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2015 US Nationals Senior Free Dance Jan. 24
- Thread starter Mrs. P
- Start date
Thanks.
I loved the changes, the program looks amazing, it is like Mao Asada possessed to Maia, too much elegance to be true. And the dress is a dream, the previous was beautiful too but the new one is so delicate
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- Joined
- Jan 8, 2009
Maia just said. "Our next goal is the 2018 Olympics." Glad to hear that.
:dance:
That makes me sooo happy!
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2011
I want to take Ms. Zoueva and shake her by the shoulders. For a long long time.
It seems that Marina slots her skaters into little boxes when she starts working with them: Voir in the box marked Softly Romantic; Marlie in the Brashly Dramatic box. The Shibs seem to have been put into a box named Light, Airy And Traditional. Occasionally, Zoueva will venture out of these boxes (Voir with the Latin and Carmen programs, Marlie with the Tango, ShibSibs with the MJ program), but at the first sign that Things Aren't Going As Well As She Hoped, she reverts right back to the boxes with the next year's FD program (think Voir's Sochi FD, Marlie's Notre Dame program). Sometimes this strategy even works (it certainly worked out well for Marlie, didn't it?), but usually it doesn't. Because being Risk Adverse isn't the usual recipe for success, is it?
Which brings me to the ShibSibs' latest incarnation of the Vienna Waltz program. Hmm, Staunchly Traditional wasn't quite going to plan this season. So why not make it Light, Airy And Traditional? So, out with the costumes meant to evoke 19th century Vienna and in with something that nods to the formal, but is much more cool and light. The same with their expression, what you might call the emotional temperature of the dance. Lighter, cooler. More playful. But still firmly recognizable as a traditional Viennese waltz. And I do think it's a smarter way to go. Before the program was like a too densely rich sacher torte. Tasty, but a bit heavy, no? This was much more palatable. Delicious in its own way. But not, alas, without one significant problem: it still only exists on one level.
Think of Marlie's wonderful DF program. It had highs and lows. It had some sections that were extremely playful, others that played it more traditional. There were significant changes in mood and tempo. I don't see any of that in the ShibSibs' program. The shifts in tempo are there: they are very subtle, but they are there. And Zoueva's choreography is ignoring them (and, consequently, so are the Shibs). I have never understood why Zoueva removed the one part of the program that was the absolute High Point of the dance: the original crisscrossing mirror pattern of twizzles. The Shibs could do them, and do them exceptionally well. And yet we've never seen them since the first time they performed this piece in competition. Makes no sense to me.
I do think that the program is significantly improved since the GPF, even with the certain roughness to the new steps. That can be smoothed out. What can't be, however, is the fundamental problem with the "one note-ness" of the program. And since they've been so successful with it, I greatly fear that Marina is going to keep them in this box as long as she possibly can. Which is a shame because the Shibs are capable of so much more. Not a hokey MJ routine (goodness, it's only in the stodgy world of Ice Dancing that MJ is considered "edgy" and "modern"). So, like I said, I'd really really love to shake Zoueva by the shoulders for a very long time.
YMMV of course.
It seems that Marina slots her skaters into little boxes when she starts working with them: Voir in the box marked Softly Romantic; Marlie in the Brashly Dramatic box. The Shibs seem to have been put into a box named Light, Airy And Traditional. Occasionally, Zoueva will venture out of these boxes (Voir with the Latin and Carmen programs, Marlie with the Tango, ShibSibs with the MJ program), but at the first sign that Things Aren't Going As Well As She Hoped, she reverts right back to the boxes with the next year's FD program (think Voir's Sochi FD, Marlie's Notre Dame program). Sometimes this strategy even works (it certainly worked out well for Marlie, didn't it?), but usually it doesn't. Because being Risk Adverse isn't the usual recipe for success, is it?
Which brings me to the ShibSibs' latest incarnation of the Vienna Waltz program. Hmm, Staunchly Traditional wasn't quite going to plan this season. So why not make it Light, Airy And Traditional? So, out with the costumes meant to evoke 19th century Vienna and in with something that nods to the formal, but is much more cool and light. The same with their expression, what you might call the emotional temperature of the dance. Lighter, cooler. More playful. But still firmly recognizable as a traditional Viennese waltz. And I do think it's a smarter way to go. Before the program was like a too densely rich sacher torte. Tasty, but a bit heavy, no? This was much more palatable. Delicious in its own way. But not, alas, without one significant problem: it still only exists on one level.
Think of Marlie's wonderful DF program. It had highs and lows. It had some sections that were extremely playful, others that played it more traditional. There were significant changes in mood and tempo. I don't see any of that in the ShibSibs' program. The shifts in tempo are there: they are very subtle, but they are there. And Zoueva's choreography is ignoring them (and, consequently, so are the Shibs). I have never understood why Zoueva removed the one part of the program that was the absolute High Point of the dance: the original crisscrossing mirror pattern of twizzles. The Shibs could do them, and do them exceptionally well. And yet we've never seen them since the first time they performed this piece in competition. Makes no sense to me.
I do think that the program is significantly improved since the GPF, even with the certain roughness to the new steps. That can be smoothed out. What can't be, however, is the fundamental problem with the "one note-ness" of the program. And since they've been so successful with it, I greatly fear that Marina is going to keep them in this box as long as she possibly can. Which is a shame because the Shibs are capable of so much more. Not a hokey MJ routine (goodness, it's only in the stodgy world of Ice Dancing that MJ is considered "edgy" and "modern"). So, like I said, I'd really really love to shake Zoueva by the shoulders for a very long time.
