Misha Ge out with Injury from 4CC

[StitchMonkey]

True, I'm pretty sure that Jason was only trying to complete a quad toe and he still got injured. Like many have said, some sports are a dangerous activity and there's no way around it. I remember watching that guy go flying off the ski jump at the beginning of Wide World Of Sports every week and they didn't stop that event.

Here's the intro from WWOS and it includes both Tara and Todd as part of the "Thrill Of Victory" and it has the clip of the guy falling off the ski ramp.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjlni3aez8E

Not really actually. It took him about a week after landing the 4T to post a clip of him landing a 4t+3t. On top of that he has been working on the 4S for awhile now as well. So no he was not only trying for that one quad.

 

[mrrice]

That's very interesting. I always hated Sal's and it's the only jump I was ever afraid of doing. I tweaked my knee during early attempts at landing it and begged my coach never to include one in my programs.

 

[Mathman]

my point is mostly about shifting the focus to other elements., so a skater who doesn't have quads can be rewarded significantly for other elements. .. even a layback position can hurt someone's back ... but one will not lose a chance to podium because they don't have a great layback..

Michelle Kwan is an example. When the CoP first came out she tried to train the contortionist spins that the Code of Points seemed to require. This hurt her back. So she went back to simpler spins and tried to focus on quality, hoping that GOE would make up for lower levels.

It didn't. Although she actually competed only once under the IJS, she always knew that she was giving up points to the other ladies in this area.

That's very interesting. I always hated Sal's...

In this you have the company of Oly champ Kristi Yamaguchi.

 

[mrrice]

Here's my feeling about quads. In my very deepest feeling on the matter....I don't think eliminating them will change things at the top of the sport. Patrick Chan would still be World Champion in a "Quadless" Universe due to his skating skills. I love Adam Rippon and if he and Patrick had equal quad free programs, I still think Patrick would beat him. IMO, the only thing that Adam does better than Patrick is spin. In fact, Adam spins better than most of the Men in skating. Well, and that butt of his..

 

[Interspectator]

Since Banning quads all together is out of the question (I think?), how would one promote other aspects of the sport to make the whole sport more balanced?

Possibilities include:
1. Give more points to spins?
2. Give more points to step-sequences?
3. Give fewer points to quads? (I wouldn't be in favor of this)
4. Take quads out of all junior events?
5. Raise the PCS Factor to roughly match the TES? (this might be a good Idea except that judges could continue to use PCS to put the front-runners so far out of sight of the second tier that they'd all be fighting for bronze or something, and they wouldn't necessarily be 'wrong' because the front runners are well rounded and actually have the points for the highest PCS)
6. Make a push to use GOE's and PCS in the way they were meant...not favoring skaters who can jump quads...(the judge who gave Grant all 9's at NHK had the right idea) 'on paper' it seems that the current judging system would be fair with a few tweaks, but the reality is the quad jumpers seem to get a boost in PCS (like Kovtun and Boyang) if they were more strict in grading things like transitions and skating skills and choreography, then the balance wouldn't be so off? I don't have anything against Boyang and Kovtun, but they do have some glaring holes in their all-around skating.

 

[Interspectator]

Here's my feeling about quads. In my very deepest feeling on the matter....I don't think eliminating them will change things at the top of the sport. Patrick Chan would still be World Champion in a "Quadless" Universe due to his skating skills. I love Adam Rippon and if he and Patrick had equal quad free programs, I still think Patrick would beat him. IMO, the only thing that Adam does better than Patrick is spin. In fact, Adam spins better than most of the Men in skating. Well, and that butt of his..

Objection! In a quadless universe the 3A would be the hardest jump and therefore the person who could couple artistry with a flawless 3A (plus difficult transitions) would be World Champion.
I present to you: http://45.media.tumblr.com/6914c2a68fbb54af65bc828b88f61e84/tumblr_o11ya4LhJb1rm6ftfo1_500.gif
Or, Joshua Farris, Or Han Yan, Or Denis Ten :yay:

Actually, Han Yan is out cause his spins are atrocious. However, Joshua and Denis have great spins along with Yuzu.

 

[mrrice]

Objection! In a quadless universe the 3A would be the hardest jump and therefore the person who could couple artistry with a flawless 3A (plus difficult transitions) would be World Champion.
I present to you: http://45.media.tumblr.com/6914c2a68fbb54af65bc828b88f61e84/tumblr_o11ya4LhJb1rm6ftfo1_500.gif
Or, Joshua Farris, Or Han Yan, Or Denis Ten :yay:

Actually, Han Yan is out cause his spins are atrocious. However, Joshua and Denis have great spins along with Yuzu.

First...I love Objection. It really is difficult for someone like me, who tends to lock onto a favorite. If not for the return of Patrick, I would probably skip Worlds as ALL my favorites are out with Injuries. Joshua, Jason and Misha are the skaters I was looking forward to seeing after their stellar seasons last year. I like but, have not seen Denis ten or Javi this season and will need to go to Youtube so I can catch up on how things went at Europeans.

