Marshalls Cheesefest Question - Not a competition?

[attyfan]

...
Joesitz - You are 100% correct - until now, the USFSA spring-cheesefest was ALWAYS a competition.

Phony manipulators! They deserve crappy ratings.

First, who do you think did the manipulation? The sponsors might have been told that certain skaters (such as Michelle) it would not do a competition; it would be the sponsor's choice to change the format or do without the "big names".

Second -- and more important -- if the ratings were crappy on a show with the big names, do you think the ratings would have been better with a competition, without them? Kwan is not yet recovered enough to compete; Lambiel and/or Arakawa are too injured/tired; etc.

I agree with leon -- it is too harsh to use the term "phony manipulators" to describe a decision to run an event that was advertised as an exhibtion from the outset (as opposed to the December jokefest) simply because other sponsors in the past chose to run it as a competition.

 

[Lonewolf]

For those who are wondering here are some links to the previous ‘Spring Challenges/Showcase’:

2000 International Figure Skating Challenge

2001 ABC Sports Great American Figure Skating Challenge

2002 Hershey's Kisses Great American Figure Skating Challenge

2003 ABC Sports International Figure Skating Challenge

2004 Marshalls World Skating Challenge

2005 Marshalls U.S. Figure Skating Challenge

2006 Marshalls U.S. Figure Skating International Showcase

 

[Mathman]

Thanks for doing the research, Lonewolf. That puts this "tradition" of the spring competition into perspective.

Only in 2003 and 2004 was this event billed as a legitimate international competition, with ISU judges and the whole ball of wax.

In 2003 Michelle won over Fumie, Sasha, Ann Patrice , Irina, Elena S., Shizuka and Sarah H. Plushenko won for the men. (Winners got a $50,000 purse, IIRC.)

In 2004, Sasha won, followed by Shiz, Michelle, Miki A., Slute, Kimmie and Fumie. (Plushenko again for the men.)

2005 was a real competition, but with only U.S. skaters invited. (Michelle and Lysacek won.)

All the previous events were some kind of phoney-baloney team thing.

2000 -- Team USA (with Kristi Yamaguchi) lost to the International team led by Kartarina Witt.

2001 -- Teams of 1 boy + 1 girl, or 1 singles skater + 1 pairs or dance team competed. Michelle and Matt Savoie won, with Angela Nikodinov and Lang and Tcherychev second.

2002 -- Boys against the girls. (Boys won.)

So this "tradition" of the big season-closing competition lasted only two years, 2003 and 2004.

I can see why the skaters didn't really want to do it. They were exhausted, injured, bummed out, whatever, after the long grueling season -- plus, COI had already started and they had to squeeze this exhibition in between stops on the tour.

MM

 

[curious]

So I was right - something IS fishy! The only way to get Michelle to the show is to take away the competition aspect. Phonies!!! Also, I suspect that the only way to get the Olympic & World champs to participate was to ensure that there would be no embarrasing loss against those who rank behind them. I mean, if Sasha or Irina, for example, would have beaten Shiz and Kimmie at the Cheesefest, then it would have had a negative effect on the marketing 'sparkle' of the reigning champs (and would have given Sasha & Irina a chance to toot their trumpets...). Why ruin a potential one-year 'reign' as Queen of Ice by a stupid loss in a Cheesefest?

Joesitz - You are 100% correct - until now, the USFSA spring-cheesefest was ALWAYS a competition.

Phony manipulators! They deserve crappy ratings.

I totally:agree:

 

[Mathman]

I don't understand the charge of "phony." They said they were putting on an exhibition. They put on an exhibition. (?)

 

[jozmen01]

They deserve crappy ratings.

Yes, there probably were crappy ratings - no NASCAR - they are off for Easter, but the BUSCH series race was on at the same time.

Thought people might like to know!

 

[Piel]

Maybe the Marshall folks LIKE Irina and Sasha and didn't want to put them in the position to LOSE three competitions in a row. Just another way of looking at it.

 

[R.D.]

Actually for Irina it would be her second (?)...she won Euros but lost Olympics. She skipped worlds, so therefore it doesn't count.

 

[Piel]

You're right RD., thanks! Olympics, World, Euros... without the Kween they all seemed the same, LOL.

 

[R.D.]

yeah. For Cohen you're right on, though. She lost Olys and Worlds.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Sasha won the silver at the Olys and bronze at the Worlds. those are winning medals.

Joe

 

[Frau Muller]

I have my print-out of Heather's TV-alerts list from two weeks ago. At that time, it was STILL being advertised as a COMPETITION. The phonies played 'switcheroo' on us just at the last moment, turning this into an exhibition.

