- Joined
- Aug 4, 2003
If Brian thinks the Quad is everything about skating, then he, Evan Lyscacek and Tim Goebel can feel free to go along with Evan's XGames idea and have a quad contest. Otherwise they need to come to grips with COP.
I don't completely agree. For the last few years his 3A has become one of his most solid jumps, it's only this season that he's been having trouble with it, but that seems due to lack of training because of his illness, like his other jumps.
Hi everyone, I've been a lurker for a while but decided to register to hop in on this discussion. For the record, I'm a Joubert fan who thought Buttle should have won but not by such a large margin.
What bothers me about the direction this debate is taking is the implication that a skater can either be a soulless quad machine or an artistic skater who can't quite do certain jumps. I'd rather combine the points I think Joubert and Buttle were getting at: that an elite skater should be doing the hardest jumps - those being quads - but that these should be part of a complete repertoire of skating skills and elements. It's not mutually exclusive - just more difficult.
I've been reading quite a few posts about Buttle "finally" bringing artistry back, which I don't get: even if one dislikes Joubert or even Plushenko, I don't think it can be argued that Lambiel, Takahashi or, to go a few years back, Yagudin, were doing quads at the expense of their presentation.
If Brian thinks the Quad is everything about skating, then he, Evan Lyscacek and Tim Goebel can feel free to go along with Evan's XGames idea and have a quad contest. Otherwise they need to come to grips with COP.
I just looked at the LP protocols and they both appear to have gotten the same levels for their step sequences, with almost identical GOEs. I didn't notice that before. Buttle did get better levels for his spins. But the differences in base value are so small for spins - it looks like it was the combinations & 2nd axel that clinched it for him.Brian's quad and jump quality should have reduced the margin between them, but because buttle did three combos whereas Brian only did 2 (one of them being a 2A-1T), and Jeff having better spins and footwork, he deserved his gold medal.
I just looked at the LP protocols and they both appear to have gotten the same levels for their step sequences, with almost identical GOEs. I didn't notice that before. Buttle did get better levels for his spins. But the differences in base value are so small for spins - it looks like it was the combinations & 2nd axel that clinched it for him.
Kudos to Jeff Buttle for winning the World Championship.
Just to add a dose of reality, wasn't this the first time that Jeff skated a clean FS? I can't recall any other over the past five years.
So my question is: can Jeff repeat this performance and successfully defend his title? If Joubert and Weir maximize their TES with quads, quad combos and 3-jump combos, can a clean Buttle skate still beat them?
Presumably, Jeff will have a new FS next season and he won't have the benefit of a second year with the same music and choreography. That could make it more difficult for him to deliver a clean skate.
He seems to be their pet.
Well, Joubert can just land 3 quads and forget about everything else and the judes would still reward him the gold. He seems to be their pet.
Yeah, I agree. I was wondering where these PCSs coming from. Yes, he has the speed and power and he has greatly improved in in-betweens. But still, he can't possibly exceed Jeff's presentation.
Joubert doesn't have to 'exceed Jeff's presentation' if he can land 2 quads and max out his combinations. If he did that, Joubert's PCS would go way up in SS and PE.
I meant Joubert's skating skills compared to Buttle's, not to Takahashi's.
But if Joubert could do 3 quads in a program (4T, 4T+3T, 4S) as he's done before, he'd even top Takahashi.
his final combo spin L3.