2021 World Team Trophy - Day 3

[chasingneverland]

Japan was so close to 2nd. If Rika had been in form, she would have been second after Anna, and Japan would have taken silver.

Hmm, Shoma's 4 point SP was arguably much worse for Japan's 2nd place hopes than Rika's score. Both Rika and Kaori needed to beat Liza for them to have had a chance and even then they needed Bradie to falter a little.

 

[Jontor]

I feel bad but I just find it draaaaags on, like I actually looked at my watch during it.

Yes, the program does nothing for me either even though I love Anna to bits. Hope she gets some new spark programs next season.

 

[Jontor]

And that's that!

Guys, today I'm gonna go to the pub for the first time since early December (thanks to lockdown) and I shall celebrate my team Russia and the Italians, who managed to keep France and Canada (okay, I feel super sorry for them) down with one skater less!

 

[colormyworld240]

Conversely, they'll also be less tired though too.

But the Olympics there's only one SP for Ladies, one FS for ladies, one SP for men, one FS for men, one SP for pairs, one FS for pairs, one SP for dance, and one FS for dance.

Plus they can pick only two (2) disciplines to replace someone between the SP and the FS. Or not replace anyone.

So that also applies for other disciplines too, with the exception of men. Third pairs team could definitely win individual gold and there's no guarantee they even use two pairs.

But it's also not "weakest" persay. It's about looking at where the other nations are strong and weaker. For example, it made sense for Canada to have Tessa and Scott do both SP and FS because no one is near their level. For the ladies of Russia, it makes sense to pick the strongest SP skater and the strongest FS skater which aren't (1) necessarily the same skater and (2) aren't necessarily the strongest skaters overall. But then you also have to balance that with where you're more likely to pick up valuable points against main contenders and where it helps your team overall not just that discipline. And then balance that against individual medals potential.

I mean everything you're saying makes sense factually. But I'm talking about whichever lady that has to deal with this mentally. I'm sure all of them would take getting another shot at Olympic gold over being less tired.

And it might not be the weakest, but it'll definitely feel that way. Especially since they'll be left out of a very possible Olympic gold medal, it's a tough pill to swallow. And the ones who do the team event will have confidence boost in comparison if they win.

Yeah it's the same for all disciplines but it just feels tougher for the ladies because unlike the other disciplines, each of the ladies has a very real shot at winning. It just sucks to not get the other shot that the other two will have.

 

[chasingneverland]

I mean everything you're saying makes sense factually. But I'm talking about whichever lady that has to deal with this mentally. I'm sure all of them would take getting another shot at Olympic gold over being less tired.

And it might not be the weakest, but it'll definitely feel that way. Especially since they'll be left out of a very possible Olympic gold medal, it's a tough pill to swallow. And the ones who do the team event will have confidence boost in comparison if they win.

Yeah it's the same for all disciplines but it just feels tougher for the ladies because unlike the other disciplines, each of them had a very real shot of winning. It just sucks to not get the other shot that the other two will have.

But that's not true. The third place pairs very easily has a very real shot of winning an OGM. One of M/G, B/K, and T/M won't compete in the team event. (Potentially two of them but I think Russia subs one lady and one pairs team and has Mikhail do both and S/K do both.)

It's actually even worse for the second (and third) men for Russia because that's their real ONLY chance for an Olympic medal and they won't compete at all (likely) and they won't have individual Olympic hopes.

Also, past champions have struggled with going from the team even to the individual event. It does tend to negatively impact the individual event if they're not careful and their team isn't careful.

It's also important to note that the men have a super fast turn around after the team event. None of the Russian men are known for their consistency and it's asking one of them to be consistent for 4 skates in a row. (Or alternately sub one of the men and lose a sub for the ladies or pairs...)

 

[alexocfp]

Kaori. Wow. Just wow.

 

[TontoK]

But that's not true. The third place pairs very easily has a very real shot of winning an OGM. One of M/G, B/K, and T/M won't compete in the team event. (Potentially two of them but I think Russia subs one lady and one pairs team and has Mikhail do both and S/K do both.)

It's actually even worse for the second (and third) men for Russia because that's their real ONLY chance for an Olympic medal and they won't compete at all (likely) and they won't have individual Olympic hopes.

Also, past champions have struggled with going from the team even to the individual event. It does tend to negatively impact the individual event if they're not careful and their team isn't careful.

It's also important to note that the men have a super fast turn around after the team event. None of the Russian men are known for their consistency and it's asking one of them to be consistent for 4 skates in a row. (Or alternately sub one of the men and lose a sub for the ladies or pairs...)

But not always. Davis/White solidified their standing in the Team Event, and went on to defeat Virtue/Moir again in the "regular" event.

And Virtue/Moir competed the team event the next cycle, while the French opted out. That gave them an opportunity to deliver their programs on Olympic ice and smooth out the nerves. Might things have worked out differently had the French mishap happened in the Team Event, giving them a chance to sort things before the individual? We'll never know, but I bet they wonder about it.

They won't have a chance to opt out in Beijing, unless the French federation just takes a complete pass on the Team Event, and I don't see that happening.

 

[chasingneverland]

But not always. Davis/White solidified their standing in the Team Event, and went on to defeat Virtue/Moir again in the "regular" event.

