2016-2017 Grand Prix selections

[chuckm]

They could have pulled out of NHK a week or two sooner if it was so obvious a long trip wasn't in the cards with a brain injury. No excuse there.

Polina Edmunds withdrew with enough time for the Japanese fed to find a replacement.

 

[4everchan]

how do you know it was obvious?????

as far as I know, you and I don't know their situation... Kirsten posted this today... perhaps they were waiting to see a specialist to assess her recovery before making the final decision.
I am not trying to excuse them as I of course will always be in favour of early withdrawals in order to give a chance to as many skaters as possible to compete. It is exactly why I would like a deadline by which skaters would have to confirm their presence and if they did have to withdraw after that date, they'd be penalized.

Such a deadline would not only help other skaters to get opportunities but would also stop any kind of speculation like the one we see here...

Skaters have been withdrawing all season long... at various intervals vs competition date.... and now you pick on Kirsten because she hoped she would be able to travel despite her concussion, until she found out she couldn't??? and why??? because she will be able to skate a bit later on because she won't have to fly ?

Sometimes, I wonder why you are so harsh on some skaters and so tolerant on others.... and then I remember.

They could have pulled out of NHK a week or two sooner if it was so obvious a long trip wasn't in the cards with a brain injury. No excuse there.

Polina Edmunds withdrew with enough time for the Japanese fed to find a replacement.

 

[Tastetherainbow]

Since the Feds are doing as they please with replacements, can Japan just sub in one of their own pairs? It would be easier on them in terms of transportation costs.

I always don't get why the Japanese fed would throw away two pairs spots when they have two senior pairs eligible for them (now three). Seriously, even if there's no prospect of getting on the podium, it doesn't hurt to gain experience and recognition from the judges right?

 

[Mango]

Ivan Righini and Alena Leonova have withdrawn from NHK Trophy.

Men: http://www.isuresults.com/events/cat00028756.htm
Ladies: http://www.isuresults.com/events/cat00028757.htm

 

[4everchan]

i wonder if the usual culprits will pounce on them now...

Ivan Righini and Alena Leonova have withdrawn from NHK Trophy.

Men: http://www.isuresults.com/events/cat00028756.htm
Ladies: http://www.isuresults.com/events/cat00028757.htm

 

[cathlen]

I wonder why they WD. Ivan has looked like he wasn't quite okay at TdF, yes, but I think Alena was alright?

 

[tulosai]

I wonder why they WD. Ivan has looked like he wasn't quite okay at TdF, yes, but I think Alena was alright?

Yeah Alena's WD is strange... it's been clear at times in the past that Russia has 'forced' or strongly encouraged some skaters to WD, but that was mostly only when it was pretty sure that it would give an opportunity to another Russian skater, and never on this short of notice. Maybe she is injured or ill?

 

[RemyRose]

Yeah Alena's WD is strange... it's been clear at times in the past that Russia has 'forced' or strongly encouraged some skaters to WD, but that was mostly only when it was pretty sure that it would give an opportunity to another Russian skater, and never on this short of notice. Maybe she is injured or ill?

She's not prepared mentally per her Coach. He withdrew her only after she gave consent.

 

[cathlen]

She's not prepared mentally per her Coach. He withdrew her only after she gave consent.

TdF really was blow for her mentality. That's why I was so strongly against the new rule for falls deduction. These skaters are people, it really dosen't help knowing that with 5th fall you have -9, instead of previous -5. Actaully fifth fall being -3 and combining it wtth max. -GOE it makes mathematically better to skip element than doing it, because you lose more points than gain in most of the cases (and we do have sometimes fall on StSq, imgaine how skater must feel then). So encouraging.... :disapp: I really hope someone will change the rule back to how it was.

 

[turquoiseblue]

Ivan Righini has posted a message on Instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BNHbAWcAqMc/

Hello everyone! i didn't post for long time anything,unfortunately I had to withdraw from NHK Trophy and would like to say sorry to all of my fans for that...But good news that after two 1/2 weeks non skating,days full of doctors and therapies which still are in action,I'm finally back on the ice and ready to prepare for nationals and then do great ending of the season,still not totally recovered but we don't have time to cry!Now I'm back,with fresh mind,good@mental energy and ready to work as hard as I can.Thank you everyone for supper,amazing words which I'm receiving everyday and it's a pleasure to read how all of you worry about meIt's very important for me and that it's priceless feeling!!!Thank you all

 

[chuckm]

i wonder if the usual culprits will pounce on them now...

Nope. Obviously, the reason for their withdrawals was their dismal performances at TDF, which were within the 14 day window for NHK. Even if they had withdrawn immediately after the close of the competition on 11/12, it would have been too late to replace them.

 

[carriecmu0503]

TdF really was blow for her mentality. That's why I was so strongly against the new rule for falls deduction. These skaters are people, it really dosen't help knowing that with 5th fall you have -9, instead of previous -5. Actaully fifth fall being -3 and combining it wtth max. -GOE it makes mathematically better to skip element than doing it, because you lose more points than gain in most of the cases (and we do have sometimes fall on StSq, imgaine how skater must feel then). So encouraging.... :disapp: I really hope someone will change the rule back to how it was.

Why? So we can go back to having Hanyu falling 5 times at Cup of China but still medal? No, thanks. Falling 3,4,5 times REALLY disrupts a performance, and should be penalized more harshly.

 

[cathlen]

[/B] Why? So we can go back to having Hanyu falling 5 times at Cup of China but still medal? No, thanks. Falling 3,4,5 times REALLY disrupts a performance, and should be penalized more harshly.