I still say: PHONIES!!!

 

[Mathman]

Well, they were competing for the hearts of the audience.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

The questions for enquiring minds:

Will Campbells turn into a big show, so that MK can will not have to worry about being judged for jumps?

Will there be any senseless gimmics for the Marshall's pre-Nats Worlds?

Will there be a post-Worlds Marshalls' competition or another big show?

Joe

 

[attyfan]

The questions for enquiring minds:

Will Campbells turn into a big show, so that MK can will not have to worry about being judged for jumps?

Will there be any senseless gimmics for the Marshall's pre-Nats Worlds?

Will there be a post-Worlds Marshalls' competition or another big show?

Joe

The answers:

(1) I doubt it. If MK is able to jump, she will compete. If not, then expect a huge retirement gala at SA or Nats.

(2) Aren't there always?

(3) Depends. I think a post-Worlds competition might do better in non-Oly years, simply because the stress is reduced. However, if there are as many skaters who were fighting illness or injury by Worlds next year as there were this year, then maybe an exhibition will be the way to go.

 

[MKbeauty]

re. Cheesefests

The questions for enquiring minds:

Will Campbells turn into a big show, so that MK can will not have to worry about being judged for jumps?

The format changes really have nothing to do with Michelle. USFS has a new marketing director who wants to try some different things to generate some interest/bring in new fans. I actually heard about the new format for the winter cheesefest from a friend who attended Skate America. This person was speaking with Evan Lysack, and he told her they would be trying something fun and different. So "Skating Idol" was in the planning BEFORE Michelle withdrew from Skate America.

And is it any wonder they changed the format for the spring cheesefest after a long Olympic season? I'm sure the last thing the skaters wanted to participate in was another competition (especially with most facing a 3 1/2 month tour with COI). Besides, If they really wanted to have a competition and still have Michelle there, they could just ask her to do an exhibition like B&A have been doing the past few years. That's what Shizuka will be doing for the Japan Open in May.

 

[Mathman]

Joe, sadly, I think your questions will prove prophetic.

As you know, I had great hopes that somehow the cheesefest cycle could be made into a series of showcase competitions for the Kwan/Slutskaya/Suguri generation of skaters. It seemed to me that they were headed in that direction in the 2003 and 2004 seasons.

This would (in my mind, LOL) be kind of mid-way between amateur and pro. They would feature serious competion among the most brilliant stars of the game, but it would use 6.0 judging and leave the new tricks to the youngsters.

To me, in terms of audience appeal, thiese events could have rivaled and even surpassed the ISU contests such as the Grand Prix events.

But now, I am afraid it is too late. Michelle in particular showed no interest in starting up a new venture. And now all those skaters are on their last legs. To me, it was a missed opportunity to do something bold and exciting.

Now, I think you're right. We will see more and more exhibition-style events, boys against the girls team things, skating with your favorite Disney cartoon character -- all we can hope for is no more of the audience voting format.

MM

 

[Piel]

What's wrong with the audience voting format, just for fun? Everyone knows it is a popularity contest from the start so what's the harm? If it means we get to see more of the skaters we love I say open the phone lines. Remember some of us don't get SOI or COI in our towns:banging:. American Idol got better ratings than the Olys. So if the AI or similar format means the networks will show more skating I think we should take it and be thankful that SOMEBODY is interested in broadcasting figure skating.

 

[attyfan]

What's wrong with the audience voting format, just for fun? Everyone knows it is a popularity contest from the start so what's the harm? If it means we get to see more of the skaters we love I say open the phone lines. Remember some of us don't get SOI or COI in our towns:banging:. American Idol got better ratings than the Olys. So if the AI or similar format means the networks will show more skating I think we should take it and be thankful that SOMEBODY is interested in broadcasting figure skating.

My only problem with "Skating Idol" was the non-counting votes of the commentators. I think it would be a great idea to have the event, with all skaters skating one program, and two trophies in both the men's and the ladies event. One would be the "People's Choice" trophy; the other would be the "Critics Choice" trophy.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

MM and Piel - The Cheesfests as they were before MK couldn't do them legitimately were never serious except for the prize money. As for skating they were good dress rehearsals for their new programs (the tweaking to begin!).

MK continues to draw the crowd. How long that will last will be when the new young fans have nothing to say about a lady who doesn't really compete well. Why not just let the Cheesefests continue as a Big Show.

Some fans of MK are pretty much of the die hard type, and would love her to compete but failing that, they just want to see her skate a program. I'm not against that. But I do prefer straightforward competitions as the sport demands and no variations on a theme. No gender benders, no wars, no presentations only, just old fashion competitions and having a winner who was the best that night.

Joe