No Nats for Lysacek this season

[Tonichelle]

AFAIK the skaters are not compensated for photos taken by the USFSA to be used in USFSA publications... the pics that the skaters provide for the program at nationals is, likewise, without compensation.

 

[Mathman]

For instance, if you wanted to know who won junior ice dance at the 1943 nationals, you would find that on page 161 , (Dorthy Glazier and Lyman Wakefield)

OK. so naturally I had to look up Glazier and Wakefield. Dorothy Glazier also won the 1940 title (with a different partner) and Lyman Wakefield won the fours competition as part of the renowned "St. Paul Fours"). As far as I can tell Glazier never skated in seniors, but went straight for the lucrative pro circuit.

1940. The graceful art of figure skating as an avocation and as a vocation is growing rapidly in the United States, as may be seen in the increasing number of skating clubs in all parts of the country and in the number of both amateur and professional ice carnivals. These ice revues are taking the most talented girl skaters as fast as they are developed from the amateur ranks for a novel source of entertainment that embraced one hundred huge extravaganzas produced by six professional show groups in 1940. The four ice carnivals staged in the Madison Square Garden, New York, including the Skating Club of New York (amateur) revue, were seen by more than 255,000 people.

http://astheysawit.com/1102-1940-skating-figure-and-speed.html

Here is an article about Lyman's contributions to the sport.

http://www.tcfsa.org/RinkLink/rinklink0302.pdf

 

[Tonichelle]

are you this easy to get off subject in your classroom, MM???

 

[Mathman]

I am, I am! Nine times out of ten if a student asks a question, that turns out to be more interesting than the lecture I had planned.

 

[Tonichelle]

speaking of lectures, remember how when I was in high school/colleges I loathed factors - now Duane's doing factoring... and he's mad that I won't help him - even now I still don't get that stupid part of math... I don't think dad is doing a bad job but I don't think he's teaching it right, either. you need to fly up here ASAP.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Other fun filled facts....Page 171....the 10th best Pairs free skate score in the US as of Aug 1 2011 is held by Brooke Castile and Ben Okolski, a 116.12 at the 2008 US Nats.....
(When asked about the worst thing about figure skating at the Lake Placid SkateAmerica Friends of Figure Skating breakfast, Brooke said, "Well, Ben won't let me eat!" The room
exploaded.....) By the way, Brooke is hot hot hot.....

MM, how could anything be more interesting than Orthogonal Functions????

 

[museksk8r]

I agree. He thought the USFSA and ISU would be head over heels with joy to have him back and throwing big bucks his way to keep him. As it turns out he couldnt have possibly been more mistaken. Everyone has moved on and had enough of him. He will make much more money as a professional than he ever will again as an amateur. He has come to his senses and abandoned his comeback which will never going to go well in any sense, competitively or otherwise. After this season you wont hear anymore comeback talk for Evan. It was delusional of him to believe after a year of Chan setting record point totals, Czisnys rise to prominence, Davis & White giving the U.S their first World dance title, all the debate over his Olympic Gold and the merits of giving such a prestigious title to a skater both quadless and lacking in style, and that the USFSA had preferred Abbott over him by 2009 anyway, that anyone was going to bend over backwards to support and even imburse his return. At most people were not going to stand in his way, that is it. If I were a skater of his relatively limited (for champion standards) skill set and had somehow won Worlds, the GP final, and the Olympics in the same year, I would be taking my medals and running, and cashing in as much and quickly as I could; considering myself the luckiest guy alive. I wouldnt even think for a moment of coming back.

His window of opportunity even as a professional to be a star and rake in the income is only until about 2014 probably anyway, especialy if the U.S has a big story coming out of Sochi be it a gold for Davis & White, a medal for one of their ladies or men. He has wasted almost a year of that (and maybe more since he is off the SOI cast for this coming season) for nothing it turns out. What a shame for him.

Can't really think of anything to add other than to say that I agree with everything you said! :yes::thumbsup:

 

[museksk8r]

He has been totally eclipsed in popularity by Johnny Weir; Evan doesn't know how to play the PR game, or has gotten bad advice, or maybe is just too shy to put himself out there! He is the Olympic gold medalist and somehow he has become obsolete.

I am a Johnny fan but feel kinda sorry for Evan.

This shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. Johnny is full of personality and has an entertaining magnetism about him; he's so much more interesting as an off-ice persona than Lysacek. Evan was always known more as a workman and his personality always struck me as someone who is unable to engage a crowd.

 

[Skatetomusic]

This shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. Johnny is full of personality and has an entertaining magnetism about him; he's so much more interesting as an off-ice persona than Lysacek. Evan was always known more as a workman and his personality always struck me as someone who is unable to engage a crowd.

I couldn't agree more. Johnny Weir, Ryan Bradley, Matt Savoie, Ryan Jahnke others were able to get the audiences into their skating quite a bit more.

