State of U.S. Ladies' skating 2016-17

[mrrice]

I also feel like Gracie hasn't had a lot of life experiences which could make her much more open on the ice. Maybe she needs to fall in love and have a heartbreak and bring out something in her that's authentic and not just rehearsed.

I agree......I also think Gracie needs to be able to talk to her choreographer and tell Him or Her exactly what she wants. I have a feeling that Frank may have told her what she "Needs" whether Gracie liked it or not. There's a huge difference between the two.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I really liked Gracie's SP at the beginning of the season. Maybe she loses the performance when she's nervous and weighed down by expectation. She has actually tried a lot of different styles but nothing yet has worked all that well.

 

[ozmodiar]

Gracie just seems to get so tense for competition, it negatively affects so much about her performance. I don't think it matters what the choreography is.

 

[mrrice]

I really liked Gracie's SP at the beginning of the season. Maybe she loses the performance when she's nervous and weighed down by expectation. She has actually tried a lot of different styles but nothing yet has worked all that well.

I agree. What this tells me is that, if nothing else, Gracie is not afraid of change. I guess in a way she's like Angela Nikodinov before 2001. A strong technical skater with all the skills but we never saw her let herself go. Her 2001 SP at Worlds was just spectacular and you could really see how "Into" that program she was. I'd love to see Gracie deliver a performance from her heart. No matter who does the choreography.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Gracie just seems to get so tense for competition, it negatively affects so much about her performance. I don't think it matters what the choreography is.

Yeah, I agree. When she's clean she gets the best PCS despite being just an ok performer, so while her underwhelming programs might prevent her from becoming a skating icon they don't stand in the way of her winning everything.

 

[silverlake22]

Didn't Misha also choreograph one of Ann Pogorilaya's programs too? Maybe changing it up and getting a new program from someone closer to Gracie's age might help her open up on the ice.

Yes he choreographed Anna's SP for next season over the past few weeks. He posted several pictures and comments about this on instagram. I think it would be good for Gracie to work with different choreographers, it should help broaden her artistic range. I think she has potential in the artistic side of the sport, I just think her nervous disposition sometimes prevents her from projecting in competition. That, and I don't think all her programs thus far have been a great fit for her.

 

[johnsmith72]

I actually think the real problem with Gracie is that she has an incredibly expressive face. Whatever she is feeling on the ice is immediately transferred to the audience. When she is killing the program( like in the sp at Boston) she lights up in an incredible way. When she is incredibly nervous, you can just sense it on her face. Whatever emotion she is feeling is easily read on her face. She's not like a Yuna Kim who can hide her true feelings well when she skates. When Yuna skated to Send in the Clowns in Sochi, she was probably incredibly fiery on the inside but she was able to hide that emotion and project tranquility. I think Gracie needs to work on concealing how she is truly feeling more.

 

[SarahSynchro]

I disagree. To me, Gracie seems to only have two facial expressions:

Face A: oh hell no, I screwed up bad!
Face B: oh hell yea, I didn't screw up!

I really don't ever see anything in between...

... And I swear I'm not being intentionally mean or "hating", I really LIKE Gracie, but she's definitely not the epitome of expressive skating.

 

[TwinnerA]

I agree. What this tells me is that, if nothing else, Gracie is not afraid of change. I guess in a way she's like Angela Nikodinov before 2001. A strong technical skater with all the skills but we never saw her let herself go. Her 2001 SP at Worlds was just spectacular and you could really see how "Into" that program she was. I'd love to see Gracie deliver a performance from her heart. No matter who does the choreography.

I just watching Angela's short and long programs at 2001 Worlds. They were both beautiful, but too bad she had those mistakes at the end of the long, missing what turned out to be her only chance to medal at Worlds.

As for Gracie, I think people are subconsciously comparing her expression (or lack of expression) to Ashley has so much expression, i.e. looking out of the corner of her eye, does the flirty face, agony, etc. a lot in her programs thus season.

 

[skylark]

I agree with you about other posts but because other posts are so "derisive" on the forum, I highly doubt that I would ever be able to have a civilized conversation with them and their logic so I do hope you take it as a compliment

I shall, indeed.

I think it does sound dramatic because the magnitude of a feeling can translate into pressures for skaters. I would think that appalled would apply more to something more severe (SP from Nationals for example) but then again we can't really control our reactions in the moment sometimes.

I agree with you, frankly I don't think her concentrated LP from Nationals was an artistic masterpiece like some say. Her artistry stays is limited to her young energy in my opinion.

Even in 2013: https://youtu.be/pHVFz8W9cWo?t=1m

Higher and bigger lutz, lots of air time. I never worried about her UR'ing there but nowadays I feel like she will UR her 3T due to the lack of air time. I highly doubt with the falling out with her last coach she will go back for some lessons.

I used the link you gave; I'd seen that program before but not at nationals. It pretty much confirms my feelings; she's so thrilled when she skates perfectly that I'm thrilled too. I almost (not quite) understand why the fed, Scott, Sandra, pretty much everyone was so excited and almost couldn't help themselves. But so much excitement about perfect technique has the unintended effect of devaluing other very important aspects of figure skating. Of course, I feel the same about men's skating, and pairs.

I know it's beyond ancient history, but I didn't know she had a falling out with her former coach. Was it because she left him for Frank, or something else? This forum seems like the best place to find out. LOL.

 

[Jammers]

I shall, indeed.



I used the link you gave; I'd seen that program before but not at nationals. It pretty much confirms my feelings; she's so thrilled when she skates perfectly that I'm thrilled too. I almost (not quite) understand why the fed, Scott, Sandra, pretty much everyone was so excited and almost couldn't help themselves. But so much excitement about perfect technique has the unintended effect of devaluing other very important aspects of figure skating. Of course, I feel the same about men's skating, and pairs.

