Caroline Zhang's breathtaking video

[gkelly]

At 13, Sasha finished 4th at Pacific Sectionals as an Intermediate (there was no Junior Nationals in those days).

Actually, the national competition for juveniles and intermediates started in 1991. It was originally called "Juvenile/Intermediate Nationals" which is a bit unwieldy but has the advantage of clarity. In the mid-90s, when Cohen was competing there, it was called "Junior Olympics."

http://www.usfigureskating.org/AthleteBio.asp?id=2265
Here are Cohen's early results from her USFSA bio. She was intermediate the year she turned 12, and novice the year she turned 13:

1998 State Farm U.S. Championships, Novice - 6th
1998 Pacific Coast Sectional, Novice - 2nd
1998 Southwest Pacific Regional, Novice - 2nd
1997 Junior Olympics, Intermediate - 5th
1997 Pacific Coast Sectional, Intermediate - 4th
1997 Southwest Pacific Regional, Intermediate - 2nd
1996 Southwest Pacific Regional, Juvenile - 4th (juveniles didn't go to sectionals, and only top 2 from each region went on to the national event)

 

[Mathman]

That is an interesting record, GKelly. So by these results it would look like Sasha was kind of a late bloomer. But when she hit 15 she was already in the top ranks of seniors!

 

[chuckm]

That is an interesting record, GKelly. So by these results it would look like Sasha was kind of a late bloomer. But when she hit 15 she was already in the top ranks of seniors!

Sasha started late (age 7), as she was in gymnastics before figure skating.

For comparison, Kimmie Meissner started skating at 6, was Novice champion at age 13, Junior Champion at 14, the Senior bronze medalist at 15 and World Champion at 16.

 

[iloveaxel]

Puberty Monster

I think she will survive puberty monster, her flexibility might suffer a bit, but empirical evidence is that most Asian female skaters are going to be okay after puberty monster strikes. It is also important to remember that if you have consistent jumps as a young girl, you will usually end up okay. Remember Lu Chen, I believe her body changed dramatically after puberty, but she managed to pull it off.

I really like this exhibition program the most among the three programs we saw so far. Maybe I watched too much of those two competition programs.

She was definitely more musical in this number and had started to develop her own style. It also had more speed. Those insane spirals and spins also helped! I just loved it even with a nasty fall.

 

[Mathman]

Remember Lu Chen...

Caroline has the same coach as Lulu. Caroline's biography says she can converse with her coach in both English and Chinese.

 

[iloveaxel]

Caroline has the same coach as Lulu. Caroline's biography says she can converse with her coach in both English and Chinese.

Not only do they have the same coach, Caroline is as stubborn as Lu Chen, according to some sources, sort of a rebellious type that her fragile appearance easily disguised...LOL.

It's just amazing that everybody seems to see a little sth of their favourite skater in this little girl.Sasha, MK & Luchc(wrong spelling? she actually took spin class with her according to a post). I certainly don't think she's remotely resembling Lu Chen, but some Chinese fans insist so. They think Caroline's long sliding entrance to the lutz jump is Lu Chen's trademark and it is definitely different than how most American skaters do a 'lutz'. I don't know these technical details. Maybe somebody should pick up a lu chen video clip on youtube and do a comparison!

 

[iloveaxel]

different lutz entrances

Just randomly picked up a couple of skaters. Watch the first jump of these videos(most are lutz or flutz)

Long sliding entrance(telegraphing?):
Caroline Zhang:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSWVynVs-CI
Lu Chen:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRgmj5pGZh0
Kimmie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuK-4ty8KNg

Short sliding entrance:
Sasha Cohen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeLLxwDB2Ug
Arakawa
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRxOVel6Ifg
Kwan(second jump)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMGZNCHe7G8

 

[Mathman]

Not only do they have the same coach, Caroline is as stubborn as Lu Chen, according to some sources, sort of a rebellious type that her fragile appearance easily disguised...LOL.

