Sasha Cohen - Robin Wagner Breakup?

[attyfan]

Sasha - Robin

It may be that the apparant "distance" between Sasha and Robin at Campbell's was due to Sasha's back pain. When some people aren't feeling well, they prefer to be left alone; others prefer a "touchy-feely-comforter". Robin strikes me as a "touchy-feely-comforter"; if Sasha prefers to be left alone when she isn't well, there would be problems until Sasha is better.

 

[Linny]

Learning from your students

All good teachers learn from their students. I'm also a teacher (LOL! Not at the elite level as Robin Wagner!). A great portion of my job involves listening to my students. If Robin was candid enough to admit that she learns something about Sasha everyday, they I say Cudos to Her.
Linny

 

[soogar]

Sasha's coldness

Sasha strikes me as a really reserved person who isn't comfortable around touchy feely people. Go on her website and look at the photos with her and other skaters. Timmy hugs Sasha a lot in photos and Sasha always looks really uncomfortable. I notice that in her pictures with Johnny Weir that she reciprocates his hug and looks very happy and comfortable with him. They're all friends but it seems that Sasha is closer to Johnny. I don't really think that her reaction to Robin is at all odd. Tim has known her for years and she isn't comfortable with him, why would she be more comfortable with an authority figure with whom she was working for only a few months?

 

[jesslily]

Sasha is a beautiful lady, but she may not that social as people imgined. On the other hand that distance between her and Robin just happened this year at the Cheesefest. Last year at nationals, two weeks after Sasha switched to Robin, they looked like they know each other very well for long time, so did they at worlds. They were just so close and trusted each other.

I know how back pain might affect your body movement. According Sasha's journal she has sprained back and can still do double jumps. I know a beautiful young skater locally suffereng level 3 back stress fracture, the pain is so aweful, but she still can hop around if she feels something excited. Sasha did fairly well at the Cheesefest, the joy if she felt should not prevent her hugging back Robin.

 

[NorthernLite]

As for going to other resource for choreography, I think it's good for Sasha. Robin has her style and she gave all of them to Sarah. Her style fits Sarah very well. It may not work for Sasha. Robin uses lots of counter, rocker, and turn to disguise Sarah's weakness. Sasha does not need too many of these. Any movement can show her dance ability and artistry.

Yeah, why would she want to do moves that would be rewarded under CoP?
And rather frustrating that people still think "dance" and good skating are the same thing. Lawd forbid Sasha should learn to have the great edging and stroking that Sarah has.
As for everything else being speculated on - fascinating how people want to read so much into the littlest things, like how someone looked in a few-second shot of the K & C. Not that I don't do it sometimes too. But it reminds me of another board where there used to be ridiculous discussions about how rude and bratty this or that skater was, based upon some 1.5 second backstage shot where they weren't smiling.

 

[euterpe]

It's a fact that each person has his/her own personal 'space' the borders of which differ often due to cultural differences.

Sasha is most likely a person whose personal space extends outward quite a bit. That means she doesn't feel comfortable when other people, particularly those with whom she doesn't have (or doesn't want to have) a close relationship, intrude too far into her personal space.

Robin is a touchy-feely type person, and if that makes Sasha uncomfortable, it might explain why Sasha went to outside choreographers and then wanted to train by herself for a month. But it also doesn't bode well for the relationship to continue.

I agree that if Sasha no longer wants Robin as a coach, she'd be best served to find another coach ASAP, or her Olympic season will be in jeopardy.

 

[mzheng]

Why in the world should Robin Wagner be "humble" towards Sasha Cohen? Excuse me, but that's simply ridiculous - IMHO, of course.

I recall one of those up-close-and-personal segments last season that featured the new Wagner-Cohen partnership. Wagner said (to paraphrase), "I'm learning something new about Sasha every day." I thought, "How odd. I would think that Sasha would be the one learning things from Wagner." :sheesh:

I read some posters quoted from Sasha's Journal last season when she first switched to Robin. She said that it was so excited that she showed Robin all what she can do, now she would see what Robin was going to do with these.

No matter what Sasha said how confidant she was in public interview, what she dose with her program and the appearance on the interview always leave me the impression deep down she lacks of some confidances. I believe deep down she is very emotional. She may behave 'impulsive' do what she wants to do, but 'impulsive', IMO, is not 'confidant', neither is the 'decisive'. That's why I say if she is not comfortable with Robin, she needs to make decition earlier instead of late.

