Capitol Police arrest antiwar activist Sheehan
- Thread starter IndieBoi
- Start date
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
JillLaQ said:
But you said we should leave???
Not all wars are unjustified. I have no problem with the US being in Afghanistan...Osama bin Laden co-ordinated the attacks on the US and was based from that country.
If you think Saddam and Osama were buddies, think again. Osama would not be fond of Saddam's more secular country. While Saddam was a terrible, horrible leader, there are lots of terrible, horrible leaders in this world.
Jill, if you think all Muslims, or even most, or even a significant minority want "to kill everyone and anyone who is different," I suggest you start 1. talking to some actual Muslims 2. do some research 3. stop listening to Rush Limbaugh. You, sadly, like many Americans, have no clue.
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2004
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0202-32.htm
They threw Cindy Sheehan out, but look who got to stay!
Spin this one, Bushbots.
Rave
They threw Cindy Sheehan out, but look who got to stay!
Spin this one, Bushbots.
Rave
Oh, Princess? When did I say "You should leave?" Come one, come all, but don't call yourself an American if you are a Communist. Having your citizenship and/or a passport does not make you an American. For the record, I don't listen to Rush Limbaugh, I'm busy working. You obviously have much more time on your hands than I do, hun.
Now, on to you, JonesGirl. What do you think my post means? What I thought I wrote was that every now and then, you've got to get in a fight. A war brought about an end to slavery. A war finally stopped Hitler. I guess you could say we won the Cold War. This war is justified, even if you kids are too naive to see it. Maybe not all MUSLIMS are terrorists, but about 99% of the terrorists are MUSLIMS. I didn't stereotype THEM, they stereotyped themselves.
Now, on to you, JonesGirl. What do you think my post means? What I thought I wrote was that every now and then, you've got to get in a fight. A war brought about an end to slavery. A war finally stopped Hitler. I guess you could say we won the Cold War. This war is justified, even if you kids are too naive to see it. Maybe not all MUSLIMS are terrorists, but about 99% of the terrorists are MUSLIMS. I didn't stereotype THEM, they stereotyped themselves.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
What I am most afraid of now, in this region, is that depite the hopes and intentions of the United States, Iraq will deteriorate into a Shi'ite majority theocracy allied with a nuclear armed Iran.
Even since the overthrow of the Shaw of Iran, U.S. foreign policy in the Persian Gulf was based on keeping Iraq (Sunni) and Iran (Shi'ite) at each other's throats so that neither of them could get too big. When one side or the other seemed to be winning, we would increase our support to the other side. This is the main reason why the first George Bush did not pursue Saddam Hussein into Baghdad in the first Gulf War. It was in the best interest of the United States (and also of Israel) to keep two relatively equal and mutually antagonistic powers in that region.
Now that the secular government of Iraq has been removed from consideration by U.S. military action, the Iranian mullahs are feeling their oats. Their new President is openly calling for the destruction of Israel, openly rushing full speed ahead to develop atomic weapons, and openly defying the nations of the world, including the United States, to do anything about it.
The people of that region must be feeling like, out of the frying pan, into the fire. Without joining the debate about whether war is ever justified, it seems clear to me that in this instance our adventure in Iraq has not brought about the consequences that we hoped for. At the least, the sacrifices of boys like Mrs. Sheehan's son have not brought us any closer to winning the war on terrorism despite the flag-waving of U.S. politicians.
MM
Even since the overthrow of the Shaw of Iran, U.S. foreign policy in the Persian Gulf was based on keeping Iraq (Sunni) and Iran (Shi'ite) at each other's throats so that neither of them could get too big. When one side or the other seemed to be winning, we would increase our support to the other side. This is the main reason why the first George Bush did not pursue Saddam Hussein into Baghdad in the first Gulf War. It was in the best interest of the United States (and also of Israel) to keep two relatively equal and mutually antagonistic powers in that region.
Now that the secular government of Iraq has been removed from consideration by U.S. military action, the Iranian mullahs are feeling their oats. Their new President is openly calling for the destruction of Israel, openly rushing full speed ahead to develop atomic weapons, and openly defying the nations of the world, including the United States, to do anything about it.
