State of Russian Ladies in skating: 2014-15 Season

[Mony]

Now that you mention her, anyone know what Maria Butyrskaya is doing now?

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

The Russian ladies singles skates in the next 2015-2016 season will be a bloodbath. The competition is intense and whoever survives at Russian Nats are going to be hard core commando competitive skaters. It is brutal but clearly effective on a national level to pick your strongest competitors to hit the big stage.

It's interesting because we seem to say this every year, but there are rarely more than two stand-outs who emerge from the field. We should expect the talented juniors to struggle in their first year as seniors, Elena to have a sophomore slump, etc. None of the juniors who did well this year surpassed the accomplishments of Liza, Julia or Adelina as juniors, and they all struggled when they moved up.

 

[silverfoxes]

Finally, official confirmation that Serafima left Eteri...and she's working on a 4S!

http://rsport.ru/figure_skating/20150408/821676922.html

MOSCOW, April 8 - R-Sport, Maria Vorobyov. Vice junior world champion in 2014 and 2015 in women's figure skating Russian woman Seraphim Sahanovich will teach Salchow jump in four turns for the new season, said the "F-Sport" Coach skater Alina Pisarenko .
On Wednesday received official confirmation care information Sahanovich from Moscow coach Etery Tutberidze and its return to St. Petersburg for the first coach Alina Pisarenko . In Tutberidze who trains in particular, Olympic champion in the team Yulia Lipnitsky and double medalist Sergei Voronov Europe, Sahanovich stayed season.
Last season Elizabeth Tuktamysheva first of the Russians performed at the World Cup axel three and a half times, largely due to this she won the gold medal .
"Even before I went from Shem to Eter, we had a quadruple Salchow taught. Of course, now we're back to that, and I must say that there is progress, we hope to finish my studies this jump to the next season - said Pisarenko by phone. - Axel, we are not very good, so twist the three and a half times will not work, but Salchow in four turns to master quite real. "

Pisarenko called "pleasant surprise" return Sahanovich in St. Petersburg. "I hope they Eter went in a good, but what about the causes of the return I do not even ask - we were very glad to see Sima, for us it is a pleasant surprise, and we are already working on the new season," - said the coach.
She also said that among the immediate objectives Sahanovich - Fix error when pushing off on Lutz (wrong edge). "Also, I think over the programs that we select music, already have some ideas, but we have not decided finally. Hopefully next week will begin to play" - concluded Pisarenko.

 

[Sandpiper]

^Thanks for the info.

It's good to see St. Petersburg getting some elite students. Not sure if Sima will be the one to do the quad, but I respect a lady who challenges it, instead of only relying on backloading/'tano for points. If she can fix that lutz too, Sima will be quite competitive.

On the other hand, I do hope Sima made an informed decision based on her career (e.g. now she has funding, plus Evgenia has been surpassing her this year in Eteri's group). And it wasn't driven by fights with Adian or Evgenia.

 

[sunnystars]

being curious: is Pisarenko a good tech coach? Also did Sima have a flutz before her Moscow move?

 

[NaVi]

Also did Sima have a flutz before her Moscow move?

Looking at 2014 Jr Worlds she did a 3F+3T instead of a 3Lz+3T in the SP and received edge calls on both Lz attempts in her FS.

http://www.isuresults.com/results/wjc2014/

I think both moves by Serafima and Proklova are smart because neither would be the top priority of their coach next year and could end up 3rd(or even 4th as Tsurkaya is 2018 eligible) in their group by 2018. I'm actually glad of these coaching changes as I think it's win-win for all the skaters involved.

I'm not too keen on Pogorilaya switching coaches unless she really wants to try for a 3A or quad... I think she needs to add a 2nd (female) choreographer though.

 

[starlight97]

I'm not too keen on Pogorilaya switching coaches unless she really wants to try for a 3A or quad... I think she needs to add a 2nd (female) choreographer though.

I would be more than glad to see her switch. Yes, partly cause I can't stand Tsareva but mainly cause I feel like I've never seen Anna skate to her full potential.
I personally feel like Yulia did with Schindler's list, Adelina did in Sochi, Elena in the GP etc. Of course those have room to grow as well but I feel like they've completely lived up to the potential they had in that very moment at least once.