 

[dancindiva03]

I still don't get it. What is it you all see as being such great presentation? Her face is about as expressive as a toadstool, and she repeats the same exact arm movements over and over and over ad nauseum. The whole clenched-fist arm flinging and flailing is expressive? Being able to stick your head up your butt is expressive? Don't get me wrong, her flexibility is impressive, but its not artistic or expressive or whatever. She really, quite literally, bores me to tears. And her jump technique is rather horrendous. Her flutz is even worse than Sasha Cohen's, and I always thought Sasha was the Queen of the Flutz.

Anyway, I think it is way too early to start hyping Caroline as a future world champion or anything ridiculous as that. First of all, she could get hurt. All that extreme bending and pulling on her body can be dangerous. Second, she IS going to go through puberty. Right now, physically, she reminds me a lot of a young BeBe Liang. BeBe was very teeny tiny and then she hit puberty. She didn't grow very tall but she grew out. Not heavy, but stocky and muscular. And her consistancy on jumps hasn't been the same since. At 13 people were proclaiming BeBe as the next big thing, and where is she now? She hasn't even made it to the US Senior Ladies podium. I'm not saying that she won't make it, or that what BeBe has done so far isn't respectable, but its a far cry from what the fans were predicting. I see the same thing happening to Caroline. Maybe she will be able to work through a growth spurt, maybe she won't. Like I said, its too early to tell, and as far as I'm concerned, its too early to get all excited about another little baby ballerina wannabe.

 

[iloveaxel]

I still don't get it. What is it you all see as being such great presentation? Her face is about as expressive as a toadstool, and she repeats the same exact arm movements over and over and over ad nauseum. The whole clenched-fist arm flinging and flailing is expressive? Being able to stick your head up your butt is expressive? Don't get me wrong, her flexibility is impressive, but its not artistic or expressive or whatever. She really, quite literally, bores me to tears. And her jump technique is rather horrendous. Her flutz is even worse than Sasha Cohen's, and I always thought Sasha was the Queen of the Flutz.

Anyway, I think it is way too early to start hyping Caroline as a future world champion or anything ridiculous as that. First of all, she could get hurt. All that extreme bending and pulling on her body can be dangerous. Second, she IS going to go through puberty. Right now, physically, she reminds me a lot of a young BeBe Liang. BeBe was very teeny tiny and then she hit puberty. She didn't grow very tall but she grew out. Not heavy, but stocky and muscular. And her consistancy on jumps hasn't been the same since. At 13 people were proclaiming BeBe as the next big thing, and where is she now? She hasn't even made it to the US Senior Ladies podium. I'm not saying that she won't make it, or that what BeBe has done so far isn't respectable, but its a far cry from what the fans were predicting. I see the same thing happening to Caroline. Maybe she will be able to work through a growth spurt, maybe she won't. Like I said, its too early to tell, and as far as I'm concerned, its too early to get all excited about another little baby ballerina wannabe.

Can you please create your own thread and throw whatever garbage you have in it? Nobody is forcing you to love her, nobody is going to force us not to like her.
To be honest with you, nobody really cares about whatever you think. We are just happy, happy and happy for her and enjoy the moment.

Please don't ever come to the thread I create again, period.

 

[Piel]

I think she has a serenity about her that I like. She seems to be at one with the music..............haven't seen that since Kwan. Like Joe said in the other thread I really appreciate that she doesn't do the Lipinski jump up and down and scream thing. She also avoids the Cohen hey did you see how bendy and cute I am?

 

[dancindiva03]

Can you please create your own thread and throw whatever garbage you have in it? Nobody is forcing you to love her, nobody is going to force us not to like her.
To be honest with you, nobody really cares about whatever you think. We are just happy, happy and happy for her and enjoy the moment.

Please don't ever come to the thread I create again, period.

I never said anyone was forcing me to like her, nor did I say that no one else should NOT like her. I said I don't get the hype. And my opinion is no more "garbage" than your opinion. Honestly, though, I don't care what YOU think anymore than you care what I think. Go ahead and be happy for an emotionless, gumby little robot, I don't care, but don't tell me what I can or cannot do. This is a discussion board, its a place for people to DISCUSS things. If I want to say that Caroline is as dull as a plastic spoon then that is my right. If you don't want people with *gasp* different opinions than you, then don't post them in a public forum such as this one.