The people of that region must be feeling like, out of the frying pan, into the fire. Without joining the debate about whether war is ever justified, it seems clear to me that in this instance our adventure in Iraq has not brought about the consequences that we hoped for. At the least, the sacrifices of boys like Mrs. Sheehan's son have not brought us any closer to winning the war on terrorism despite the flag-waving of U.S. politicians.
MM
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
JillLaQ said:
Okay, okay, you said Cindy Sheehan should stay in Venezuela. By implication, I thought you meant all dissenters should leave. Props to you if you didn't.
However, what, exactly, is wrong with true communism? Not communism that's been bastardized by Stalin and his ilk, but true, everyone is equal and everyone working for the greater good communism. I see nothing terrible in that.
I'm a high school teacher, babe. Also a world traveler who has taught in China. I find it fascinating to talk with people from all over the world. It's opened my eyes quite a bit. I wish all Americans could have that experience and then the hate (based on ignorance) that I see wouldn't be so prevalent.
Peace.
JillLaQ said:
Unless you have walked in that Mother's shoes and lost a son in war, you should not throw stones. If anyone has a right to express their opinions on the war, it is Ms Sheehan. Her son fought for the rights of the Iraqi people and I always thought that in America there is freedom of speach or is that only when you agree with the politicians.
" I know war as few other men...know it, and nothing to me is more revolting. I have long advocated its complete abolition, as its very destructiveness on both friend and foe has rendered its useless as a method of settling international disputes." General Douglas MacArthur
"The world cannot continue to wage war like physical giants and to seek peace like intellectual pygmies'. Basil O,Connor
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JillLaQ said:
I think your posts means exactly what you wrote:
I guess other than
Then listed 3 exemptions:
1. ending slavery duing the civil war
2. the murder of millions of Jews during WW2
3. communist oppression in various parts of the world
war has never solved a thing.
Funny how what's really in a person's heart has a way of showing itself, isn't it sweets.
JillLaQ said:
Sorry toots, as in everything else, you thought wrong.
Mathman, you've got it right. Whatever our intentions, our presence in Iraq is further destabilizing the region and encouraging and strengthening the religious extremists, both in Iraq and in the region. I think we went to war with Iraq in the mistaken idea that our presence would stabilize the area and give us a permanent base in the area, because we need oil and there is lots of it in the region. The idea was idiotic.
As for Mrs. Sheehan: who has a better right than a mother, who has lost a child in a war she considers unjust, to protest that war. My son went and not voluntarily. He came back. Her son came back in a coffin. Frankly, I admire Mrs. Sheehan for using her hurt and anger to try and change the situation. She is trying to give his death some meaning. I had enough time when my son was in Iraq to fear that my son wouldn't come back alive. I protested before he went. I protested while he was there. And I will continue to protest as long as our leaders continue on this course.
As for Mrs. Sheehan: who has a better right than a mother, who has lost a child in a war she considers unjust, to protest that war. My son went and not voluntarily. He came back. Her son came back in a coffin. Frankly, I admire Mrs. Sheehan for using her hurt and anger to try and change the situation. She is trying to give his death some meaning. I had enough time when my son was in Iraq to fear that my son wouldn't come back alive. I protested before he went. I protested while he was there. And I will continue to protest as long as our leaders continue on this course.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Hi Jonesgirl. As much as I am on the other side from JillLaQ on this issue, I think she meant the word "ending" to apply to all three of her examples:
"I guess other than ending
1. slavery duing the civil war,
2. the murder of millions of Jews during WW2, and
3. communist oppression in various parts of the world,
war has never solved a thing."
(The last part was sarcasm. She meant that in her opinion war has solved lots of other things in addition to these three examples.)
MM
"I guess other than ending
1. slavery duing the civil war,
2. the murder of millions of Jews during WW2, and
3. communist oppression in various parts of the world,
war has never solved a thing."
(The last part was sarcasm. She meant that in her opinion war has solved lots of other things in addition to these three examples.)
MM
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Toni, I am curious about the teachings of your church on this issue. Will you please do me a favor? Read Joshua 10, 28-40, down to the part about "utterly distroying all that breathed, as the Lord God of Israel commanded."Tonichelle said:
Do you think that God was really in on this, or do you think that Joshua undertook this adventure on his own and put it on God afterward?
MM