Celebrate! Wagner's Silver Ends Drought

[drivingmissdaisy]

That was my favorite part. He sort of kept punching her! I love him. Is the blond Woman with them Mrs. Raf? Her and Ashley seem to have a great rapport.

She is his assistant coach, Nadezda Kanaeva: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadezda_Kanaeva

 

[SarahSynchro]

By the way, how has the US media taken Ashley's silver? Is it a big deal in the media or just a mention on page 6 etc? Just wondering if it takes a multiple charismatic World & Olympic winner to make skating relevant again in the US or is the silver gathering some attention. OT, I kind of rooted more for Gracie than Ashley, and I was SURE Ashley couldn't land all the jumps etc so I was SURE Gracie would medal- I was proven very wrong..and I do find her inspiring, she's had so many obstacles, starting from the fact that I presume that most of her career she wasn't considered being anywhere near World podium based on her talent, but hard work sometimes pays off. And obviously she is also talented, just not the most talented.

From what I've read, the American media seems to be all over Ashley's silver medal win with positivity.

A few articles I've seen have focused on Ashley as the main storyline, with a couple of sentences towards the end that were along the lines of: "Oh, some sixteen year old Russian chick got the gold medal... And we think she may have set some sort of world record? But now, back to talking about Ashley!"

Another similar article was about ice dance, which said: "the Americans are the best country in the world for ice dance with two teams on the world podium!", yet failed to mention P/C's epic gold medal win and free dance world record.

 

[skylark]

Well i know we like a movie of the week of triumph over tragedy but lets not make ashley something she isn't lol. Gutsy skater, amazing confidence and fighting spirit but it is not like she came back from a huge deficit or the amount of negativity like Maria Butyrskaya wo actually won the world title. AShley still has been touted one of two or three Americans to end the drought and she did. She worked hard of course. She has great skating skill especially right now against such young and undeveloped physically ladies or girls. She should be proud of herself just as Gracie should be proud too - so close to a medal and it was not like she spent all her time on her butt. But give to Ash she skated well when it counted against several other good skates.

Ashley's win isn't a triumph over tragedy, and I didn't say or even imply that it is.

I do think it's important to recognize that this has not been an easy road for her. She's feisty, and she uses negative comments as motivation to do better and prove her critics wrong. That doesn't mean that all the negatives and the criticism haven't hurt her.

Ashley has been very inspiring to me, beginning about 18 months ago when I saw that she was actually changing her technique to improve her jumps and transitions, at age 23, which is not the same thing as changing your technique at age 16, although I understand that could never be described as "easy" at any age; habit is strong in this sport. She always had performance ability in spades, and musical and character interpretation that is very unusual, and makes a difference to many. I wasn't a fan of hers until SA 2013, when I saw her in person, and like many others I was impressed by her presence on the ice. She reaches out to far corners of the arena.

Perhaps I went a tad overboard to say she's an inspiration to all. She's an inspiration to many. Perhaps not to people for whom things like good technique came more easily or at a younger age. Perhaps not to anyone who gets by on talent for a long time, although she may have done so as a teenager, I'm not sure.

One of my favorite Jeopardy contestants retired from his career as a physician at age 65, went to law school and then signed on as junior partner and medical expert in his son's law firm.

So that's what I mean. To people in all walks of life who think they're too old, or too untalented or too late, to do something new, Ashley is a huge inspiration. I stand by this.

 

[skylark]

Ashley in general is very cool at interviews, I remember this from Barcelona too, always a little joke here and there, it´s very natural what she comes up with, not staged if you know what I mean?

Absolutely. :agree:

Now that you say this, I wonder if this ability to be spontaneous in answering questions isn't related to how she naturally relates to people in the audience and reaches out to them. Like Javier Fernandez, who came up with one of my favorite quotes of the WC. He said, "I think people enjoyed it" (his skate), "and to me that's the most important thing."

 

[skylark]

So nice to see a celebration for Ashley! What an accomplishment to her! A silver medal in a competition where the level of skating was so high has to be the best feeling in the world. And how nice that there is no real judging controvery! She can relax and feel good knowing that medal is hers fair and square. I really think that shes going to use this as motivation and come roaring back with next season totally ready to continue to show us what a true champion she is.
I hope she has a little break in there after Stars on Ice and Team Challenge Cup to celebrate and relax Nobody deserves it more

Exactly. :dance: :hap57: :hap93:

 

[R.D.]

Glad someone was able to break the drought! It just wasn't who I thought it'd be. Gold was going to do it anyway with the bronze but Wagner one-upped her with silver :yes: (which had the unfortunate side effect of pushing Gold OTP completely)

Not sure I'd say flood the drought - perhaps if BOTH Gold and Wagner medaled.