With Anna I think she has much to offer if only she finds someone who fixes her posture, her extentions etc but mainly a coach who fixes her mind.
Adelina had mental struggles as well. Buyanova seemed to come through to her. While the GPF was a disaster for Adelina, she got it together bit by bit during Nationals and Euros and in Sochi her mind was just where it had to be.
Even after being left out in the Team Event. Buyanova must have played a big role in keeping her from breaking down and making her come out stronger. I'd love to see the same with Anna.

 

[NaVi]

I can't stand Tsareva but mainly cause I feel like I've never seen Anna skate to her full potential.

I like Tsareva and tbh I have more sympathy for her than Pogorilaya... sorry, but it was rather irresponsible for Pogorilaya to injure herself while on vacation right before what may be her last World's opportunity. (I still think even injured that she was a better choice for World's than Leonova)

As far as her "full potential', all she had to do was repeat what she put out at Skate Canada and Euros to be in the medal hunt.

 

[StitchMonkey]

I like Tsareva and tbh I have more sympathy for her than Pogorilaya... sorry, but it was rather irresponsible for Pogorilaya to injure herself while on vacation right before what may be her last World's opportunity. (I still think even injured that she was a better choice for World's than Leonova)

As far as her "full potential', all she had to do was repeat what she put out at Skate Canada and Euros to be in the medal hunt.

Was that what happened?

From Anna's fan thread

Wow. Pretty bad news for Anna's fans.
http://www.team-russia2014.ru/article/figur/21272.html

"Preparing for the World Championships was very difficult for Anna - Anna Tsareva said, - After the European Championships she go on vacation, and when she returned she sprained foot. It was a partially torn ankle ligament, so almost a month she didn't do anything. She just slipped on the ice. We have started preparing for Shanghai only on March 12. In fact, we worked 10 days. But leg still hurts quite strongly, and this affects on perform the elements. So we weren't able to work over what we wanted. So, everything was compressed. Just Anna's desire to compete is much stronger than the pain of the injury, so she continued to prepare for the World Cup. Let's hope for the best - that nothing bad will happen during the competition. And then we go back home - and start the treatment."
"Because of the injury, of course, we haven't any purposes for the WC - Anna Tsareva said, - A whole month was lost. So in such situation it's difficult to predict anything."

This is a Google translation, but I fixed something, so you can understand something at least.

Well Ashley (or maybe someone else) has all the chances now.


https://vk.com/id58598025

Seems to indicate it happened when she got back, not on vacation. If this is incorrect I would be interested to hear about it.

 

[NaVi]

Seems to indicate it happened when she got back, not on vacation. If this is incorrect I would be interested to hear about it.

Here's yandex translation...

Preparation for the world championship Anya was very difficult," said Anna Tsareva. - After the European championship, she left for a vacation and when I came back - very badly sprained foot. Happened partial ligament rupture Halepota, so almost a month it did nothing. If left on the ice - just slid.

And just going from memory I think the original news was explicit that she did it on vacation.

I'm pretty(98%) sure she's saying that Pogorilaya could only glide on the ice and couldn't work on anything else.

 

[Flaya]

I agree on the need to change coaches for Anna.

I believe many of us in here simply adore watching her skate and her beauty only amplifies this.

Having said that, she needs to find more mental strength as well and a good coach should be there to help her build it. I do not feel the current coach brings it to the table and I believe a change has to be made in order for her to be competitive at nationals. She will also likely have a longer break due to her injuries (plus these falls at World).

 

[Sandpiper]

Here's yandex translation...



And just going from memory I think the original news was explicit that she did it on vacation.

I'm pretty(98%) sure she's saying that Pogorilaya could only glide on the ice and couldn't work on anything else.

Well, either way, sometimes stupid injuries happen. Like Liza at the Russian Cup Final last year ("The stupidest fall of my life," as she recalls). I'm sure Anna didn't injure herself on purpose. Yeah, she should've been more careful, but she nonetheless deserves sympathy, not scorn.

