Boots with strong ankle support for narrow heel

[Ic3Rabbit]

Update on how things went (we've skated once since purchase):

My daughter ended up with Royal Pros and Coronation Ace blades after trying those, Royal Primes, and Jackson Premiers. She loves how effortless her camel spins suddenly have become, but complains a bit about the stiffness. I told her it will take her a bit of time. The base stiffness of the Royal Pros isn't THAT much higher than that of the original stiffness of the Competitors she was in, they were just broken down a fair bit, and she needs that strength for her level anyway.

I tried Jackson 5300, RF3s, RF1, Royal Pro, Royal Prime, Ice Fly, and Chorus. The RF series has the wrong shape for my foot and crushed my smaller toes from the tips, even though I wanted to get leather boots originally. The Jackson boots were entirely the wrong shape for my foot. The Edea boots did not have the ankle support I wanted at all, in any direction, even though I was wearing a size smaller in those than any others. They were comfortable around my foot, but the lack of support was a deal-breaker, as I suspected it would be. I was thus trying to decide between the Royal Pro and Royal Primes, and the Royal Primes held my heel more snugly, even when pointing my toes, as well as having the side-to-side ankle support I wanted. I got Gold Star blades because there weren't a lot of options in my size (but lots of Jackson blades, which I didn't want). The better skate tech thought my foot was wide (probably because my heel is narrow), but measured both and announced my width normal (B). Which was good enough because I couldn't get anything narrower on a whirlwind day trip across the strait, and at least it wasn't wide. I suspected last year that my blades weren't aligned well for me and asked the coach at the time (not my coach now, nor really taking responsibility for me then even though they should have), who told me they were fine. I'm pretty sure the coach was just wrong, and negligent.

It's very different now. I love how easy turns and landings have become. I just rotate effortlessly. When I land I glide so smoothly out of my jumps. All my spiral positions feel more secure. I have to more consciously bend my legs, for now, but my coach made note of my bending my legs very well going into a loop jump (and the skate tech commented that I was bending my legs just fine), so the stiffness of the boot isn't really an issue for me. When I spin, it's much more important that I get my leg straight to get a centered spin, but when I do it's smooth. I also find that where before I felt more stable balancing my upright spin with my leg out before pulling in, now pulling in sooner is better (which is good because revolutions don't count until I pull in anyway). Sit spins went from an uncomfortable 3-4 rotations to a solid, smooth 6. I'm still working through the camels. The proper blade mounting is also helping make back spins a bit easier to hold position for, and my foot feels more evenly supported than it did before. I'm pretty sure my blades are mounted further outward on my feet to counteract the supination, and are better aligned.

I don't seem to be increasing the pain/intense contraction in the muscles on the outside of my landing leg above my ankle, as I was before. Whether that's because of fit or because of blade placement (or because I massaged them a lot in the last week) I'm not sure, but I'm cautiously optimistic on that front.

I LIKE the more prominent spin rocker very much. I still have to get used to my jumps, but I've done all of them several times, other than lutz, which I wasn't mentally ready to do again yet.

Lastly, I've determined which skate shop will get my money in the future if I can help it, as we went to both in the city but one was MUCH more helpful than the other, providing good service, solid information, and even more appropriate measurement and suggestions, and actually listened to and wanted feedback on each of the skates I tried, and gave a lesson on blades to my kid. They put me in multiple skates from multiple brands.

The other frustrated me and my kid enormously while providing no useful info and the bare minimum of service over several hours to try on only three skate models from one brand. She measured only my length. She criticized everything including my need to wear thin socks in my skates, telling me what I was feeling was untrue and impossible, comparing my foot to the outside of the skate's length to show me she felt it was big enough. She left us alone for 90% of the time we were there and just repeatedly said she liked the lace pattern on one pair I tried on, and that the one that held my heel tight and that my toe wasn't squished onto the end of was wrong for me in both size and stiffness (the skate tech at the other store directly viewed my bending and my foot on the insole of one size down - which reached all the way to the end - and said it would still be a reasonable size and boot to wear). I literally had to pull my own boots from the oven they piled them into, or I would have been sitting doing nothing for an hour. She even took a long phone call (20+ minutes) before bringing out a single pair of skates, and took my old skates to the back of the shop for an hour and a half for no discernable reason (I hope they didn't do anything to them). I had very little trust in the skate tech at the latter as he repeatedly asked questions and then turned his back and walked away to the entrance when I tried to answer (literally five words in), didn't listen to any of the issues I had, and then became VERY attentive when a pretty young woman walked in, giving personal, hands-on service to her and flirting nonstop.