It's not like other skaters had skated so well then. If they did, they would have medal over Yuzuru, Kovtun has won with 243 after all, so it wasn't so tough to skate better than Yuzuru, but somehow even without all the falling, they DIDN'T and it's not Yuzuru fault. Every year we have some bizzarre results, when more than half of the field skate bad, and so skaters medal even though they didn't skate great, that's how it is, when you're not the only one to make mistakes.

Btw. Yuzuru had medaled with silver with 11 points advantage then (yes, I have checked), so it wouldn't change a result at all.

 

[YesWay]

[/B] Why? So we can go back to having Hanyu falling 5 times at Cup of China but still medal? No, thanks. Falling 3,4,5 times REALLY disrupts a performance, and should be penalized more harshly.

Yah, cuz there's a banged-up skater doing that in every competition, every week isn't there? -_-
Those "career fallers" are getting on the podium so often, that we need that rule to put a stop to it!

Actually, it happened like, once.
Of course, Hanyu haterz screamed blue murder, without reading protocols and seeing how points were earned.
So ISU changed rules, knee-jerk stylee.
Even though if the new rules had been in place at CoC it wouldn't have changed the result
But no matter - they fixed Hanyu real good, right?

Who suffers now, under the new rules?
Hint: It's not Hanyu...

 

[silverfoxes]

[/B] Why? So we can go back to having Hanyu falling 5 times at Cup of China but still medal? No, thanks. Falling 3,4,5 times REALLY disrupts a performance, and should be penalized more harshly.

I agree, I'm fine with this rule. And Alena still would have been dead last with the 4 extra points so I don't think that is the main issue here.

http://rsport.ru/figure_skating/20161122/1112592917.html

Google Translate makes very little sense here, but from what I can make out of Rukavitsin's quote, she's not in competitive form and it's not just psychological. If in fact the only problem was her mental state, I don't think she should have withdrawn. One bad result at a GP is not enough reason to give up. But it seems that her falls also caused some pain (not serious injury per se, but soreness) and she needs some recovery time and then to get back in shape for Russian Nationals. At least, that's how I read it, but the translation is really bad.

 

[moriel]

I agree, I'm fine with this rule. And Alena still would have been dead last with the 4 extra points so I don't think that is the main issue here.

http://rsport.ru/figure_skating/20161122/1112592917.html

Google Translate makes very little sense here, but from what I can make out of Rukavitsin's quote, she's not in competitive form and it's not just psychological. If in fact the only problem was her mental state, I don't think she should have withdrawn. One bad result at a GP is not enough reason to give up. But it seems that her falls also caused some pain (not serious injury per se, but soreness) and she needs some recovery time and then to get back in shape for Russian Nationals. At least, that's how I read it, but the translation is really bad.

In a few words:

- the original idea of withdrawing was of her coach, but they both made the decision
- she is not very comfortable psychologically after having the worst skate in her competitive career, and is not ready to compete on GP level.
- also she has some "micro injuries" (not sure how to translate better) after her Paris falls.
- she will still get ready for nationals, and maybe participate is some competition before nationals.

 

[karne]

Yah, cuz there's a banged-up skater doing that in every competition, every week isn't there? -_-
Those "career fallers" are getting on the podium so often, that we need that rule to put a stop to it!

Actually, it happened like, once.

Actually, it happened, like, more than once.

And it wasn't just Hanyu.

Hint: his name is Patrick Chan, and he actually WON Skate Canada by falling on his backside four times.

But really, c'mon. It's pretty jarring to see people still getting massive scores by falling on their backsides. The real problem is the lack of punishment in PCS for falls.

 

[eta]

Why? So we can go back to having Hanyu falling 5 times at Cup of China but still medal? No, thanks. Falling 3,4,5 times REALLY disrupts a performance, and should be penalized more harshly.

Let's do math.

Hanyu scored 237.55 at 2014 Cup of China. He received -5 for five falls during FS.

Under the current rules, he would have received -9 for those five falls, resulting in a final score of 233.55.

The bronze medalist scored 226.73, so Hanyu would still have gotten silver.


Winning/placing high after giving a not-good performance means that other competitors gave even-worse performances.

 

[eta]

Actually, it happened, like, more than once.

And it wasn't just Hanyu.

Hint: his name is Patrick Chan, and he actually WON Skate Canada by falling on his backside four times.

But really, c'mon. It's pretty jarring to see people still getting massive scores by falling on their backsides. The real problem is the lack of punishment in PCS for falls.

While this is true, as long as this is a judged sport, nothing can be done to "fix" it. Even when things are explicitly written in the rules - say, what deserves +GOE or -GOE - scores are not given consistently, because judges just happen to favor certain skaters over others.

 

[TGee]

Actually, it happened, like, more than once.

And it wasn't just Hanyu.

Hint: his name is Patrick Chan, and he actually WON Skate Canada by falling on his backside four times.

But really, c'mon. It's pretty jarring to see people still getting massive scores by falling on their backsides. The real problem is the lack of punishment in PCS for falls.

I'd rather see a transparent and consistent deduction for falls in the TES. And it makes the risk vs. reward of adding in elements that the skater(s) haven't reached enough consistency on very clear.

PCS is murky enough in my view without judges each having their own rules of thumb about how much it mars performance. And I think we can all agree that a skate with 4 or 5 falls is very disrupted both technically and in performance and composition..

So, if skaters and coaches wish to start competing a number of new things each year to max out BV by Worlds, they and their fans should be prepared to accept the risk of poor early season scores, and keep perspective.