 

[chuckm]

I saw BeBe Liang at her first US Nationals, when she was 12. She was short, but not slight like Caroline. Even at 12, BeBe had what I would call a "sturdy" frame, and I was not that surprised to see her to grow into a stocky teenager.

I think it's more than a little shocking to have a poster call a 13-year-old "an emotionless, gumby little robot".

People like this are one reason why I'd hate to see Caroline go into the senior GP next year. Along with all the hype, there are the horrid detractors who can't let a 14-year old evolve naturally into graceful adulthood but insist she must arrive on the scene as a fully developed 20-year old skating diva.

 

[iloveaxel]

I never said anyone was forcing me to like her, nor did I say that no one else should NOT like her. I said I don't get the hype. And my opinion is no more "garbage" than your opinion. Honestly, though, I don't care what YOU think anymore than you care what I think. Go ahead and be happy for an emotionless, gumby little robot, I don't care, but don't tell me what I can or cannot do. This is a discussion board, its a place for people to DISCUSS things. If I want to say that Caroline is as dull as a plastic spoon then that is my right. If you don't want people with *gasp* different opinions than you, then don't post them in a public forum such as this one.

There's no need to debate you since it's worthless. Based on your constant abusive language toward her in the past, it's obvious you have your own agenda which is fine. Just as I said earlier, go ahead and create your own thread, and you can bash this little 'robot' every day, every minut and you can always find all your little joy there. I can guarantee you I won't visit your thread, can you promise me to stop visiting my thread?

 

[iloveaxel]

n/m

LOL. Some people obviously need to get a life. We have a magician who has the crystal ball to predict the dooms of our Caroline Zhang.

LOL. I just can't help laughing. This little girl has not disappointed me so far. I am just happy, happy and happy.

 

[iloveaxel]

Hater

hehe, it's absolutely hillarious. Caroline hater has indeed created his own 'joy' thread.

Well, Caroline, we still love you!! LOL.

 

[dancindiva03]

LOL. Some people obviously need to get a life. We have a magician who has the crystal ball to predict the dooms of our Caroline Zhang.

LOL. I just can't help laughing. This little girl has not disappointed me so far. I am just happy, happy and happy.

Well aparently all of you have some crystal ball to predict that Caroline WILL be the next big star, who says you're right? It could go either way. I don't have any "agenda", I just think it is absolutely ridiculous to hype this kid so much when it is obvious that success at her young age, while the body is still tiny, is not an indication of success on the Senior international level. How many other little "wonders" have we seen fall by the wayside after being hyped up but over-eager fans? Too many to count. What makes you so sure that Caroline is different? I have no problem with people enjoying her for what she is, but don't make a bigger deal out of her than she is. She won some JGP events, not the Olympics.

 

[iloveaxel]

Well aparently all of you have some crystal ball to predict that Caroline WILL be the next big star, who says you're right? It could go either way. I don't have any "agenda", I just think it is absolutely ridiculous to hype this kid so much when it is obvious that success at her young age, while the body is still tiny, is not an indication of success on the Senior international level. How many other little "wonders" have we seen fall by the wayside after being hyped up but over-eager fans? Too many to count. What makes you so sure that Caroline is different? I have no problem with people enjoying her for what she is, but don't make a bigger deal out of her than she is. She won some JGP events, not the Olympics.

Please, please stop it. This is becoming a farce. You now have your own thread, and you will have your ultimate joy there, there's no need to come back. You can say whatever you want there. But please, just leave us alone.

LOL.

 

[dancindiva03]

Please, please stop it. This is becoming a farce. You now have your own thread, and you will have your ultimate joy there, there's no need to come back. You can say whatever you want there. But please, just leave us alone.

LOL.

Its a public board. I can say what I want, where I want. Get over the fact that not everyone sees eye to eye with you and life will be a lot easier.

 

[R.D.]

LOL. Some people obviously need to get a life. We have a magician who has the crystal ball to predict the dooms of our Caroline Zhang.

LOL. I just can't help laughing. This little girl has not disappointed me so far. I am just happy, happy and happy.

FYI...I deleted that post, so I kindly ask that you remove that quote from your post, thanks

If/once you do, I'll delete this one, too.