I know it's beyond ancient history, but I didn't know she had a falling out with her former coach. Was it because she left him for Frank, or something else? This forum seems like the best place to find out. LOL.

People were excited for Gracie back in 2012-13 because the top US Ladies over the last few years had such weak jumps and here was someone past puberty who had huge jumps and was doing 3-3 combo's then even most of the top Senior international Ladies at that time weren't doing back then. She was a raw and unpolished skater but had huge technical ability and learning to perform could always be learned but if you can't jump you go nowhere as a skater.

 

[lyndichee]

I used the link you gave; I'd seen that program before but not at nationals. It pretty much confirms my feelings; she's so thrilled when she skates perfectly that I'm thrilled too. I almost (not quite) understand why the fed, Scott, Sandra, pretty much everyone was so excited and almost couldn't help themselves. But so much excitement about perfect technique has the unintended effect of devaluing other very important aspects of figure skating. Of course, I feel the same about men's skating, and pairs.

I know it's beyond ancient history, but I didn't know she had a falling out with her former coach. Was it because she left him for Frank, or something else? This forum seems like the best place to find out. LOL.

I understand that perfect technique does devalue other aspects but I think their excitement stems from the fact that if all else fails, perfect technique can help with changing body type and the scoring for technicals are less subjective.

Apparently the relationship was just not working out. She went to work with Zueva for a bit before going to Frank. I cannot confirm but a lot of people on the forum have mentioned that her personality didn't work that well with his domineering and loud Russian personality.

 

[KweenAsada]

I'm loving the state of ladies skating in the US. It is so competitive at the top. I would put Ashley at the top, but Gracie, Mirai and Polina are what make the race so interesting.

Mirai is on a major upswing and if she gets those jumps rotated she will be a force next season. She has reignited her fire.

Polina was poised to win Nationals, but couldn't do it due to an amazing free by Gracie and her packaging. If she brings it next season...see my thoughts on Mirai, lol.

Gracie needs to GET IT TOGETHER! She has the goods, but if Mirai and Polina skate clean and get their jumps ratified, then she can't bank on the judges putting her above them anymore. It's go time. Ashley Wagner is no longer her only competition. If she skates clean, however. Haha. The world is hers for the taking. People love Gracie.

I can't really comment on the younger US ladies because I can't be impartial. I want Ashley, Gracie, Mirai and Polina to do their best and see what happens. They all have stories. I have my favorites, but I want to see them duke it out. May the best woman win and may they all impress.

They just can't beat Mao Asada at the 2018 Olympics, lol. Their stories will be complete with an Olympic medal of any color. I..I mean Mao, needs the gold.

 

[temadd]

I disagree. To me, Gracie seems to only have two facial expressions:

Face A: oh hell no, I screwed up bad!
Face B: oh hell yea, I didn't screw up!

I really don't ever see anything in between...

... And I swear I'm not being intentionally mean or "hating", I really LIKE Gracie, but she's definitely not the epitome of expressive skating.

I went to Stars on Ice last night and Gracie still had the same 2 expressions, mostly with no eye contact. Even in a show she can't emote at all.

 

[R.D.]

I'm not sure what piece she did at this year's SOI, but that hasn't been my experience with her live at all.

 

[mskater93]

Apparently the relationship was just not working out. She went to work with Zueva for a bit before going to Frank. I cannot confirm but a lot of people on the forum have mentioned that her personality didn't work that well with his domineering and loud Russian personality.

I would describe it more as someone was starting to grow up and find her voice which didn't mesh well with the expectations of the coach

 

[Skater Boy]

Skating for ladies in the US is looking great. Ashley is confident, refined with solid programs that she has learned to sell. Gracie - well we know if she skates well she is the next world champion - the judges love her and she has amazing jumps when on. Polina is consistent and growing and Mirai is I agree on the upswing - but the key for her is rotations and consistency. I am curious to see what Angela Wang, Courtney Hicks and the rest will bring to the table as well - of course I would love a Cinderella story with Caroline Zhang but I don't think that will happen unless she makes a remarkable recovery and gets some great coaching to deal with her jumps and speed AND she has to regain her spins. Thankfully the Russians and Japanese can only have 3 ladies at Worlds and when you consider that the US is looking very strong.

 

[Jammers]

The US is lacking young promising skaters to take Gracie and Ashley's place in two years. Polina needs a lot of work to be a contender Karen Chen's skating is frantic and inconsistent and i don't see any other skater under the age of 16 that has a lot of promise. Maybe Vivian Le will take her skating to a new level soon we can only hope otherwise it's going to be looking bleak post 2018 and it will be back to two spots at Worlds.

 

[brightphoton]

of course I would love a Cinderella story with Caroline Zhang

:yes2: yes, please, I would love that too

 

[temadd]

The US is lacking young promising skaters to take Gracie and Ashley's place in two years. Polina needs a lot of work to be a contender Karen Chen's skating is frantic and inconsistent and i don't see any other skater under the age of 16 that has a lot of promise. Maybe Vivian Le will take her skating to a new level soon we can only hope otherwise it's going to be looking bleak post 2018 and it will be back to two spots at Worlds.

I have faith that Polina will work out her UR issues and be a top contender. You can never write off a skater like her with nerves of steel.

Other than Polina I think Tyler Pierce is the most promising. She has a solid 3-3 and showed better ability to perfom under pressure than Chen and Le. Bradie Tennell is also promising (good at nationals ) but folded under pressure at junoir worlds.