My impressions from being in the arena watching her skate are reproduced below:

On the ladies event, all 3 US ladies brought the house down during their SPs. During the free skate, the crowd roared for Gold as she came on the ice, and even when she landed her first jump of the 3-3 opening combo. Then when she fell on the 2nd one, there was a MASSIVE "OH" sigh from the audience - and it almost felt like the air was taken out of the building. I think we all WANTED a reason to go crazy and were just waiting for that "moment" which we did not get from her. Gold still got a good cheer for her skate, some people stood. (I did not.) Then Wagner took the ice, also to a nice roar (if not maybe QUITE as enthusiastic as the one initially given to Gold). As Wagner successfully hit her opening combo, the energy was back in full force and man, I knew that if she sold this program the place was going to explode. With every jump she hit, the moment built and built. The roars grew louder every time. When she finished her last jump the atmosphere was electric. It's unlike anything I've ever experienced or have been a part of. We were all on our feet before she even finished. You couldn't even hear her music at the end, the place was THAT loud. I actually got a little bit emotional , it was a very special moment not just for her, but I think for all of us as US fans as well. As in, FINALLY a US lady delivered when it counted most. This was gonna be it. The drought was going to end and we're witnessing a part of history. The only thing we didn't know was what color her medal would be (although it almost certainly wasn't going to be gold after Med's record-setting effort a moment earlier). The look on Wagner's face, and the reaction of the crowd, the rush of energy we all felt when it was announced she was in 2nd place, I'll NEVER forget that moment. That one will stay with me for the rest of my "skatefan" life.

It's a moment I'll never forget.

 

[skylark]

By the way, how has the US media taken Ashley's silver? Is it a big deal in the media or just a mention on page 6 etc? Just wondering if it takes a multiple charismatic World & Olympic winner to make skating relevant again in the US or is the silver gathering some attention. OT, I kind of rooted more for Gracie than Ashley, and I was SURE Ashley couldn't land all the jumps etc so I was SURE Gracie would medal- I was proven very wrong..and I do find her inspiring, she's had so many obstacles, starting from the fact that I presume that most of her career she wasn't considered being anywhere near World podium based on her talent, but hard work sometimes pays off. And obviously she is also talented, just not the most talented.

In TSL interview, Christine Brennan said that her publication's story (USA Today) on Monday might have been less prominent without Ashley's win. Or possibly only online. As it is, it also appeared in the subscribed print edition which reaches 2 or 3 million locations. (I think that's accurate.)

A silver medal after ten years is a big deal here. Maybe it would be almost anywhere.

 

[skylark]

Glad someone was able to break the drought! It just wasn't who I thought it'd be. Gold was going to do it anyway with the bronze but Wagner one-upped her with silver :yes: (which had the unfortunate side effect of pushing Gold OTP completely)

Not sure I'd say flood the drought - perhaps if BOTH Gold and Wagner medaled.

You're so right! I actually tried to change my thread title, but I didn't know how to do it, and it was 3 a.m. so . I'll change it now if someone will tell me how.

It's a moment I'll never forget.

OMG, I love your whole post! What thread was it originally in?

 

[R.D.]

OMG, I love your whole post! What thread was it originally in?

It's an excerpt from a post regarding highlights from my Boston trip. In the "On-Site Reports" thread in the WC2016 forum.

 

[janav]

I greatly admire Ashley and I kind of look up to her, which might be weird considering I'm older and chose very, very different career path. But that sheer determination and hard work which brought her success (and I would consider her succesful even without that medal) is something that makes me think more possitively about what I can accomplish in my own career. Ashley is a great skater, but for me, she's also wonderful rolemodel and that's what I love about her. I wish Ash lot of happiness and I hope she'll wow me with a lot more skates like this. Go Diva Wagner!

 

[jenaj]

Ashley is a very good competitor. She has shown that time and again. One of her most memorable performances for me was at the GPF in 2015, where she was 6th after the short but pulled herself up to a bronze medal with, for the first time, a 3lutz-3T and a 3sal-seq-3 combo.

 

[apgold]

So thrilled for Ashley! Christine Brennan said a lot about what I felt during her TSL recap with Dave.

For Ashley to do this at an age when most skaters competitive careers are over was an amazing feat, and her story about not giving up and giving into naysayers shows what strong, spirited person she is.

Ashley may never be a technical marvel, but she's got charisma in spades and is the best performer out there of the ladies.

I was also happy to get my "Red Lipstick for Ashley" button from Patrick (of Patrick Commentates Skating) and wear it proudly during the freeskate, lol.

 

[Krunchii]

I'm so proud of Ashley, as she said before, you can teach an old dog new tricks, I can add her to my list of late bloomers who had to adjust to the CoP demands and did so successfully such as Akiko Suzuki and Carolina Kostner. It was not easy for her to go out there as the last skater with so many expectations and skate like that. She really worked her way up from the bottom working in retail, and having to move to change coaches really develop as a skater. What a great success story she is and I can't wait to see what else she has in store for us.

 

[skylark]

Ashley is a very good competitor. She has shown that time and again. One of her most memorable performances for me was at the GPF in 2015, where she was 6th after the short but pulled herself up to a bronze medal with, for the first time, a 3lutz-3T and a 3sal-seq-3 combo.