YMMV of course.
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2014
I'm not a lover of the mirror twizzles tbh. Usually I see that element as a weak point. I agree that the Shibs were the best in doing that element, but they were not perfect, and it's not such a high rewarding element in order to risk it because if a mirror twizzle gets slightly wrong in sync it really looks ugly.
I think the US judges were trying to give Chock and Bates the lift they need to be podium contenders at Worlds. But I think the arena spoke for the "people". I think the Shibs are the favorite. i don't care how many times you tell me a piece of art is a master piece. If I don't like it, I'm not buying. I think the World judges may have a different opinion about C/B than the national counterparts. But the World arena had not quite embraced the Shibs this year either. But I have a good feeling for the Shibs at World and maybe their second place finish at Nationals will make them all the more embraceable.
I would disagree. The crowd in Barcelona really like them!
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2014
Unfortunately there is nothing to indicate that the international judges have a different look regariding C&B. On the contrary.
I didn't even know Kaitlin Hawayek and Jean-Luc Baker existed before to day since NBC never bothered to show pairs or ice dance during the GP season last year. I absolutely love H/B they remind me of a young Davis/White! I look forward to watching them skate in the future!
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
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On seeing this live, I was shocked at how much I was disappointed by the Shibs FD. Their SD was wonderful. The FD seemed dated, and without "light and shade." It also was a step slow. The audience, which preferred Shibs in the SD, gave C&B the better ovation in the FD.
If the Shibs are going to keep Strauss, I hope they ditch the current costumes and go for something like DomShabs used for their 30's OD to Lady and the Hooligan-fur trimmed Sonja Henie outdoor skating outfits. If you can't fix it, feature it. Go right past passe to retro.
If the Shibs are going to keep Strauss, I hope they ditch the current costumes and go for something like DomShabs used for their 30's OD to Lady and the Hooligan-fur trimmed Sonja Henie outdoor skating outfits. If you can't fix it, feature it. Go right past passe to retro.
I felt the same way watching the Shibs FD on TV, unlike their strong SD. The FD waltz was all on one level as Weak Ankles commented. Chock & Bates have developed great partnering skills in the past two years, thanks to Igor. They skate closer together than any other team yet have great difficulty and speed across the ice – not an easy task, which is why I think they get such strong marks. Hubbell had some balance errors in their FD, and the duo appeared rather slow to me and not at all close together enough. Not a fan of their FD and thought their SD was better. Hawayek & Baker were lovely , if not quite as powerful. I am sure they will continue to grow in speed and strength.
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2011
Hubbell and Donahue are a total quandary to me I'd be the first to say, Why? Why can't we have more programs that acknowledge there are many kinds of dances? Why can't we incorporate contemporary dance styles like hip hop? Yes Fred Astaire was a great dancer and choreographer, but then was so Merce Cunningham. And Alvin Ailey. Why can't we see something that acknowledges it is 2015 and not 1815? Or 1925? Or even 1975? Why? WHY?
And here are H/D giving us a dance that is nothing if not ostensibly au courant. And all I kept thinking as I watched it was, this feels so weirdly old fashioned. Strip away the tres moderne dance beats and what you have is a FD structured like a typical pre-Torvill and Dean routine. Three parts. Not especially connected. And, as KKonas notes, slow and with errors. All very much a quandary.
And I don't think it's going to really play at Worlds. Sorry, but I just don't.
And here are H/D giving us a dance that is nothing if not ostensibly au courant. And all I kept thinking as I watched it was, this feels so weirdly old fashioned. Strip away the tres moderne dance beats and what you have is a FD structured like a typical pre-Torvill and Dean routine. Three parts. Not especially connected. And, as KKonas notes, slow and with errors. All very much a quandary.
And I don't think it's going to really play at Worlds. Sorry, but I just don't.
Actually, I think one of the more interesting programs to me was the Dance Macabre/Young Frankenstein from Cannusico/McManus. Honestly, I think the Shibutanis could look at doing this kind of program. I actually think it was a more classical version of a zombie program (i.e. not like the zombie program by the Germans).
I had thought personally the Shibs' FD was an improvement from what it was early in the season, but I respect Doris' opinion as she was there and did note that C/B got a larger oviation. AT think at this point, it's a matter of making what they got work and hope that they will get a better program this season.
I had thought personally the Shibs' FD was an improvement from what it was early in the season, but I respect Doris' opinion as she was there and did note that C/B got a larger oviation. AT think at this point, it's a matter of making what they got work and hope that they will get a better program this season.
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2012
I'm surprised to see that people dislike the Shib's FD so much. I think it's pure and honest. Very straight to the point. It's not fancy and the costuming reflects that. I think it's great because you look at what they do on the ice and not what they wear. I, for one, love it. I can see them feel the waltz and not just performing it wich for me makes it very special. Performing without feeling forced on, sets them apart from so many other IMO.
I will say that I believe they have have what it takes to be the best of the best. So I hope they stick with it, continue to improve and, the most important, don't loose their ability to feel that music.
I will say that I believe they have have what it takes to be the best of the best. So I hope they stick with it, continue to improve and, the most important, don't loose their ability to feel that music.
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