The latter unfortunately got my money for my skates (since the other didn't have the right skate in my size) but I had my blades mounted by the former. The former blade tech listened to everything, including issues with my body and skates, and used that info to get everything right.

Glad you're happy, but I hate to break the news to you that you and your daughter both should have never been let try on Risport Primes. Those are no where near your needs or skill levels and are way too stiff for you (who got them). Those are top of the line and unless you are doing triple triples or quads in them and a high level skater, they are too stiff. You're going to have the results you are having with them b/c of the high rating of the boots and the blades for that matter. I will just warn you to please be careful and watch for possible injuries that you run the risk for more now due to majorly overbooting. And I also hate to have to say this b/c I know you are limited up there for shops, but if they let you both try the top of the line and purchase boots that are overbooting, then they aren't the proper shop either.

 

[silverlily1]

Glad you're happy, but I hate to break the news to you that you and your daughter both should have never been let try on Risport Primes. Those are no where near your needs or skill levels and are way too stiff for you (who got them). Those are top of the line and unless you are doing triple triples or quads in them and a high level skater, they are too stiff. You're going to have the results you are having with them b/c of the high rating of the boots and the blades for that matter. I will just warn you to please be careful and watch for possible injuries that you run the risk for more now due to majorly overbooting. And I also hate to have to say this b/c I know you are limited up there for shops, but if they let you both try the top of the line and purchase boots that are overbooting, then they aren't the proper shop either.

My daughter's wearing Royal Pros, not Royal Primes, and she's 120 lb, 5'5, and was doing lutzes. She just needs to train herself to bend her legs more and find her sweet spot. Her last skates were bought used.

I'm not complaining about my own.

I have years of training in jumps from ballet and competitive gymnastics, and my legs are the strongest part of my body - figure skating jumps have the body in a different position but landings are beautiful and comfortable, I'm only more conscious of choosing to bend my legs into takeoffs. I guess it feels like I can trust the boot to hold up its end of things now, rather than having to rely 100% on my feet and ankles to do the supporting as it felt like in the too-wide boots which weren't supporting my ankles or feet below the top of the boot. They don't feel that stiff, they just feel supportive.

I had one day and two shops (with over $250 in ferry costs alone), and did what I could. I went with the experience and knowledge of the tech who has done it for 35 years and been an Olympic skate tech as well over the one who ignored us rudely. It's not like I had the option of the Coronation Aces, though both skate stores seemed to think Gold Stars would be okay. None recommended Phantoms or Pattern 99 or anything like that (though one tried to suggest Matrix). And my coach has seen me skate in them and is happy with the change from the Freestyles and Aspires.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

My daughter's wearing Royal Pros, not Royal Primes, and she's 120 lb, 5'5, and was doing lutzes. She just needs to train herself to bend her legs more and find her sweet spot. Her last skates were bought used.

I'm not complaining about my own.

I have years of training in jumps from ballet and competitive gymnastics, and my legs are the strongest part of my body - figure skating jumps have the body in a different position but landings are beautiful and comfortable, I'm only more conscious of choosing to bend my legs into takeoffs. I guess it feels like I can trust the boot to hold up its end of things now, rather than having to rely 100% on my feet and ankles to do the supporting as it felt like in the too-wide boots which weren't supporting my ankles or feet below the top of the boot. They don't feel that stiff, they just feel supportive.

I had one day and two shops (with over $250 in ferry costs alone), and did what I could. I went with the experience and knowledge of the tech who has done it for 35 years and been an Olympic skate tech as well over the one who ignored us rudely. It's not like I had the option of the Coronation Aces, though both skate stores seemed to think Gold Stars would be okay. None recommended Phantoms or Pattern 99 or anything like that (though one tried to suggest Matrix). And my coach has seen me skate in them and is happy with the change from the Freestyles and Aspires.

I said nothing about your daughters skates other than she should not have even had Primes suggested to TRY ON.

I still stand where I do on your boots. Having the legs you do from ballet and competitive gymnastics is great, but it's not conditioning from years of figure skating to a higher level/elite level where your legs and ankles for that matter are prepared for that kind of stiffness level. As far as the coach, many don't even know what to suggest when it comes to boots/blades so I'm going to toss that to the side. I believe I helped recommend someone you could possibly see in that area and former Olympic skate tech doesn't mean he won't upsell you if you go for it.

I wish you luck and hope things turn out ok and you remain injury free. But I still stand by my almost 40 years in the sport and experience with boots, blades and testing them for brands as an former competitive elite, now pro, as well as trial and error throughout my long career.

 

[silverlily1]

I believe I helped recommend someone you could possibly see in that area and former Olympic skate tech doesn't mean he won't upsell you if you go for it.

It's fine if you discount the coach's opinion. I don't mind.