Oh, I adore that 3loop+1loop+3salchow. That and her 3loop single jump. Ashley does them so beautifully, and her artistic expression during and before them just take the jumps to a whole 'nother level.

Did you notice that her 3Lo-1Lo-3sal was the highest scoring element in the entire competition? Somewhere over 12 points. That just shows what a brilliant strategy it was to put it together. And I'm with you, I was thrilled, and surprised, by that GPF skate.

 

[skylark]

i think suggesting Ashley's programs or skate was a choreography genius or masterpiece is a bit much. i mean the odds are it would have been recongnized much earlier on ie 2010 fd of Virute and moir. don't misunderstand me moulin rouge was wonderful but in life you can truly have few special programs otherwise there is no specialness but thd norm. Ashley did wonderful and the us has waited long and patiently for a medal anda sp ot on the podium which they use to own. But let's not get too crazy. Ashley's skates were well done, very nice, solid, confident, done with great aplomb, wonderful maturity and style, great power and speed and wonderful finish. The world or the us had been waiting for this from h er. But a masterpiece or some program that stood out in history probably not at the top - many of kwan's even cohen's would suprass this not to mention mao, yuna, joannie, liz manley, katarina witt, Adelina's olympic program, julia, dorothy hamill, peggy flemming, yamaguchi, hughes, maria b, irina, lipiniski, midori ito, certainly she is the it girl of the moment But in comparison to other great skates this one will find it tough qualifying so to speak. But that being said kudos to Ashley

The thing is, I don't agree with your list of skaters who are better than Ashley. That said, I don't think that way. I enjoy (or don't enjoy) each skater and each performance for themselves, and I don't feel the need to define them as you do.

But if I did feel the need to rank them, I wouldn't necessarily rank them as you do, because figure skating isn't objective. If it were, we would only need one umpire or referee to decide who's best.

All of us, whether judges or lay people, are human beings who each get to decide what skating qualities we value and what performance qualities we value.

 

[SarahSynchro]

That's awesome that it was the highest scoring element of the competition! As I have experience as singles skater (obviously nowhere near Ashley's level, but I had most of my doubles, lol), I assume that a 3Lo-1Lo-3S is a lot more difficult than a 3Lz-3T, because the takeoff doesn't involve a toepick hitting the ice, but rather, it's all in the edges.

Just a personal pet peeve: I wish they could put half loops in the system as 0.5Lo, hahah. Half loops look nothing like single loops.

 

[sc8]

 

[skylark]

That's awesome that it was the highest scoring element of the competition! As I have experience as singles skater (obviously nowhere near Ashley's level, but I had most of my doubles, lol), I assume that a 3Lo-1Lo-3S is a lot more difficult than a 3Lz-3T, because the takeoff doesn't involve a toepick hitting the ice, but rather, it's all in the edges.

Just a personal pet peeve: I wish they could put half loops in the system as 0.5Lo, hahah. Half loops look nothing like single loops.

That's interesting. I'm pretty sure I've heard announcers say 3Lz-3T is the "most difficult jump in the competition." And I've wondered. Johnny Weir always takes the opportunity to say that that combination is very difficult, and in Ashley's case, very beautiful. I wish I could tell the difference between half loop and single loop!

 

[StitchMonkey]

That's interesting. I'm pretty sure I've heard announcers say 3Lz-3T is the "most difficult jump in the competition." And I've wondered. Johnny Weir always takes the opportunity to say that that combination is very difficult, and in Ashley's case, very beautiful. I wish I could tell the difference between half loop and single loop!

Most would likely agree the 3Z+3T is the "most difficult" for the ladies, but that does not mean it will be the highest scoring element.

As for the difference between a half and single loop. A "single loop" will take off and land on the same foot or to sound more technical the same backwards outside edge as the takeoff. A "half loop" lands on the opposite foot to the one they take off from. Since skaters go into a Salchow/flip from the half loop, it seems they land it on an inside edge of the opposite foot to take off - i have no knowledge as to the reason for this, if it is physics, a rule or a choice. Anyway, just look for if the jump lands on the same foot or the opposite foot it take off from, that should help.

 

[SarahSynchro]

Personally I actually found the lutz to be easier than the salchow, but again, that could just be me. Generally skaters will learn jumps in this order: waltz, toe loop, salchow, loop, flip, lutz, axel - then repeat that order for doubles (minus the waltz jump, as a waltz is technically a "half axel"), and again for triples, and in the case of the men, again for quads.

I think the reasoning behind the lutz being the most difficult jump is because you go into it on a backwards outside edge, but after you put your toe pick in the ice to launch the jump, you then have to twist your body in the opposite direction of the back outside edge when rotating in the air. The other jumps all rotate in the same direction in the air as their setup edge.

I think a 3Lz-3Lo would actually be more difficult than a 3Lz-3T, mainly because even the most skilled skaters can't seem to fully rotate the 3Lo in combination. Mao, Sarah Hughes and Irina all come to mind.