She shouldn't leave TT. All ppl said she is good to be with Robin, since Robin finally made her skate clean and have her nerve controled. But so what? If she have her nerve controled but lost her sparks and those exquisite movements? Under CoP one fall or two dosn't matter as long as she can make up the points in rest of her program. And with her artistry and exquisit movement on ice adds up TT's choreo ability to highlight those movments it can easily be done. IMO, she made the 'impulsive' mistake to leave TT when things diddn't quite worked out as they had expected (the quick result diddn't showup as soon as her family expected). She should try to stay with TT a little while longer and work out the problem with TT.

The rumor was TT wanted her cut down unnecessary competetion and withdraw from that winter cheesefest, she diddn't which trigged the split. But right after the split, she addmitted TT was right, too many competetions for her last season she'll cut down this season. And this season she dose exactly what TT's advise suggested. So if TT was right why she left TT at first place? That's why I feel she dose things 'impulsive' instead of 'think it through then react'.

ETA.
After a second read. I know I conflicted myself in this post. She shouldn't leave TT so quick (she should try work out things with TT) but should leave Robin ASAP if she dosn't feel comfortable with Robin. LOL. But something can be worked out between ppl, something (like personal space of comfort zone) can't. Just feel TT is the right one for Sasha. But again I wouldn't have this speculation had sasha diddn't switch. lol

 

[jesslily]

First, from my observation, I don't think Sarah's edges are more superb than Sasha's. Edge and flow are different from dancing ability, but without it, edge and flow don't look good at all. If Sasha only can dance and has non-skating artistry, she has no way to be a international competitor. All levels' judges are well educated. They are not blind to see a true talent.

Second, the body language of a coach and a skater at Kiss&Cry definitely tell us their relationship. I still remember at 2003's Skate Canada and Cheesefest how odd Sasha and TT looked together. I was thinking they don't look happy there. Two months later Sasha announced leaving TT.

Third, Sasha should or should not leave TT, only herself knows the best. If she feels that she made a wrong decision, she can always go back. most coaches don't mind take back a student unless they had been in very very bad relationship.

 

[sk8m8]

Third, Sasha should or should not leave TT, only herself knows the best. If she feels that she made a wrong decision, she can always go back. most coaches don't mind take back a student unless they had been in very very bad relationship.

...except for the smallish glitch that TT happened to pick up the current world gold medalist, I'm not too sure how you factor in that item in the mix

 

[lavender]

Sasha will be fine. This is just a rumor really. I'll wait for the articles or Sasha's journal if this breakup takes place. I really don't see it happening this late in the game. She should take a look at what happen to Michelle. Moving on is a good idea sometimes but timing is everything.

 

[jesslily]

It seems only elite skaters can and have the resources to find a coach who would only coach herself/himself. But thousands of lower level skaters all have to choose a coach who teaches a few girls who are around you level. You learn to cope with all the problem came with it. I guess Sasha has experienced this before. She could deal with it then and she should be able to do it now.

 

[registered]

I haven't noticed Sasha being uncomfortable in Robin's presence, it did however appeared to me, that Shizuka looked really uncomfortable next to TT at Cambell's, with Tarasova being visibly disappointed with Shizuka's performance (reminded me of days, when less than perfect Sasha had to sit in the "kiss and cry" with Tatiana).

At this point I don't see Sasha splitting up with RW. Why would the family took pains of relocating to NYC, if not to make it easier for Sasha to train with Robin? As to working with Callaghan, it's just the Internet rumor. Sasha did work with different choreographers over the summer, and trained on her own in Simmsbury, while Morozov was putting together her SP.

In regard to working with "so and so" on jumps, it's not really necessary. As long as Sasha's healthy, Robin is capable to assist her (Cohen's jumps looked great at Marshalls). But unfortunately, she've suffered a series of set backs with her health, and not supposed to work on multiple revolutions jumps (this is a doctor's orders, people). So, she won't work with Callahan, or Arutunian, or anyone else, jumping hurts her back, and she's not going to re-injure herself, period.

 

[mzheng]

Second, the body language of a coach and a skater at Kiss&Cry definitely tell us their relationship. I still remember at 2003's Skate Canada and Cheesefest how odd Sasha and TT looked together. I was thinking they don't look happy there. Two months later Sasha announced leaving TT.
.