There are only two skate shops in and around Vancouver that I could visit on a day trip. I visited both on Tuesday. There are only two skate shops on Vancouver Island. I've had a poor fit from one in the past and the other is run out of a residential house with limited stock. If you were going to recommend anyone (not sure if you did since the options were what they were anyway) I'm sure it would have been one of the Vancouver ones I visited, and probably the one I trusted more after my experience. The one skate tech ignored me. The other was extremely knowledgeable and helpful. Not much more I can do.

I do appreciate your help. I have skates that retain my heels and support my jumps, and blades that actually have a noticeable spin rocker, and I didn't have that before. I wasn't able to do much differently than I did, though.

 

[Diana Delafield]

I said nothing about your daughters skates other than she should not have even had Primes suggested to TRY ON.

I still stand where I do on your boots. Having the legs you do from ballet and competitive gymnastics is great, but it's not conditioning from years of figure skating to a higher level/elite level where your legs and ankles for that matter are prepared for that kind of stiffness level. As far as the coach, many don't even know what to suggest when it comes to boots/blades so I'm going to toss that to the side. I believe I helped recommend someone you could possibly see in that area and former Olympic skate tech doesn't mean he won't upsell you if you go for it.

I wish you luck and hope things turn out ok and you remain injury free. But I still stand by my almost 40 years in the sport and experience with boots, blades and testing them for brands as an former competitive elite, now pro, as well as trial and error throughout my long career.

And as a former competitor who still skates recreationally, with even more years under my blades, and as a native of the Vancouver area who knows the shops in question, I couldn't agree more with @Ic3Rabbit. Good luck to both you and your daughter.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

It's fine if you discount the coach's opinion. I don't mind.

There are only two skate shops in and around Vancouver that I could visit on a day trip. I visited both on Tuesday. There are only two skate shops on Vancouver Island. I've had a poor fit from one in the past and the other is run out of a residential house with limited stock. If you were going to recommend anyone (not sure if you did since the options were what they were anyway) I'm sure it would have been one of the Vancouver ones I visited, and probably the one I trusted more after my experience. The one skate tech ignored me. The other was extremely knowledgeable and helpful. Not much more I can do.

I do appreciate your help. I have skates that retain my heels and support my jumps, and blades that actually have a noticeable spin rocker, and I didn't have that before. I wasn't able to do much differently than I did, though.

I understand and bowed out just saying that I still stand by my advice and knowledge and do truly wish the best for you and your daughter.

Good luck.

 

[Mimi2789]

For what it's worth the highly experienced tech at the shop you preferred sold a woman at my rink the Royal Primes. She is about 5'2, 120lbs and does bronze level free dance and basic spins. He didn't even sell her the Dance Prime, he sold her the freestyle boots. She spent 2 painful months trying to make them work but ended up having to buy new boots from the other shop. Long story short I'm not sure what this guy is thinking putting high beginner adults in the stiffest boots on the market. I have to wonder if he is financially motivated or receiving some kind of kickback from Risport. For perspective, another woman I skate with (retired international competitor, current show skater still training triple-doubles) switched from Pianos to Primes and has been having a tough time getting used to the stiffness of the primes.

 

[silverlily1]

For what it's worth the highly experienced tech at the shop you preferred sold a woman at my rink the Royal Primes. She is about 5'2, 120lbs and does bronze level free dance and basic spins. He didn't even sell her the Dance Prime, he sold her the freestyle boots. She spent 2 painful months trying to make them work but ended up having to buy new boots from the other shop. Long story short I'm not sure what this guy is thinking putting high beginner adults in the stiffest boots on the market. I have to wonder if he is financially motivated or receiving some kind of kickback from Risport. For perspective, another woman I skate with (retired international competitor, current show skater still training triple-doubles) switched from Pianos to Primes and has been having a tough time getting used to the stiffness of the primes.

I can't say I had the same experience at all. He didn't start me in any Risports, he moved to them after Jackson and Edea. Because the Prime boot felt much better on me he DIDN'T get the sale (didn't have my size in it), and the boots aren't painful (other than the edge of one of the tongues, which should be fixed the next time I skate) nor feeling restrictive to me, they're just beautifully snug. I wore them for about 2 hours straight last night, working from stroking through to jumps, spins, and all my major program components. He didn't push my daughter towards Risport either, giving her plenty of time to decide between the Premieres and the Pros first, and trying multiple sizes in the Premieres and Pros to give her the best chance at a fair comparison.

The other shop only put me in Risport - nothing else.

I can see how someone switching from any Edea would find them stiff, as Edeas felt like they had no ankle support at all, and very little resistance to bending. I can't understand how people skate in them.