And Virtue/Moir competed the team event the next cycle, while the French opted out. That gave them an opportunity to deliver their programs on Olympic ice and smooth out the nerves. Might things have worked out differently had the French mishap happened in the Team Event, giving them a chance to sort things before the individual? We'll never know, but I bet they wonder about it.

They won't have a chance to opt out in Beijing, unless the French federation just takes a complete pass on the Team Event, and I don't see that happening.

Charlie and Meryl had already solidified their standing going into the Olympics.

And Tessa and Scott actually changed their lift between the team event and individual event. As for Gabby's dress mishap, you don't PLAN for that. You don't sort out for that.

As for the French in the team event in Bejing, I'm not sure what they'll do. They might actually. Kevin can accumulate points but isn't exactly a medal threat. Their ladies are going to be among the worst. Same with their pairs. They actually might decide to skip it again.

 

[TontoK]

Charlie and Meryl had already solidified their standing going into the Olympics.

And Tessa and Scott actually changed their lift between the team event and individual event. As for Gabby's dress mishap, you don't PLAN for that. You don't sort out for that.

As for the French in the team event in Bejing, I'm not sure what they'll do. They might actually. Kevin can accumulate points but isn't exactly a medal threat. Their ladies are going to be among the worst. Same with their pairs. They actually might decide to skip it again.

I don't know whether D/W had solidified their standing as World #1 or not. I don't think it would have been completely shocking had the gold and siver medals been reversed... it was pretty back-and-forth in the years proceding. Winning the head-to-heads in the Team Event certainly didn't hurt.

Of course, P/C didn't PLAN for the dress mishap. My point was that wouldn't they have preferred that the workmanship issue (or whatever the problem was) had manifested in the Team Event, so they would have had an opportunity to fix it?

France will only have one ice dance team at the Olympics, right? They can't hand off the Team Event like they did last time. If P/C don't do the event, then that means they've forfeited for everyone on the French team. Do you really think that will happen? Or... maybe they just refuse to skate and let France compete short-handed. I just don't see that happening.

 

[chasingneverland]

I don't know whether D/W had solidified their standing as World #1 or not. I don't think it would have been completely shocking had the gold and siver medals been reversed... it was pretty back-and-forth in the years proceding. Winning the head-to-heads in the Team Event certainly didn't hurt.

Of course, P/C didn't PLAN for the dress mishap. My point was that wouldn't they have preferred that the workmanship issue (or whatever the problem was) had manifested in the Team Event, so they would have had an opportunity to fix it?

France will only have one ice dance team at the Olympics, right? They can't hand off the Team Event like they did last time. If P/C don't do the event, then that means they've forfeited for everyone on the French team. Do you really think that will happen? Or... maybe they just refuse to skate and let France compete short-handed. I just don't see that happening.

They beat V/M everytime they met that year. In fact they beat V/M everytime they met the year before as well. The olympics was the 5th time in a row they beat V/M (6th I guess if we count the team event.) It was ALREADY solidified.

The thing with Gabi's dress mishap is that wasn't the first time they competed with that dress. They competed all season in that dress.

Yeah, I forgot that. I mean right now France hasn't qualified for the team event although they should..

 

[lariko]

Sakomoto, Tuktamysheva and Tennell were the bright spots for me in the ladies event. Pairs was pretty much all fun, but then I can watch pairs all day long

grats to Russia for making the insanely hard choices that worked out. They do know what they are about shuffling their crazy stack of skaters

 

[eppen]

Watched the ladies on the last day of the WTT. There were certainly some bright spots - Lara Naki Gutmann is a pleasure to watch, just hope that she can keep the tech side together better. She was the first skater to make me watch the whole program attentively. (Ginervra Lavinia did a good senior debut, but the FS showed that she is still more of a junior.) You could have counted the seconds Lea Serna actually performed - she changed her expression and body movement in and out of interpretation incredibly clearly.

Rika went back to her old FS which was a relief bcs the Lambiel one was so unbelievably boring and bland. I read she had the same injury which had prevented toe jumps, but in the FS she was doing lutzes and flips seemingly without problems, so I wonder. Bradie skated very good indeed, one of the highlights. The choreo is excellent, but despite all the hard work (eloquently applauded by Benoit Richaud) is not really benefiting her perfomance skills - I have stopped believing that she could ever become a truly great interpreter. Tuktamisheva did so much better than in the Worlds when it came to performance, but she is also living proof that maturity and age do not automatically mean depth and skill in interpretation.

Kaori was, on the other hand, technically spot on, I have always loved her speed and glide over ice, the ease of it. The jumps looked big and impressive. She was able to relax and give a bit more for her performance in the second part - the ChSq is truly one for the ages. I would still like her upper body and arms to give more, be sharper, stronger, more meaningful, but overall that was Kaori at her most glorious and was delighted to see her get the PCS that the performance derserved.

Anna Shcherbakova is the girl in the 3A that I have alway felt a bit confused about (Kostornaia I love, Trusova has impressive jumps). I have always wondered how on earth she is able to pull off those quads when her triples are at best mediocre. Her skating skills are also mediocre when it comes to the basic things, like producing speed effortlessly and easily. The ugliest crossovers in the business were discussed during the Worlds already. She certainly can do the transitions, but it feels like the quantity is there to hide the lack of basic great quality. I think that she has been doing the same program for SP and FS when it comes to theme, emotinal arc and performance. She does pretty movement to pretty music, but to my eyes, there is nothing glorious about her skating. The sum total of her skills gives her the first spot, of course.

E