 

[Serious Business]

Oy. Again, while I'm not an Evan fan, to say that he's not much of a draw is ridiculous. Regardless of what you think of his performance ability (and I don't think that much of it myself), he has one of the highest profiles and recognition of any current US skater. He won a little thing called the Olympic gold in one of the few skating events Americans actually watch. Then went on to be runners-up on Dancing with the Stars, one of the most popular TV shows in the US. He has the fame, and people at large liked him enough to at least vote him into 2nd on that clippity cloppity show. And among us skating snobs, purists and elitists, Evan generates quite a bit of interest, judging by this thread. You know you'd want to see how he does if he makes a comeback, just so you can chant "Fall! Fall! Fall!" the entire time.

 

[museksk8r]

And among us skating snobs, purists and elitists, Evan generates quite a bit of interest, judging by this thread. You know you'd want to see how he does if he makes a comeback, just so you can chant "Fall! Fall! Fall!" the entire time.

Well, I know I don't speak for everyone, but I honestly do not do this. If a skater whose skating I don't care for is performing, I don't care enough about their skating or performance to hope for them to succeed or fail. I pretty much just go into the next room and do something else until they are finished. I don't want to tempt karma wishing others to fail when my favorites are still to skate.

 

[Olympia]

This shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. Johnny is full of personality and has an entertaining magnetism about him; he's so much more interesting as an off-ice persona than Lysacek. Evan was always known more as a workman and his personality always struck me as someone who is unable to engage a crowd.

I went back and watched Lysacek's interview at Vancouver with Bob Costas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6m7CjKFB_o

I suppose he's dull compared to Weir, but the dignity and maturity with which he handles the questions about Plushenko's comments is remarkable (on no sleep, yet). He doesn't even snipe at Plushenko in return but compliments him. He made me a fan for life. Even with whatever he has just done by pulling out of Nationals this year, I retain a certain warmth for him. If he comes back, will I root for him over Takahashi or Chan? No, but I wouldn't have rooted for Viktor Petrenko after he won his Olympic gold, and that doesn't lessen my admiration for Petrenko's achievements.

 

[gmyers]

He and Carroll did many interviews and there was lots of sniping! Just based on that one? I think refusing to engage in real issues in skating is not admirable.

 

[PolymerBob]

Back when I was in grammar school, every class had a trouble-maker. He would go up to George and tell him, "Ralph said ...." Then he would go to Ralph and tell him, "George said...." Then back and forth, back and forth. Reporters like to play this game too. I give credit to Evan for stopping it right then and there.

As for the dispute with the USFSA, here is my ( il )logic. Evan has a bye to Nationals. So as I understand the rules, the USFSA cannot stop Evan from skating. If he fills out the entrance form on time, pays the entry fee, shows up at the event, he skates. So if the USFSA cannot stop Evan from skating, it must be Evan who decided not to. And since the USFSA cannot impose rules on Evan that are different from everyone else, there is something about the usual, normal skater-federation arrangement than Evan does not find acceptable.

This might not be very profound, but at least we know what the hold-up is.

 

[Olympia]

Thanks, PolymerBob. That's what I was getting at.

 

[prettykeys]

I went back and watched Lysacek's interview at Vancouver with Bob Costas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6m7CjKFB_o

I suppose he's dull compared to Weir, but the dignity and maturity with which he handles the questions about Plushenko's comments is remarkable (on no sleep, yet). He doesn't even snipe at Plushenko in return but compliments him. He made me a fan for life. Even with whatever he has just done by pulling out of Nationals this year, I retain a certain warmth for him. If he comes back, will I root for him over Takahashi or Chan? No, but I wouldn't have rooted for Viktor Petrenko after he won his Olympic gold, and that doesn't lessen my admiration for Petrenko's achievements.

I'm not disagreeing with you, Olympia, but these are my personal thoughts on the matter after watching the clip.

I am neither a fan of Evan nor someone who dislikes him in the least. I agree that he conducted himself in this interview with dignity and what seems to be honesty. (Sometimes it is hard to mix the two when controversial issues come up, or when the discussion is about a rival, yes?) At the same time, I emphatically agree with both you and PolymerBob in that agents of the media love to try to provoke, and I completely see it in what Bob Costas is doing and especially framing it as an issue of "graciousness". Evan Lysacek is indeed being gracious, but it's a little easier to be gracious as a winner and to have done so with such a fine margin (a victory I personally did not find inspiring--again, no hate, just honesty) against a legend. I too, would be wiping my brow and going "phew...that was really close, I feel a little lucky." When all is said and done, Evan Lysacek did skate well, and Evgeny Plushenko was definitely off that night, and I see a case could be made for either to have won Gold.