 

[Mathman]

^ Go to see Shoma Uno.

 

[Interspectator]

First...I love Objection. It really is difficult for someone like me, who tends to lock onto a favorite. If not for the return of Patrick, I would probably skip Worlds as ALL my favorites are out with Injuries. Joshua, Jason and Misha are the skaters I was looking forward to seeing after their stellar seasons last year. I like but, have not seen Denis ten or Javi this season and will need to go to Youtube so I can catch up on how things went at Europeans.

Denis will compete at 4CC with a new long program...My favorite Javi SP so far is his COC SP and his best LP was at GPF.

 

[Interspectator]

^ Go to see Shoma Uno.

yes! Shoma too.

 

[mrrice]

Denis will compete at 4CC with a new long program...My favorite Javi SP so far is his COC SP and his best LP was at GPF.

Ok, Thanks. I'm outta here to get watching.....

OK People...Javi's doing "Guys and Dolls" I can't believe I didn't know that. I remember saying that someone should skate to Luck Be A Lady Tonight a while ago. He sure is a great skater and very handsome....

I just watched Shoma Uno......Wow. Kurt Browning called him a "Pocket Rocket"

Well, I just watched Denis' LP from Skate America and it was a bit frightening so, if someone has a link to a better performance, I'd love to see it. He sure is well packaged though. I love his costumes. Masculine and unique.

 

[Mathman]

Since Banning quads all together is out of the question (I think?), how would one promote other aspects of the sport to make the whole sport more balanced?

Possibilities include:
1. Give more points to spins?
2. Give more points to step-sequences?
3. Give fewer points to quads? (I wouldn't be in favor of this)
4. Take quads out of all junior events?
5. Raise the PCS Factor to roughly match the TES? (this might be a good Idea except that judges could continue to use PCS to put the front-runners so far out of sight of the second tier that they'd all be fighting for bronze or something, and they wouldn't necessarily be 'wrong' because the front runners are well rounded and actually have the points for the highest PCS)

It'a tricky. If we did 1, 2, and 5, while leaving base values of jumps alone, that would have the same practical effect as lowering the values of jumps. The ISU is committed to a point system that, above all, assigns the most points to the elements of greatest difficulty. Elements like spins are relatively "easy." A beautiful[/] spin is hard because of the the beautiful part, not because of the required technique.

6. Make a push to use GOE's and PCS in the way they were meant...not favoring skaters who can jump quads...(the judge who gave Grant all 9's at NHK had the right idea)…

6'. Give Grant automatic 9's whenever he takes the ice. Especially in CH and INT.

 

[Interspectator]

Denis Ten's going to have a completely different LP anyway, but Golden Spin is where he did a nearly clean program.

 

[4everchan]

LOL Objection

in a quadless WC, more importance would be given to the 3Lz too 3a and 3lz would be both repeated jumps

Objection! In a quadless universe the 3A would be the hardest jump and therefore the person who could couple artistry with a flawless 3A (plus difficult transitions) would be World Champion.
I present to you: http://45.media.tumblr.com/6914c2a68fbb54af65bc828b88f61e84/tumblr_o11ya4LhJb1rm6ftfo1_500.gif
Or, Joshua Farris, Or Han Yan, Or Denis Ten :yay:

Actually, Han Yan is out cause his spins are atrocious. However, Joshua and Denis have great spins along with Yuzu.

 

[Mathman]

in a quadless WC, more importance would be given to the 3Lz too 3a and 3lz would be both repeated jumps

Those are the two coolest jumps for men anyway. :yes:

(For ladies, the triple loop. Except for the chronic hip injuries thing. )

 

[Interspectator]

In an upside down world where Performance and Presentation were more heavily weighted than technique/quads in scores, Deniss Vasiljevs would be the hot, new upstart challenging for the podium in his senior debut.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slK78pH4CTs

 

[4everchan]

my ultimate favorite jump will always be the 3Lz for both men and women

Those are the two coolest jumps for men anyway. :yes:

(For ladies, the triple loop. Except for the chronic hip injuries thing. )

 

[mrrice]

Those are the two coolest jumps for men anyway. :yes:

(For ladies, the triple loop. Except for the chronic hip injuries thing. )

I agree about 3loop for the ladies. I always thought it was amazing that of all the jump combinations that Caroline Zhang would master that the Triple Loop, Triple Loop would be the one.

 

[4everchan]

3L-3L is a cool one

I agree about 3loop for the ladies. I always thought it was amazing that of all the jump combinations that Caroline Zhang would master that the Triple Loop, Triple Loop would be the one.

 

[Mathman]

my ultimate favorite jump will always be the 3Lz for both men and women

I hesitate for the ladies because there are so few that can actually do a quality triple Lutz. It's cool for men because many of them can get way down on that deep outside edge, then explode into the air.