Yeah. Actually looks to me it was the same attitude (body languge) Sasha used towards to TT then and Robin now.

Even Sasha wanted to back, I doubt TT would take her back now, with Arakawa under her wing. And how her 'pleasure' to work with Japanese ladies.

 

[gezando]

I don't see Arakawa being uncomfortable at kiss and cry with TT. When Cohen was with TT, she said all positive, I learnt so much from TT, we worked together so well. So she looked uncomfortable next to TT?

Cohen shouldn't be uncomfortable with RW, didn't she said, " I have fun, real fun oh so much fun, fun and more fun since switching to Robin"

 

[gezando]

First, from my observation, I don't think Sarah's edges are more superb than Sasha's.

I have seen them in the same competitions more than once, I have to disagree with you, I think Sarah's edges are more superb than Cohen's.

 

[jesslily]

It's not Sasha did not want to be near TT a couple of months before she left TT, and near RW now, the body language told us she is not that close to them anymore since what and what happened, she does not want share her feeling, joy or disappointment, with them, and she also has different interpretations from TT or RW why she got that marks.

I don't know how Arakawa is doing with TT now since I haven't paied much attention. For coach and skater relationship, we should never only blame skaters' side. Nobody is perfect, including reknowed coaches who are much senior than skaters. TT has coached dance teams and men freestyle to Olympic gold, but never lady freestyle. Maybe lady freestylers and TT are hard to click.

I wish I could see how Sarah's edge is better than Sasha's, unfortunately I only notice she is physcally stronger than Sasha, RW never let her do a longer edge flow over the ice, always turn and turn to hide something.

 

[mzheng]

I wish I could see how Sarah's edge is better than Sasha's, unfortunately I only notice she is physcally stronger than Sasha, RW never let her do a longer edge flow over the ice, always turn and turn to hide something.

Although I like Sasha's skating style much better than Sarah's, I have to say I agree with gezando. Sarah had far more secure edge than Sasha back they competed to each other. I would think RW's "turn and turn" is to hide her bad posture. The facts she could do all those difficult turns, and consistantly landed those underrotated jumps (most skaters would fall if they landed half turn short and pitch forward, but not Sarah), just prove that she could mastery control her edge.

 

[registered]

I don't see Arakawa being uncomfortable at kiss and cry with TT. When Cohen was with TT, she said all positive, I learnt so much from TT, we worked together so well. So she looked uncomfortable next to TT?

Cohen shouldn't be uncomfortable with RW, didn't she said, " I have fun, real fun oh so much fun, fun and more fun since switching to Robin"

I don't see Cohen being uncomfortable with Robin, and yes, she wrote that she loves working with RW. But then, this is how some posters interpret her body language.

Tarasova, I think, does express the disappointment via the body language, no matter who she's with: Cohen, Arakawa, Griazev... When her skaters make mistakes, she's icy cold and avoids looking at them directly (she's all hugs and kisses when they do well). IMPO TT made Shizuka feel her disappointment at Campbells. But this is purely my impression, I have no way of knowing for sure, maybe as soon as they stepped out of the spot light, Tatiana had some words of encouragement and comfort for Arakawa.

 

[jesslily]

When did Sasha say"I have fun...since I switching to Robin."? Probably quite a while ago. In the situation between Sasha and Robin, Sasha felt that she did not skate as herself expected, but Robin felt Sasha did relatively good job considering her food injury and unorganized Summer. At Cheesefest Robin was so happy for Sasha and tried to hug her, but Sasha tried to avoid it as long as possible.

As for TT acted clearly disapoointed when her skaters could not skate as she hoped for, I'd like to observe carefully. I feel coaches should not react that way. They should always encourage their skaters. They should find why their students can not skate the way both of them expected and update their training plan.

 

[gezando]

When did Sasha say"I have fun...since I switching to Robin."?

Right after she switched to Robin

As for TT acted clearly disapoointed when her skaters could not skate as she hoped for, I'd like to observe carefully. I feel coaches should not react that way. They should always encourage their skaters. They should find why their students can not skate the way both of them expected and update their training plan.

Clearly disappointed? It is not clear to me at all TT. How are we sure that Tarasova does not update and review training strategy with her students everytime they step on the ice.