Evgeny could have been more quiet in the moment and saved the comments until after the games...but I feel that I can also see the pain of the honest disappointment in thinking he had done enough to win. I don't believe he thinks he should have won because it's only about himself, I feel that the issue in his mind is in his own understanding or value of jumps in the sport, which has CLEARLY been affirmed in the new rules that have been set to increase the base value of quads. So for Bob Costas to imply that Evgeny is not gracious really, really bugs me, and I am glad that Evan stands up for him and defends him as a "great guy" who congratulated him. And even if Evgeny had made those quad comments had Daisuke Takahashi won Gold without his quad flip (a skater who I now am a fan of), I still don't think Evgeny would have been wrong to voice his opinion.

 

[seniorita]

It is funny, this interview I know it by heart from the comments here but somehow I ve never seen a minute of it, back then I was too upset to watch it and now its time has passed and it just doesnt feel important, it is not Evan or Mr Costas fault, I m weird, it is one of the classics I refuse to watch, this and Casablanca

 

[Olympia]

I'm not disagreeing with you, Olympia, but these are my personal thoughts on the matter after watching the clip.

I am neither a fan of Evan nor someone who dislikes him in the least. I agree that he conducted himself in this interview with dignity and what seems to be honesty. (Sometimes it is hard to mix the two when controversial issues come up, or when the discussion is about a rival, yes?) At the same time, I emphatically agree with both you and PolymerBob in that agents of the media love to try to provoke, and I completely see it in what Bob Costas is doing and especially framing it as an issue of "graciousness". Evan Lysacek is indeed being gracious, but it's a little easier to be gracious as a winner and to have done so with such a fine margin (a victory I personally did not find inspiring--again, no hate, just honesty) against a legend. I too, would be wiping my brow and going "phew...that was really close, I feel a little lucky." When all is said and done, Evan Lysacek did skate well, and Evgeny Plushenko was definitely off that night, and I see a case could be made for either to have won Gold.

Evgeny could have been more quiet in the moment and saved the comments until after the games...but I feel that I can also see the pain of the honest disappointment in thinking he had done enough to win. I don't believe he thinks he should have won because it's only about himself, I feel that the issue in his mind is in his own understanding or value of jumps in the sport, which has CLEARLY been affirmed in the new rules that have been set to increase the base value of quads. So for Bob Costas to imply that Evgeny is not gracious really, really bugs me, and I am glad that Evan stands up for him and defends him as a "great guy" who congratulated him. And even if Evgeny had made those quad comments had Daisuke Takahashi won Gold without his quad flip (a skater who I now am a fan of), I still don't think Evgeny would have been wrong to voice his opinion.

Those are some really good points. It's interesting that you mention Takahashi. One thing that struck me through this whole year or so is that if Takahashi had won even without a quad, no one would probably have complained, because his skating is so clearly exceptional and so well respected. In fact, I was rooting for Takahashi.

Here's something else that struck me while you were talking. Does anyone remember Nancy Kerrigan's reaction when Oksana Baiul won at Lillehammer? She couldn't understand why she hadn't been marked higher, because she skated a totally smooth program and Oksana didn't. Now, we could argue that tenth of a point difference until doomsday (and skating fans probably will!), but the point I'm making here is that everyone slammed Nancy for being a sore loser. This time around, everyone's slamming Evan not for being ungracious but for winning--which really wasn't in his hands at all; it was the judges. Like him as a skater or not, like his program of that night or not (and I understand why many people didn't), I don't understand the anger against him. He didn't do anything underhanded or aggressive to seize the victory from the legendary Plushenko. He did what Tara Lipinski and Sarah Hughes and Oksana Baiul did: he showed up and skated with everything he had in him. Then the judges made their decisions. As Irina Slutskaya said after Hughes won, "this is sport."

What Evgeny said seemed to be based on the stress of the moment and on wounded pride. I have certainly never been in such a high-pressure and public situation, so I can't judge him for speaking like that. I can't begin to understand the emotional chaos of such a situation. But that's also why I'm so impressed that Lysacek held it together and mustered up such gracious words about his rival at that moment. I'm positive I wouldn't have had the presence of mind to do that! (Even if I'd ever been good enough to win anything.)

 

[Tonichelle]

Bob Costas is one of my least favorite talking heads in all of sports media... he drives me up the wall. He's too busy trying to be Bob Costas and ends up pushing NBC's agenda too far, IMO

 

[gmyers]

Lysacek did not do what Lipinski or Hughes did at all. They were courageous and gutsy. Lysacek was ultraconservative using the devalue of the quad against great GOE and backload bonus to beat bold skating. He really did not go all out at all and wasn't even that great with an almost edge call and the big lean forward on his 2nd 3A. Bauil did one thing which was to throw in a 2A-2T combo at the last second! The interview with lysacek was not even live. Lysacek did try a quad at US Nationals when even Carroll was going around saying Olympic judges wont buy a quadless performance. It wasn't even a judge issue - though certainly American skating politics got the fives for Plushenko in the SP- it was a horrible tech system that had devalued quads.