideal. My "backtracking" was in the case of a skater with extreme funding issues.​
 

moriel

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
I'm not too worried about Yuzuru's competitive shape heading into Worlds.

He has more medals this season than total events that Polina or Ashley have attended so far... :disapp:

Also for me, skaters like Mao and Yuzuru have nothing to prove. They already are THE skaters. They have the reputation and the achievements to skip whatever they want and feel like, really. Same for V/T for example, they will be a royal couple of pair skating no matter what they skip.
Now a skater that is #3 in her own country... That is a bit more tricky, as the 4CC gold she had lst year is probably her best international medal so far >.>

- - - Updated - - -

True but there is still travel to be considered. They have their Nationals like a week and half after the GPF. I did note that it should be evenly spread (the 4CC location). Wasn't there a competition called the North American championships (with Canada, the US, and South America)? I wonder why they don't split it up like: North America, Canada and South America, The Asian continents, extending entries to 5 or 6. That way National competitors have another chance to compete and get a little more exposure. Thoughts?

This would have even less prestige than 4CC - basically would end up some sort of senior B
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
For a young skater like Polina, especially, I can't see that it would make sense to have more than two pairs at a time, likely your recent pair and the one you are breaking in, because your feet are still growing. It is entirely possible Polina's feet grew this winter and she needed new skates.

Maybe, perhaps but honestly it doesn't matter. The bottom line is that she chose to pull out, and the official reason was "to break in new boots". I could understand skipping 4CC for that - of course, a larger competition like Worlds or Olys you power through but you may not be at your best. At the end of the day the end goal is Worlds - and you do what you need to do to get there. Wagner chose to skip 4CC altogether - probably a wise decision at her age (although at the same time, there'll always be the question of "getting more experience"), and Gold - at least so far - is choosing to go as I figure it's part of her plan for Worlds.

Edmunds will be fine, I will not worry about her. Not like she was going to seriously contend for the World podium anyway.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
I'm not too worried about Yuzuru's competitive shape heading into Worlds.

He has more medals this season than total events that Polina or Ashley have attended so far... :disapp:

By my count:

Ashley: Japan Open + 2 GPs + GPF + US Nats = 5 comps.

Yuzuru: Skate Canada Autumn Classic + 2 GPs + GPF + Japanese Nats = 5 comps.

OK, it is true that Japan Open was only a FS comp.

So Ashley competed one fewer SP than Hanyu this season. :drama:

Am I forgetting something?
 

MK's Winter

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 9, 2009
Also for me, skaters like Mao and Yuzuru have nothing to prove. They already are THE skaters. They have the reputation and the achievements to skip whatever they want and feel like, really. Same for V/T for example, they will be a royal couple of pair skating no matter what they skip. Now a skater that is #3 in her own country... That is a bit more tricky, as the 4CC gold she had lst year is probably her best international medal so far >.> - - - Updated - - - This would have even less prestige than 4CC - basically would end up some sort of senior B

I disagree. If done right it could be as big as Euros. It would be a U.S and Canadian Nationals combined almost with skaters from South America. It would be an extremely competitive event and talk about mental pressure preparation.
 

Interspectator

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 25, 2012
The prize money for 4CC is considerable...for these front-runners who still need to pay their bills (aren't fully sponsored) it seems strange they would pass it up. Adam, for example has a much higher chance of making the 4CC podium than making the Worlds podium.
 

TrishaG

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
The prize money for 4CC is considerable...for these front-runners who still need to pay their bills (aren't fully sponsored) it seems strange they would pass it up. Adam, for example has a much higher chance of making the 4CC podium than making the Worlds podium.

Last year, Adam finished 10th at 4CCs and 8th at Worlds. He regretted competing at 4CCs because it was too close to Nationals for him to peak again and he said all the traveling interfered with his training. While there are a few less top-ranked men at 4CCs than will be at Worlds, Adam is not able to compete as well at 4CCs as he will be able to at Worlds because of how he needs to train to peak. So he is less likely to podium at 4CCs or, at least, he is equally unlikely to podium at 4CCs as he is at Worlds.

He also stated this year that he will be working hard on his quad lutz to improve the rotations before Worlds, so he needs the extra time without a competition to focus on that.
 

MeaganSkater

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
In a perfect world I would love to see the 4CCs divided into two separate competitions: 1. The America's 2. Asian/Pacific which would reduce the distance in which the skaters would have to travel to the event in any given year.

But then of course comes the logistics of cost involved and getting enough appropriate judges and the number of countries capable of hosting the events each year.

But a girl can dream right?
 

Amei

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Bottom Line: As long as the top skaters are skipping 4CCs constantly opting to practice for Worlds, the competition will never gain the prestige of the European Championships.
 

karne

in Emergency Backup Mode
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Country
Australia
Bottom Line: As long as the top skaters are skipping 4CCs constantly opting to practice for Worlds, the competition will never gain the prestige of the European Championships.

And as long as the prevailing attitude of the fans is that 4CC "doesn't matter" or is a lesser competition than its European counterpart (in spite of it generally having more sensible scoring and great competition), it will never gain that prestige either.
 

mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Bottom Line: As long as the top skaters are skipping 4CCs constantly opting to practice for Worlds, the competition will never gain the prestige of the European Championships.

Look, I don't want to start anything but.......4CC is not, and should not be considered more prestigious than Europeans. I mean this in the nicest way but, when Ashley Wagner ( Who I love ) and Caroline Zhang are 2 of the 3 Medalists. It says a lot.
 
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ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
The prize money for 4CC is considerable...for these front-runners who still need to pay their bills (aren't fully sponsored) it seems strange they would pass it up. Adam, for example has a much higher chance of making the 4CC podium than making the Worlds podium.

Your point about the Four Continents prize money is a good one.

But I selfishly :yes: would like Adam to place as high as possible at Worlds .... so if Raf and he believe that withdrawing from Four Continents will help, I support their choice.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Look, I don't want to start anything but.......4CC is not, and should not be considered more prestigious than Europeans. I mean this the nicest way but, when Ashley Wagner ( Who I love ) and Caroline Zhang are 2 of the 3 Medalists. It says a lot.

It gets better (worse?) though...

In 2006, a US skater named Katy Taylor was the ladies champion. :unsure: :eek:
 

TrishaG

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Look, I don't want to start anything but.......4CC is not, and should not be considered more prestigious than Europeans. I mean this the nicest way but, when Ashley Wagner ( Who I love ) and Caroline Zhang are 2 of the 3 Medalists. It says a lot.

The same could be said for Bychenko and Kovtun on the European podium this year for the men's event, or Voronov and Menshov a few years ago. It depends on the year and the event; some years European championships will have the stronger competition in certain events and other years 4CCs will have the stronger competition. They should be equal in prestige, but Europeans has more cache since it's been around longer.
 

mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
The same could be said for Bychenko and Kovtun on the European podium this year for the men's event, or Voronov and Menshov a few years ago. It depends on the year and the event; some years European championships will have the stronger competition in certain events and other years 4CCs will have the stronger competition. They should be equal in prestige, but Europeans has more cache since it's been around longer.

Didn't Javi Win Europeans?? Come on now.....That's Prestige in my book.
 
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