I don't think any of us can speak on a coaching change, since we don't know what goes on between them... Just because Tsareva doesn't smile in the K&C doesn't mean she's a monster. For all we know, Anna might not want to be comforted in public. That being said, if her coach is indeed coach and demanding all the time, and she needs something else, I hope Anna doesn't hesitate to upset the status quo.

 

[Tutto]

I think strategically it would be a smart move for Anna. She'd get the most powerful club in Russia on her side (that assuming that she is indeed moving to Vodorezova) and have more support from Federation. And she does need it next year as the fight for a place on the team will be of epic proportions. I am not sure it will be good for her artistic development but to survive one needs to make some sacrifices. Ideally I would love to see Anna working with someone like Brian Orser but alas...
I've always defended Tsareva when her 'cold stares' were discussed here because I did like the idea of a coach and a student growing together. But i think this season proved that this partnership reached their ceiling. After disappointment at GPF Anna said that her coach told her to do at least 3 full run-throughs of the program every practice, I remember thinking then that repetition is not an answer to every problem and that it sounded like Tsareva ran out of ideas. Then came a dubious decision to take part in Worlds being injured. And when I saw Tsareva giving no support to Anna in K&C after THAT fall in the sp I said to myself no, something not right here. So yes I would be glad Anna moving elsewhere and hope it'd work for her

 

[NaVi]

After disappointment at GPF Anna said that her coach told her to do at least 3 full run-throughs of the program every practice, I remember thinking then that repetition is not an answer to every problem and that it sounded like Tsareva ran out of ideas.

Oh lord, this is ridiculous. She made it to Euros and Worlds and earned a medal at Euros and could have earned a medal at Worlds if she had not messed up her ankle on vacation. Tsareve is not the problem.

 

[kwanatic]

Oh lord, this is ridiculous. She made it to Euros and Worlds and earned a medal at Euros and could have earned a medal at Worlds if she had not messed up her ankle on vacation. Tsareve is not the problem.

Anna has the goods but she is just too rough right now. She needs a Frank Carroll-like coach, someone who is good at smoothing out rough stone. Anna seems to lack body awareness; her arms and legs are so long and she flings them around which makes her skating look really wild and rough. She needs better control. She also needs better programs and to work on connecting to the audience more.

I don't necessarily think Tsareva is Anna's issue. Anna went through the sophomore slump some skaters go through (Adelina went through it, Liza went through it, Julia went through a year later but she went through it). She has the talent to come back but she'll need something to help her stand out. Better packaging and cleaner skating would really help her.

 

[Meoima]

Anna has the goods but she is just too rough right now. She needs a Frank Carroll-like coach, someone who is good at smoothing out rough stone. Anna seems to lack body awareness; her arms and legs are so long and she flings them around which makes her skating look really wild and rough. She needs better control. She also needs better programs and to work on connecting to the audience more.
I don't necessarily think Tsareva is Anna's issue. Anna went through the sophomore slump some skaters go through (Adelina went through it, Liza went through it, Julia went through a year later but she went through it). She has the talent to come back but she'll need something to help her stand out. Better packaging and cleaner skating would really help her.

Maybe she should consider immigration soon. :hopelessness:

 

[kwanatic]

Maybe she should consider immigration soon. :hopelessness:

It might not be such a bad idea

The field of senior Russian women will be over-saturated next season: Tuktamysheva, Radionova, Lipnitskaya, Sotnikova, Medvedeva, Sakhanovich...then you've got the juniors: Proklova, Sotskova, Tsurskaya...and even more potential threats that haven't hit the scene yet: Nugamanova, Gubanova...

I don't know where Anna fits in. With Julia off her game and Adelina out, Anna was the best 3rd option this season. But if both of them come back next season (not to mention the newbie seniors Evgenia and Serafima), I don't think there will be much room left for Anna.

Anna is good enough to be a medal contender anywhere else but she fades into the background in Russia. It think she has a lot more to offer but she needs time to grow and develop. Unfortunately, in Russia's hyper-competitive field, she won't have time to find herself. If she hits a rough patch she'll fall in the standings and her only hope would be to do what Liza T did this year: claw her way up from the bottom of the pile.

Skating for another country might be a good bet for her.

 

[Tutto]

It might not be such a bad idea

The field of senior Russian women will be over-saturated next season: Tuktamysheva, Radionova, Lipnitskaya, Sotnikova, Medvedeva, Sakhanovich...then you've got the juniors: Proklova, Sotskova, Tsurskaya...and even more potential threats that haven't hit the scene yet: Nugamanova, Gubanova...

I don't know where Anna fits in. With Julia off her game and Adelina out, Anna was the best 3rd option this season. But if both of them come back next season (not to mention the newbie seniors Evgenia and Serafima), I don't think there will be much room left for Anna.

Anna is good enough to be a medal contender anywhere else but she fades into the background in Russia. It think she has a lot more to offer but she needs time to grow and develop. Unfortunately, in Russia's hyper-competitive field, she won't have time to find herself. If she hits a rough patch she'll fall in the standings and her only hope would be to do what Liza T did this year: claw her way up from the bottom of the pile.

Skating for another country might be a good bet for her.

Her only option is to switch to Ukraine as her parents are both from Ukraine and considering the state the country is in at present that is not an option really. Besides I don't think Russian Fed will release her. Thats why I think CSKA could be a good move for her. IMHO it is not Tsareva that is a problem but the fact is Tsareva has no name/influence. 90% of Anna's problems stem from uncertainty of her position in current Russian ladies field. With support of CSKA/Vodorezova she might find new confidence in herself, be less nervous of whats around the corner so to speak

 

[silverlake22]

Anna has the goods but she is just too rough right now. She needs a Frank Carroll-like coach, someone who is good at smoothing out rough stone. Anna seems to lack body awareness; her arms and legs are so long and she flings them around which makes her skating look really wild and rough. She needs better control. She also needs better programs and to work on connecting to the audience more.

I don't necessarily think Tsareva is Anna's issue. Anna went through the sophomore slump some skaters go through (Adelina went through it, Liza went through it, Julia went through a year later but she went through it). She has the talent to come back but she'll need something to help her stand out. Better packaging and cleaner skating would really help her.

I agree it's too early to write her off. Usually, I'd be wary of the poor placement at Worlds in terms of it holding her back in future seasons, but at least it didn't cost Russia 3 spots and even if Leonova were to have competed instead, there isn't any more spots to get and I doubt she would have done enough to pull off a Russian podium sweep. On the topic of Leonova, she too had a couple of bad outings at Worlds, finishing 13th twice, but it didn't stop her from making Euros last season or from getting good international scores and being in the shake up for Euros/Worlds spots this season. Liza too had a fair share of not so good competitions during the past 2 years leading up to this season, and her scores shot right back up once she started delivering again this season.

Given all this, I think Anna can still have a future in Russia at least in the sense of competing/doing well at GP events and such. There are so many talented Russian girls and only 3 can go to Euros and Worlds each year, but like in the US, those who don't make the World Team aren't forgotten nobodies either. GPs and Senior B events are good opportunities to compete, and with Anna entering university next season, she could also compete at Universiade. To me she's not the kind of skater that's going to get held up when she bombs (like Gracie or Adelina, etc.) but the judges have shown they are willing to reward her performances generously when she skates well. Anna skates very fast and has powerful edges, so even though she needs to work on her presentation and get better programs, these assets will help her get adequate PCS when she delivers the jumps. She also has the advantage of being post pubescent compared to lots of the other Russian girls. She could still fill out more or experience additional body changes, but considering her current build and how skinny/wiry she was growing up, I think there's a good chance she can maintain her slim figure, which is also an advantage. She also seems pretty realistic in her prospects, knowing that she needs to perform the tough content to stay competitive in Russia. Plus she is still so young, her 17th birthday is tomorrow. I think if she can stay healthy and if she wants it enough, she can come back and be a factor in Russian ladies saying. I'm not saying she'll necessarily ever be a star, though of course she could, but I think she is talented enough and a good enough competitor that she can continue to compete for Russia and not disappear.

 

[Ophelia]

Anna has the goods but she is just too rough right now. She needs a Frank Carroll-like coach, someone who is good at smoothing out rough stone. Anna seems to lack body awareness; her arms and legs are so long and she flings them around which makes her skating look really wild and rough. She needs better control. She also needs better programs and to work on connecting to the audience more.

This x10. Even Radianova looks a bit more polished than her.